Siegfried changes from SC3 to SC4

[Stryker]

My list to change Siegfried from mid to top:

1.- B+K auto GI will GI any mid... body or weapon attack.
2.- An horizontal UB new move.
3.- aG:A will be GB and open the enemy for 6K guarranted.
4.- 4K will KND and !W on NH.
5.- BT BB change to standard face to the opponent move as a BbgB.
6.- SSH A will be high and SSH 2AA low as in SC3.
7.- 3KKB will be guaranteed on CH.
8.- 1B can be charged for a GB version.
9.- In SCH you can run like SC2's Night.
10.- B4 can be charge as SCH B.

This is how make a character reach to top without get broken.

-Stryker-

 

[Sacharja]

Ah wishful thinking, how I love thee.
Well, if I had to wish for something, it would be bringing back the 66KB, Flapjack and B+K from SC3. Sieg is a really solid character as he is right now imo, but those 3 would augment his gameplay nicely.

 

[Jink]

Jink Every one of your suggestions would make Seig a more powerful character. Does this mean you think he is under powered atm? I mean this is what you would currently change about him yeah? SSH'[A+B] to end in RSH to set range mixups and SC3's BT-B+K from ground at anytime when laying down 'face-down-foot-towards' and 'face-up-head-towards' sound a little broken.

Nah, I don't have problems with Sig in SC4 besides RSH'A. Its just that I would love to do those things in battle. I play SC4, but I never got off from SC2's large freedom of improvising with lots of cancels and many different moves-routs.
BT-GI from ground was doable, but in SC4, it can only be done after 44K, and by ending up in BT after getting hit during any twirling move. Very limited use.
I don't think Sig is under-powered. But then again, Mitsu has his "win-by-it-self" 1A.

My list to change Siegfried from mid to top:
1.- B+K auto GI will GI any mid... body or weapon attack.
2.- An horizontal UB new move.
3.- aG:A will be GB and open the enemy for 6K guarranted.
4.- 4K will KND and !W without CH.
5.- BT BB change to standard face to the opponent move as a BgB.\
6.- SSH A will be high and SSH 2AA low as in SC3.
7.- 3KKB will be guaranteed on CH.
8.- 1B can be charged for a GB version.
9.- In SCH you can run like SC2's Night.
10.- B4 can be charge as SCH B.
This is how make a character reach to top without get broken.
-Stryker-

1. Agreed
2. Agreed
3. With this, I could make Sig broken, my agA consistency is at 9/10. Wuahahahaa... agA~6K, agA~6K... = slow death, or a Mid's fest.
4. Agreed, but on close hit. I think at far range 4K knocking w/o CHit could be broken. We have 6B for that.
5. His BT-B in SoulBlade was the best.
6. I've done a SSH'A like-High while my sword sparring time. I do like it Sig's SCH'Run+A from SC2.
7. I would just take away this move for good. In SC2, Sig's 4K[ K ] with optional 8_2 into SCH was DA sh1t.
8. .....
9. Agreed.
10. I would like better that the b:4 JF input made the move faster.

Ah wishful thinking, how I love thee.
Well, if I had to wish for something, it would be bringing back the 66KB, Flapjack and B+K from SC3. Sieg is a really solid character as he is right now imo, but those 3 would augment his gameplay nicely.

66KB as of the shoulder bump, followed by a WS'B animation and effects, could be sweet.

 

[endnow]

seems to be a fashion I guess il give a list :).

1. More mobiliy during stances that arent SBH like in SC2. Look at Mitsu's stances he can move back, foward he can duck, jump and in Relic GI. Why shouldnt seig be able to do at least a could of these things? When i change into SSH because the input is 4b+k it puts me too far away from my opponent to use SSH A+B so with more mobility You could move up to a guarding oponent and let the mix ups begin.
2. A hard to see low outside of stance with a easy input. I dont know about the rest of you but i cant a+k2a everytime so against my more regular opponents they tend to not duck very often when im outside of stance.
3. 3kkb guaranteed on ch or remove the kb and just leave it as a single fast mid kick.
4. Make SRSH a 0 frames on block so SBH k can be used as a follow up for some mix up potential. Its not perfect but can we at least get some kinda use for the move!?.
5. make ag[a] +2 on block just like normal agA. This combined with my suggestion for extra mobility while in stance would mean than Seig while in SRSH could move forward and throw out a mixup thus there would be a reason to use ag[a]. Atm the move is as redundant as SRSH A Because if the agA hits your too far away to throw out any moves from SRSH and if its blocked your opponent is at +8. Its kinda funny watching Seig do a extra twirl though.
6. b6 can do a little more damage on CH. Its only 1 frame less than 3b and has the same range. Maybe do 30-35 dmg on ch?

Some things I dissagree with:
1. Changing b4 or ib4 to make it quicker. TBH I havent got a problem with this move at all, its a soul crushing move thats used as a tech trap with SRSH b and is a very good post-GI move.
2. agA gb for 6k guaranteed does sound a little broken. The move isnt that hard to pull off and is very difficult to duck on reflex.

