The future of Soul Calibur
- Thread starter UnseenWombat
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AVNjonnitti
Hot Dog
i dont really agree with that. i see that now GIs are more a way of forcing your opponent to decide whether to use meter or try to force them to waste it by baiting out a GI. reading your opponent's moves lies more in JGs instead. also, you cant GI out of an NC on hit so i dont see why you would think of it as a combo breaker.
i honestly think a lot of what you said isnt necessarily a valid pro or con. most of the stuff you brought up they dont HAVE to go in a certain direction in order to do. bringing back the old GI (which im certainly not in favor of doing) they dont have to make sc6 or soul edge 2 or a whole reboot in order to bring that back, they can do that in any title. also, people's mains returning, some people would also lose their mains. peole who started with SC5 and mained ZWEI, pat, viola or something like that would also lose theirs, even so, they can put their moveset into a different character in order to have them return. it was all just an issue of time if feel why some people lost their mains. they just legitimately didnt have time to put this game out. personally, i feel that they should come out with a soul calibur 5: dark resurrection type thing where it would continue the story, add more single and multiplayer player modes such as one a la weapon master mode or conquest mode, team battle and all sorts of bullshit there used to be, flesh out characters and fix up all this god damn viola drama, add in old fighting styles and add a few new ones, and add more CAS options and such.
personally, i think a lot of the reason why soul calibur 5 did poorly is because honestly, to a casual gamer, its a hard sell. the single player mode is bad and short, which to me, since i first played SC1 and 2 as a kid, i invested hours upon hours into the single player modes, which was the reaosn i bought sc5 in the first place, not expecting to fall in love with the new fighting system. also, there is no formal tutorial, which for fighting games these days, it's pretty much a set standard and most of the training mode options to people, they wont understand unless they look it up online. most people would just say "fuck it, this game doesnt teach me how to play" and honestly, something as simple as a trial mode could help people stay interested. i honeslty think if project soul had more time to work on this game and it got proper promotion then it would sell much better. as for now, the future of soul calibur looks pretty bleak as far as them making a new one.
also as for the community, tournament entrants have been very low as of late. i remember hearing on one of jaxel say on one of his streams something along the lines of "right now there are more people than ever on 8wr but tournament entrants are half of what they were in sc4". to me thats really sad, and i know im generally not one to talk because the only tournaments that come by me are jaxeldome, which for some reason ALWAYS land on days that i can't go which really bothers me, and bar battles, which i cant stay the full time because im 19 and i dont want to use a fake id because if feel if they find out it's fake that not only will i lose my fake and be out of state, i feel that it gives the community a bad name. also i cant drag one of my parents or my brother out with me so i can stay the whole time. but the occasion that there is a tournament outside of those two, there usually isnt enough people to have a tournament. salty battles sc5 happened only like 3 times. 2 of them i was at. after that i had summer classes and was planning on returning afterwards, but calibur had to stop because a lack of interst. also kayane came out after bar battles and was the ONLY player for soul calibur and shes not even from this god damn country. i felt really bad because i was planning on making it out but i had a paper due the next day and i was honestly really mad, because i'm legitimately hungry in this game and that was a great opportunity to play someone from another area who has a different playstyle as me that i can learn from. also, i went to anoher tournament like 2 weeks ago and i was the ONLY person who came for soul calibur. so there is clearly something wrong here. which can be the following:
1. netcode is too good that you dont have to go out of your house to play good players.
2. the community doesnt have an interest in tournaments
3. most tournament players aren't interested in soul calibur (as in players of another fighting game)
personally, i think something needs to be done to increase interest in the game. as i noticed, im the only person that i know for sure in my area that started playing calibur with sc5. everyone is either OG or at least came in during SC4. there is very little new blood as far as the tourament scene goes. i think that there should be someone to step up and try to hype things up kind of like what mike ross and gootecks do with cross counter or yipes just being himself and getting people hyped up. also it would be cool if someone did maximillian type shit where they would try to cater towards new players to get them interested in the game. i just feel overall there needs to be someone who represents the soul calibur scene, which i personally feel there is no "face" of the soul calibur community. sure there are people that do a lot, but there is no one person that when you think of soul calibur, no matter what game you play you think of that person, like how as i said early mike ross and gootecks represent the capcom scene. im not saying that there aren't people who represent us, im saying that more needs to be done in order to get more attention.
