- Moderator
- #41
Ring
Lay still now
Then I guess I have no choice but to get on your level before I can state any opinions here.
[ARCHIVE] Siegfried Pre-Release Discussion
- Thread starter Windstar
- Start date
- Status
Slayer_X64
Siegfried SA Moderator
lol well maybe so, but us siegfried mainers will make sure to stomp them under our boots! ^_~ you can't beat the real thing!
Fixed.
- Moderator
- #44
Ring
Lay still now
Get your facts straight. Manly players only pick Ivy because they have enough manliness to control the bitch.
Sacharja
[12] Conqueror
I will admit Ivy is also pretty manly. She probably shaves and has a penus, too.
Pantocrator
[10] Knight
Hahaha. People already complain about a character, about a demo...
Just wait to PLAY SERIOUSLY the game before.
When I won a tournament, that was just a knowledge issue. When people will be more used to play against this character it won't be the same. When Akire won the french major tournament that was a broken\cheap issue. Pocket Siegfrieds are just in your dream, 3B is not spammable. Even on block it's not safe (especially against a lot of CE), on whiff it's catastrophic. I already lost a lot of rounds because I abused of my 3B. SCH K is linear, and after a step now every character do HUGE damage. Defensive mix up = risk. Risky stuff is not SAFE.
I'm sure that Mitsurugi , Maxi and Patroclos are stronger by example. Siegfried is not broken, strong at least, and less than Ivy on my point of view. I guess it's already too much ? If Namco realize your Siegfriednerfantasm, the character will just become weak and almost useless. Be serious guys, this game is supposed to be balanced, so Siegfried has to be far stronger than in SC4. Just wait to test and play more.
Just wait to PLAY SERIOUSLY the game before.
When I won a tournament, that was just a knowledge issue. When people will be more used to play against this character it won't be the same. When Akire won the french major tournament that was a broken\cheap issue. Pocket Siegfrieds are just in your dream, 3B is not spammable. Even on block it's not safe (especially against a lot of CE), on whiff it's catastrophic. I already lost a lot of rounds because I abused of my 3B. SCH K is linear, and after a step now every character do HUGE damage. Defensive mix up = risk. Risky stuff is not SAFE.
I'm sure that Mitsurugi , Maxi and Patroclos are stronger by example. Siegfried is not broken, strong at least, and less than Ivy on my point of view. I guess it's already too much ? If Namco realize your Siegfriednerfantasm, the character will just become weak and almost useless. Be serious guys, this game is supposed to be balanced, so Siegfried has to be far stronger than in SC4. Just wait to test and play more.
When I said psuedo safe, I meant that its an improvement on eating garunteed damage if 3B is blocked at close range - when I say defensive mixup, I mean like Xianghua's 44B_44B[4], you have an oppertunity to turn a punish into a 50:50. All I meant is that it seems better than SCIV on block. =/
Sacharja
[12] Conqueror
It takes a little more than high damage and an almost safe launcher with range to make a character overpowered. Globally speaking, Sieg doesn't seem all that imbalanced at the moment, although he is definitely one of the stronger picks around. What Namco should be focusing on is bringing weaker characters (LOLRAPH) up to his level. As a character with distinct strengths and weaknesses in the manner of SCV Sieg is a lot closer to ideal design than most of what they have been producing over the years. If it turns out that he is still too strong after the game is out and has seen a few tourneys, Namco can still make adjustments. But his core flaws will prevent him entry to the realm of SC3 X/Soph, Hilde & Co. either way.
PS: And let's not forget he "has no mix-ups".
PS: And let's not forget he "has no mix-ups".
Jink
[10] Knight
I just noticed.. In the Maxi vs Sig vid, Sig last 3B hits Maxi while he was about to QuickStep, I can the wind effect just as the 3b hits Maxi. Now I wander, how efficient is this new QuickStep..? -_-
To me, Virtua Fighte DM step system is still the best, Project Soul should reeeeaaalllyy looking into VF's dodging system.
I want a LEGIT & RELIABLE step in SC5!!! >_<
Fuck, even SC2's AvoidingStep would have not gotten hit like that. Project Soul, please fix it so it works & pays-off for decision & not by random odds, PLEASE!!! >_<
QuickStep should make character's untouchable by Verticals (linear or one-side) instantly upon input. VF's DM system works GREAT! Why SoulCalibur's shouldn't work as great?
XVictoryPeaceX
[09] Warrior
i don't like this complaining about 3B being broken or overpowered; especially from Ivy players. I think it's high time siegfried had somthing REALLY good under his belt unlike SRSH A: man how useless was that?
Nightblade
is SUPERCHARGED!!
After playing SCV Sieg, I am VERY happy with the way he's looking now. After hearing from Daishi that 3b, SCH k BE will not be air controllable, I think he will be super solid.
On the subject of him being broken?... No. 3b is GOOD now. It hasn't been legitimately good, ever. It was either free punish/mixup for the opponent, or barely safe because of a glitch. Post 3b is now a mixup that can go in either direction. I think that's the situation the dev's seem to be trying to create all around in this game: good mixup opportunities without going overboard. Having played Sieg since SC1, I'm glad I can finally play him without saying "Ah, at minus frames again..."
Okay okay. I admit, his damage is looking pretty ridiculous. Especially is SCH B Clean Hits. Wow. Still, even if they nerfed that, I expect it would only be by 10 dmg or so. It IS a Zweihander, after all. >.>
But seriously, I am glad that he's looking solid. It seems, though, that JG will be the answer to some of his good stuff, which I'm okay with. All around, though, he seems to have more answers, and more useful moves - which he needed.