 

[Stryker]

Stance roullete system is very improved in SC4, but other stance systems are really broken! like Kilik 236 and 214 series... auto GI for horizontals and verticals and a great guessing game; Amy B+K can GI any mid and her A+B can GI any Horizontal and a very broken guessing game; Mitsurugi have the best stances in the game: relic and mist; in any stance he can duck, jump, dash or retreat and his guessing game have some safe moves that even gave him a real frame advantage... without stance is just Mitsurugi... in any stance is Super Mitsurugi Dono...

If Namco give Siegfried a running SCH plus an horizontal mid to low running attack (SCH>running A for example) it would be a great add... when the opponents are so far they start to duck so SCH A+B can't help me... Siegfried is a beast IMO but incomplete when have to face a strong opponent with an strongest character... the only way to improve Siegfried is to complete his stance game... its too easy for any opponent after get the timing to GI any Siegfried good Soul Crush move to just wait and punish killing any option to try the "safe" method...

I have really good times using Siegfried, but when I pick another character, like Kilik for example, its too easy change from an offensive to defensive mode, change from safe to unsafe mode, and abuse of a lot of moves without worrying about punishment... its to easy to pull the moves, even buffering doesn't bother me at all...

Namco did a great job with the game, but we need just a little to fix the delicate balance of this game.

-Stryker-

 

[Jink]

If Namco give Siegfried a running SCH plus an horizontal mid to low running attack (SCH>running A for example) it would be a great add... when the opponents are so far they start to duck so SCH A+B can't help me... Siegfried is a beast IMO but incomplete when have to face a strong opponent with an strongest character... the only way to improve Siegfried is to complete his stance game... its too easy for any opponent after get the timing to GI any Siegfried good Soul Crush move to just wait and punish killing any option to try the "safe" method...
-Stryker-

I use SCH'k[ B ] at long range for that, and I tend to CHit opponents, whom I can clearly see ducking after they see the k whiffing, but they might think is the windup of SCH'A+B. The good thing is that no matter if CHit at tip range, opponents can still get hit by SBH'K or SBH'B.

I hate Kilik's 66AA, not because of the move's properties, but because it just looks like a double sword swing that Sig could have had. I bet Sig was going to have it in the first place.
===

Another good change would be Sig Bs sequences:
1. Sig should have BB from SC2, but in a way that looked a bit like a B2A for MixUp string possibilities.
2. Old BBB could be placed as b6BB, and Sig be able to b6[ B ] to end in SBH. The animation could be b6 followed by Nig's 3rd B of his BBB, then classic 3rd B of Sig's BBB. On counter hit, b6B would not combo. The 2nd [ B ] could combo into SBH'K on CHit.

 

[Heaton]

2. Old BBB could be placed as b6BB, and Sig be able to b6[ B ] to end in SBH. The animation could be b6 followed by Nig's 3rd B of his BBB, then classic 3rd B of Sig's BBB. On counter hit, b6B would not combo. The 2nd [ B ] could combo into SBH'K on CHit.

Sounds like his old bgB.

 

[Slayer_X64]

my improved moves list 4 siggy(trying not to over power him too much here...):

1. SC3 SRSH A.
2. SC3 SCH A+B back and the new move to SCH A+K.
3. 66KB_A mixup.
4. 22_88A to be a faster mid than wat it is now. maybe improve it to b a mid horizontal slash instead.
5. 3KKB garaunteed on CH.
6. 4K close range KND on normal hit.
7. ag[A] SRSH transfer to be quicker so its more useful
8. more useful B type attack. maybe SC2 BB.
9. 4B+K in SSH, but no running.
10. make the second hit of 22_88KK/A+KK chargable.

@ stryker
-i wouldnt say kiliks 214_236 are all that over powered, but u definately need to play smart to beat him.

-try playing anti amy by playing more safe, stepping more, and watching for her pary's so u can attempt to CH after the parry GI is over. dont bother with moves like 3B on her, or try many stance mixups or u'll b eating 6BB all day. tip range 22 can be great for baiting her 6BB into SSH A+B. 6K, 4A, 1K, 2A, 3K, 3A, and agA r ur best friends. tho i think sum of her stuf shud b nerfed a little, its tolerable.

 

[Stryker]

@ stryker
-i wouldnt say kiliks 214_236 are all that over powered, but u definately need to play smart to beat him.

-try playing anti amy by playing more safe, stepping more, and watching for her pary's so u can attempt to CH after the parry GI is over. dont bother with moves like 3B on her, or try many stance mixups or u'll b eating 6BB all day. tip range 22 can be great for baiting her 6BB into SSH A+B. 6K, 4A, 1K, 2A, 3K, 3A, and agA r ur best friends. tho i think sum of her stuf shud b nerfed a little, its tolerable.

All the characters in this game have to give the player a felling of "No restriction", so you don't have to be like a wall waiting and watching the opponent to come at you with an attack. The only thing I like to improve in this game is the level of options available for every character. I'm playing Tekken 6 right now, with a hard to learn character, JIN KAZAMA, and all its moves have a time and a purpose to make the character reliable and always changing its play_style. In my opinion Kilik's 214_236 are not over powered, but those moves really give him an entire new level of options to attack and defense, which is the number one difference against the other characters.

-Stryker-