- end rant
MKHSpartan
[12] Conqueror
GI in this game are rather irritating in the way the cover high, mid and low simultaneously. I find them particularly irritating if I am playing Maxi and they use it to kill my stance mix-ups (yes I know I can loop further and I do sometimes but it is risky as fuck).
AVNjonnitti
Hot Dog
sure it is annoying but if it uses meter it's not for free, i dont see anything wrong with that. kind of like how in arcana heart 3 you can use meter to punish moves that would normally be safe.
MKHSpartan
[12] Conqueror
"Cough cough" Patroklos makes the meter back after a guard impact "cough".
AVNjonnitti
Hot Dog
i honestly find that to be more of a character flaw than a game system flaw. also something that i've felt should be patched along with the range of his CE's ring out. the general idea of it i dont see a problem with. if that combo didnt give you as much meter i dont think it would be an issue. also, off the top of my head this is the only example of free GIs that i can think of.
MKHSpartan
[12] Conqueror
Even if it is thought to be needed to be patched out unfortunately it is still there and it still annoys me. Mitsu annoys me with his retarded 4B but ignoring it just lets me get smacked in the face lol.
But yes I see your point. I'm just getting more irritated with this just guard system being to "safe/risk-free" which makes me begin to want the old GI system back.
AVNjonnitti
Hot Dog
personally, i think there should be a window where you cant block after attempting a JG so its less safe/risk-free and then we can start going on with more mind games in baiting out JGs and such, now that would be fucking awesome.
MKHSpartan
[12] Conqueror
Yes that is better because you can punish a whiffed impact in every game but you can't punish a just guard it's a bit irritating when people just keep guessing with it. And yes I know to grab but it's hard when your grabs do shit damage and your opponent is good at grab breaks.
ZeroBeat
January 6th
not being able to block after a failed JG is like whiffing a GI. you might as well remove JG all together of thats how you want it. i say remove JG and keep the GI system like it is now.
Captain_Insano
[10] Knight
Anyone here play Blazblue Continuuum Shift? Well there's an extensive tutorial mode that covers basic offensive and defensive strategies, meter use and advanced game mechanics as well as strategies for specific characters. I know it might be a little much to ask for at this point, but I hope in the next iteration of SC, there's a tutorial mode that covers stuff like basic strategy, what frame advantage is, etc. I think it could help ease new players into the game and garner more support from the casual crowd. It might even help some casuals cross over to the hardcore scene.
damn-I-Suck
[12] Conqueror
TBH I wish the movesets were a little longer for some of the characters. It just seems like with the shorter move lists, and the way combo's work in this game, it really has come down everyone playing almost the same way. We all use the same setups, the same combos, and stick to the same BnB moves.
People may say what they want about sc2, step guard was broken, X was broken, etc. But you know what? You could Air control out of a hell of a lot more in that game, wall combo's weren't overboard like they are now, they had while landing moves, almost everyone was viable.
And apparently, which for some reason I had forgotten until now, you could soul charge while in 8wr state. Am I remembering this wrong or did they take away the option to SC during 8wr in sc3?
I popped sc2 in my ps2 just for nostalgia the other day. Man! It's fast, fluid, evasive, and not combo centric like the newer Soul Calibur games. And holy crap Nightmare had some stance moves I had forgotten about. Trying to remember how I played back then, I know now that there were a ton of moves I never used. Maybe they had a point in reducing movesets over the years, but perhaps they took it too far in sc5 with some of the characters. Sieg needs his A+B moves from stance back!
