Astaroth Matchup

F

Frog3frog3

[08] Mercenary
any tips on how to beat good astaroths? i cant really punish anything.

i find i have to play footsies at midrange but he can just block 1a and 3aa. if i get close its grab/headbutt city and at long range you just cant do anything

seems like a plain old bad matchup if you ask me
 
Astaroth has always been tough for NM (since SC3 at least). I don't actually have any advice yet as I haven't played vs one yet or done any testing (in this game anyway). This thread is now linked from the matchup reference guide
 
Astaroth is the same annoying story. I would know since I play him.

Zoning. You're not facing one of those pesky rushdown monkeys. So this is a battle of long distance and whiff punishing from nightmare's part. He's zoning tools are good, but yours are faster.

3AA
1A
44A
33BBE
and such

Patience while looking for opportunities. Up close he will eat your dinner.
 
KingAce said:
Astaroth is the same annoying story. I would know since I play him.

Zoning. You're not facing one of those pesky rushdown monkeys. So this is a battle of long distance and whiff punishing from nightmare's part. He's zoning tools are good, but yours are faster.

3AA
1A
44A
33BBE
and such

Patience while looking for opportunities. Up close he will eat your dinner.
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I gotta agree with you here. Fought a good astorath an hour ago. I tried to fight him up close and got DEMOLISHED for it.
 
well as I feared, due to the nerfage of the GS A auto GI bullrush is now totally free from a blocked WR (B) as long as he does it immediately. sucks
 
His horizontal circle sweep followed by the over head is punishable with 22_88 B. I would think NM 66B+K would punish the double sweep. But I will have to test this to confirm
 
Ok the punishment for the second sweep is 8B the jumping horizontal input it right after the first hit and you should clear it

Edit: on the over head you can side step and 8 way run into 66A6 GSK BE if you got the gauge. He can't block after if your fast enough

You can also get the 88K 4K BE with just frame for 101 damage. Gonna see if he has any attacks that save him cuz guarding after wont help astra

Ok it looks like he can't save himself from the punishment of his sweep attack without stopping the last hit. Also if your have trouble knowing such attack if coming seconds you can hit 8Kleft on both versions. The kick will only hit the overhead attack and take you out of danger on the second sweep attack
 
thanks so much for the 22_88B advice, helps the matchup a lot.

are you saying that if you block the first hit of the sweep and see another low sweep coming, you can do 8B to punish? i havent tested but it seems like you would need to be really close and would get pushed too far back a lot
 
It works it has surprisingly good range because it is a full extended vertical attack . Also don't let h close to you he is way more dangerous when in throwing range
 
thanks for finding this out; this was probably known in 4 but i never played it much since nightmare had a terrible design
 
I'm having probably with his 5 (neutral) A+B (at least, I think that's the input). I can block it but it seems like he can spam it all day and I can't punish him in any way.
 
Your best bet is to attempt to predict linear verticals like his 22_88B and punish with your own 22_88B. Like said above, you have to keep yourself at range with him. Find openings and whiff punish with 3B NSS b:A. Make him afraid to step with tools like 6A, agA and 22_88AA (cancellable into GS, you can use GS's potential for amazing mixups). Use 4A from a distance and on hit, follow up with 4KBE:B for crazy damage.
 
Asty's one of the characters that can pretty easily punish 3AA if it isn't blocked at the very tip, so be careful with it. NM still has inherently strong movement, so stepping bullrush isn't excessively difficuly for him (And punishing the second part of EX bullrush by stepping is easy as fuck for him). If Asty wants to play the mid-range game then good, careful movement and well placed BBs/3Ks are your best friends imho. Bullrush >>> agA and it's faster than 44A and 22A, so making him afraid of being dumb with it (Or just plain fucking his shit up if they're stubborn) with good pokes and whiff punishment takes priority for me.

Against shitty dumb Astaroths that use 1A "mixups" just look closely for the second vert or hori. For the former step, for the latter jump while holding guard (Don't worry about doing it too late) and punish with 3B, it's easier than it sounds... at least offline lol. This is definitely an irritating matchup, their mid range games feel about even, but Astaroth can troll the shit out of NM close range for higher damage output to boot.
 
After 33b BE b, 66b Asta does a little relaunch. During launch if fast enough u get free back throw attempt. Sometimes it makes it a side throw. Only works on Asta.
 
Second hit 66B BE can be right stepped : 3B > NSS bA free

Damn, I realized Bullrush >>> All stances options :(
 
This match is really very much about spacing and getting out of the way of dat ayyux lol. Thank god Bullrush is steppable now, in 4 it was much more of an issue to deal with. If you see the rush coming, sidestep and raep as underlined above, nothing new there. If you are able to pop your CE very fast, it makes a great punisher for the second hit of the stupid 1(A) A_B "mixup", feels good to stuff with big damage. Also keep in mind his more damaging throws tend to be the B throws, so if you know beyond a shadow of a doubt the throw is coming, mash b if it's too late to avoid it altogether. Most people have a bad habit to use B+G more with any given character anyway, with the exception of RO throws. Just mah 2 cents.
 
Zekki said:
This match is really very much about spacing and getting out of the way of dat ayyux lol. Thank god Bullrush is steppable now, in 4 it was much more of an issue to deal with.
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Be careful with the fully charged version. The hitboxes on that thing are huge. I've seen people get hit while fully perpendicular to the bullrush. This may be a situation where a quickstep followed by a down/back 8wayrun would be the best way to avoid it, rather than stepping on its own.
 
I got lucky during a tournament a while ago and semi-accidently found out that 3AA can stop BE bull rush. Normally hitting him doesn't help much since the second rush still hits you, but apparently the timing of 3AA is just right to stop that shit. Haven't tried it since (none of my friends play Astaroth), but unless they changed something in a patch it should stll work. You'd have to anticipate the BE bull rush though.
 
NavisAmoris said:
I got lucky during a tournament a while ago and semi-accidently found out that 3AA can stop BE bull rush. Normally hitting him doesn't help much since the second rush still hits you, but apparently the timing of 3AA is just right to stop that shit. Haven't tried it since (none of my friends play Astaroth), but unless they changed something in a patch it should stll work. You'd have to anticipate the BE bull rush though.
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It certainly works, I did it many times last time I played an Asta, and it wasn't because I particularly expected him to do it, I was just using it as a ranged interrupt and he happened to do the bullrush BE.
 
some of my thoughts of this match up​
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Against Astaroth, i prefer to limit the use of WSB, instead use WC3B w is still punishable but at least it does decent guard damage, you got to keep in mind things that can lead with the BE bullrush, consider this thing is a big threat against Nightmare getting that fucking titan bomb (28 B+G) after getting relaunch, thats horrible damage.​
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i noticed after BE bullrush revenge 3K Nightmare is able to block, 66K 6 is pretty nice cause it can be Revenged by BE bullrush but if you see the revenge effect is activate you can auto GI with the GS A, it is confirmable, and considering 66K is TC, i think fast TC moves like this and 1K are annoying to Asta cause of his lack of good mid interrupters, maybe his 6K w his unsafe, and his 1K and low throws, keep in mind although 3B is punishable by bullrush, the revenge doesnt affect it, GS B neither, flap jacks and over toss are great he cant punish this decently.​
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Try to predict his BE bullrush, if you block it you can easily step it to Nightmare's right side and punish with GSB (is a bit hard to punish with this one but not so hard) for a lot of damage, or if you prefer more easily with 4A, 4K BE:B for 102 dmg or a BT 4K BE for 98 dmg.​
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hope this help you in this match up but i still thing he is kinda annoying to Nightmare​
 
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