On the subject of him being broken?... No. 3b is GOOD now. It hasn't been legitimately good, ever. It was either free punish/mixup for the opponent, or barely safe because of a glitch. Post 3b is now a mixup that can go in either direction. I think that's the situation the dev's seem to be trying to create all around in this game: good mixup opportunities without going overboard. Having played Sieg since SC1, I'm glad I can finally play him without saying "Ah, at minus frames again..."
Okay okay. I admit, his damage is looking pretty ridiculous. Especially is SCH B Clean Hits. Wow. Still, even if they nerfed that, I expect it would only be by 10 dmg or so. It IS a Zweihander, after all. >.>
But seriously, I am glad that he's looking solid. It seems, though, that JG will be the answer to some of his good stuff, which I'm okay with. All around, though, he seems to have more answers, and more useful moves - which he needed.
SCIV Sieg 3B bad?
How many other characters had a move that could punish -17 at range, or have a launcher that broke the soul guage in 13, tech crouched, gives almost 70 damage + heavy duty fwd RO potential on CH that was safe vs. most of the cast at range and was only punishable upwards of 35 damage by very few characters?
If that's not a good move, then I don't know what is. Its not overpowered, but its good.
SCV Sieg 3B?
Honestly, I would have been fine with 3B staying effectively -15 on block - but NOW the fun begins =D.
The thing I notice with a lot of players is that people see a move is unsafe and immediately think 'useless' or something akin. But the simple fact is, for a tech crouching ranged RO causing launcher, nobody compares to Siegfried - and now its safe(ish) ^^.
SCIV 3B was GOOD already, now its fucking AMAZING - more reward, less risk on an already infamous move. HELLS YEAH!!!
How many other characters had a move that could punish -17 at range, or have a launcher that broke the soul guage in 13, tech crouched, gives almost 70 damage + heavy duty fwd RO potential on CH that was safe vs. most of the cast at range and was only punishable upwards of 35 damage by very few characters?
If that's not a good move, then I don't know what is. Its not overpowered, but its good.
SCV Sieg 3B?
Honestly, I would have been fine with 3B staying effectively -15 on block - but NOW the fun begins =D.
The thing I notice with a lot of players is that people see a move is unsafe and immediately think 'useless' or something akin. But the simple fact is, for a tech crouching ranged RO causing launcher, nobody compares to Siegfried - and now its safe(ish) ^^.
SCIV 3B was GOOD already, now its fucking AMAZING - more reward, less risk on an already infamous move. HELLS YEAH!!!
Bastet
[12] Conqueror
Awesome! Now that 3B won't be air controlled we might be able to do this: 3B ~ CE
- Moderator
- #54
Ring
Lay still now
Wait, you can't air control out of SCH K BE or you can't air control after SCH K BE?
- Moderator
- #56
Ring
Lay still now
Bastet
[12] Conqueror
I really hope we'll be able to do this... WE MUST HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO DO THIS :P
For some reason I like it... I really hope they'll fix that once the game comes out, or at least let us connect his CE after the lauch of SBH B
For some reason I like it... I really hope they'll fix that once the game comes out, or at least let us connect his CE after the lauch of SBH B
- Moderator
- #58
Heaton
A Soul in the Purgatory
3(B) ~ SCH k(BE) ~ JagA ~ W! ~ 3(B) ~ W! ~ SCH k(BE) ~ CE ~ 44K
Full meter wall combos. Eat your heart out.
Full meter wall combos. Eat your heart out.
Signia
[13] Hero
Synraii you're severely overrating SCIV 3B. SCV 3B is a significant buff.
SCIV 3B had a deceptively SHORT effective range due it not launching at "tip" range, which covered like the last 1/3 section of the move. On hit, at tip range he's like +0 in SCH.
Also, it TC'd early, not late. A late TC helps at advantage, where your moves are too slow to beat fast highs. For Siegfried that occurs often. 3B's TC is disfunctional at small advantages for this reason.
3B as a punish is subpar, especially "at range" where it'll only launch at the tip. 45 damage max from -17 is well below average, and I'm not just saying that because I main Sophie, I maximize my punishes with every character. You're better off doing a+k(A)KK if you're standing or WR (B)B (that's i17 right?) if crouching.
In the metagame everyone seemed to punish the move consistently, which was unfortunate.
SCIV 3B was "not bad."
SCV NH 3(B) K$ sounds crazy. I was hoping that change was intentional, so that BE would only connect on CH SCH K. Siegfried looks like a pretty good option right now.
SCIV 3B had a deceptively SHORT effective range due it not launching at "tip" range, which covered like the last 1/3 section of the move. On hit, at tip range he's like +0 in SCH.
Also, it TC'd early, not late. A late TC helps at advantage, where your moves are too slow to beat fast highs. For Siegfried that occurs often. 3B's TC is disfunctional at small advantages for this reason.
3B as a punish is subpar, especially "at range" where it'll only launch at the tip. 45 damage max from -17 is well below average, and I'm not just saying that because I main Sophie, I maximize my punishes with every character. You're better off doing a+k(A)KK if you're standing or WR (B)B (that's i17 right?) if crouching.
In the metagame everyone seemed to punish the move consistently, which was unfortunate.
SCIV 3B was "not bad."
SCV NH 3(B) K$ sounds crazy. I was hoping that change was intentional, so that BE would only connect on CH SCH K. Siegfried looks like a pretty good option right now.
- Status