People may say what they want about sc2, step guard was broken, X was broken, etc. But you know what? You could Air control out of a hell of a lot more in that game, wall combo's weren't overboard like they are now, they had while landing moves, almost everyone was viable.
And apparently, which for some reason I had forgotten until now, you could soul charge while in 8wr state. Am I remembering this wrong or did they take away the option to SC during 8wr in sc3?
I popped sc2 in my ps2 just for nostalgia the other day. Man! It's fast, fluid, evasive, and not combo centric like the newer Soul Calibur games. And holy crap Nightmare had some stance moves I had forgotten about. Trying to remember how I played back then, I know now that there were a ton of moves I never used. Maybe they had a point in reducing movesets over the years, but perhaps they took it too far in sc5 with some of the characters. Sieg needs his A+B moves from stance back!
ChaosK
[13] Hero
In sc2 Nightmare and Siegfried was the same character. Now his moves are split between the two of them.
damn-I-Suck
[12] Conqueror
Well yeah you're right, but most of the characters lost moves. Splitting the character in 2 wasn't necessarily the reason for this reduction, as they both got new stuff in sc3
ShaolinTiger86
[13] Hero
SC2 was a game where one simple mistake and it was your behind. This was a game that was so simple yet complex when you had to break it down step by step, move for move, etc. This is why I love SC2.
Pyrrus
[14] Master
You all know you could do a wall infinite with characters like Sophitia in SC2?
I did it with my bro's all the time xD;; 66k ftw!!
I did it with my bro's all the time xD;; 66k ftw!!
AVNjonnitti
Hot Dog
i feel that this is part of the reason why a lot of people said fuck it after the first month. people dont want to figure out on their own basic strategies and bullshit coming from 2d to 3d, especially because right now 2d games are MUCH more popular than 3d.
i strongly disagree. this is for any fighting game, each person SHOULD have their own interpretation of a move list. people are just less creative because they see something that they know is good and stick with it instead of looking for stuff that people have never seen before. there are so many people trying to copy what their favorite player does verbatim instead of developing their own style. personally, i came from capcom to this and i didnt really know much about calibur. i just kept playing and playing and trying out different things in order to find out how to0 play my character the best. theres a lot of things that i see people who play my character do that i dont do and things that i do that they dont do.
for example of guile has the same damn 2 special moves since 1990, then he should play the same way since 1990, however there have been people like DaggerG who have shown that guile doesnt have to be played so defensively. sure its an example from a different game but it still applies to any other. if anything, i feel a smaller move list FORCES you to be more creative because you have less to work with. other players should know the common setups work. as far as combos go, i really dont think it matters. just go to a handful that you feel comfortable with that does damage taht you're willing to do and choose which one works best in that situation. thats what i do in very game i play. i always looked at 3d games not even being about combos, but instead mindgames, which is why i dont see people using similar combos so much as an issue.
yes but the thing about GI is it also adds another layer to meter management. forcing someone to have to decide whether or not to use meter is just another layer of mind games. this hypethetical JG that im talking about doesn't use meter, is a little safer, but can still be baited out if gotten too predictable. as far as a window of not being able to block goes, i was thinking something small like 8 frames or possibly if you mistime it too early you still get hit instead of getting G anyway.
jtdam09
[13] Hero
damn-I-Suck
[12] Conqueror
More moves=more options=more creativity.
Having too few moves to choose from just makes you predictable, NOT creative.
Think of spamming but on a lesser scale.
Having too few moves to choose from just makes you predictable, NOT creative.
Think of spamming but on a lesser scale.
DevilsDisguise
[13] Hero
Longer lists = More skill required = better players = better matches.
More stances = More options = More "warrior like" = more depth.
Their worst mistake was simplifying the characters just to attract noobs. SC isnt that hard to learn, you just have to know when to do certain things, practice and find a main.
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