Ban Hilde

[IdleMind]

I hate Hilde. I do. I hate her with every fiber of my being.

That being said, as Ignis said in another thread, "sad faces dont equal bans".

I believe this to be true. I disagree with binds, but that being said, there is no logical reason I can think of not to allow them except Hilde exploitation.

As such, my higher allegiance is to "wait and see". That being the case, I am going to wait and see. Time will tell gentlemen. That is something that is concrete and definite.

-Idle

 

[Ceirnian]

Hahaha, nice tribaL

 

[LunarAura]

Orionics, I meant if they didn't know prior to the tourney where they come in and then SURPRISE we have this new rule where you cant relaunch or whatever have fun no refunds.

 

[Sponge]

Orionics, I meant if they didn't know prior to the tourney where they come in and then SURPRISE we have this new rule where you cant relaunch or whatever have fun no refunds.

I doubt any one who goes to a tourney and has in depth knowledge of Hilde would go to said tourney without knowledge of the rules.

 

[JetSetDizzy]

Reasonable? Don't make me laugh. This community is pathetic, and I knew this was coming. As soon as Hilde is banned people will just move on to the next high tier character that they can't fight.

Lol how dare I go to sleep and miss 5 billion pages.
Aaaaanyway, that was my point. Hilde ban is not any more unreasonable than Algol ban, Yoda ban, Bonus character ban. So if those characters are "OK' to ban then why not Hilde. I was trying to put it into perspective.

 

[HajimeOwari]

Hilde isn't the only character who is dependent on button binds. A full ban on binds would hurt a number of characters. NM and Cervy already come to mind.

 

[LunarAura]

Wait, I'm lost. Are we talking about the possibility of changing anything before Nationals? If not, I'm sorry.

 

[Organous]

No, the Nationals rule set is already made. Any discussion would be regarding future Nationals at best.

 

[Chickenwing]

Aura: i know it's too late. But if a change were in order, that's all i would've approved if anything. All this other bullshit that this community is trying to ban is rediculous. i remember the good ol days where in SC2 everyone LOVED G2, then in SC3 it took them FOREVER to ban VC. NOW in SC4...EVERYONE wants to ban EVERYTHING!!!!! :)

if that's the case, we should have tournaments consisting of the only characters

Tira, Rock, and Talim....lol

 

[tribaL]

well, here's a hint for nationals: learn some god damned defense, seriously. balls-out aggressiveness doesn't always work, so i guess that means some of you have to learn the game now.

 

[aris]

I havent watched the videos yet but...

Belail: I honestly feel like a winner after that tournament. I knew what i was up against the day before the tournament started. Ceirnian didnt seem to sandbag at all while i did all the way up to singles. I did alot of planning and had a complete game plan going into that fight. As i said before IT WORKED!!!! But only once. He is smart and adjusted to my strategy and beat me just like i assumed he would. I assure you i am not bitter in the least bit. I beat some very very good players in that tournament and i have nothing to be ashamed of.


OOFMATIC: You cant comprehend a character that has a high learning curve but when reached can be completely broken? Not every broken character has to be easy to use.

I agree with banning single A or B button binding with hilde. A decision like that after nationals would keep me playing untill a pach...

 

[AMillionHP]

I'm not a tournament level player, never will be. In fact, i pretty much suck so, i'll bet my opinion is completely invalid to most of you. Regardless, i'm going to throw in my 2 cents anyway.

I think Hilde is broke, more so than Algol(yeah, thats right) but whatever, thats not the point. Absolutely, positively, nothing should be banned. The game should be played to it's fullest as it stands(save adjusted health, soul guage). I feel that as we continue to subtract things from the game, it's not the same game anymore. You all need to realize that pretty much every new character in this game has either been banned or is in some sort of debate/discussion for being banned. Thats pathetic, and really fucked up to anyone who purchased this game, is at a competitive level, and tried to pick the new characters for the sake of trying new things.

Now, there's a flipside to this. You have to understand a players perspective(especially tourney level) going up against Hilde. I find that there's not really a strong argument given in favor of her. The bottom line is the risk/reward ratio, which is just too strong. We shouldn't really criticize everyone's opinions on the matter though. Naturally, if someone mains Hilde, they are going to defend her, as they should. Likewise for anyone who has to fight her.

Wether you believe she destroys the community or not, i say forget about it. The developers should know that they failed to properly balance their game. Maybe letting the community fall on it's face is the only way to get it done. I would assume that this game(despite it's issues) is better than 3 at least right? And didn't the community basically go to shit over all that VC garbage then? Now we have a better game. This may sound a bit odd to some of you but i feel you're doing Namco's work for them with all this shit. Seriously, do they pay you? Let them balance their game. Right now, i feel the only way they'll really notice is if it's blatantly obvious no one plays the damn game. Perhaps banning and such only sends them the message that they can continue to half ass testing because the community is fully capable of banning characters for them. Sounds a bit crazy i know but, in the midst of all this discussion, this is what came to my mind.

 

[rashreflection]

Ceirnian: Thanks, and you guessed correctly. I'm Josh the Funkdoc on SRK and just plain ol' Josh Ballard on Dustloop.

Shauno: The reason I brought up the whole turtling issue was because Aris did in his post here. That also seemed to be the main argument the community had for banning Algol & Yoda - not that they were broken, but that they made the game "boring". As for your other points...

ST Akuma was a whole different beast from Hilde. Mr. Wizard just posted about this recently, in fact.

The real reason Akuma was banned was not because of any 10-0 matchups or anything, but strictly because he had an infinite chip-damage lockdown in the corner (repeated fierce red fireballs). With Hilde, if you die, it's always because you made a mistake somewhere; against ST Akuma, you could play perfectly and still lose. That's the essential difference.

IMO the characters most comparable to Hilde are Balrog in Hyper Fighting and Bison in ST. HF Rog had a 5-hit redizzy (read: infinite) combo from a jump-in. More importantly, his turn punch went through fireballs and linked into a dash punch - a 2-hit dizzy combo which led to the infinite. ST Bison could time his crossups to hit on either side, which is impossible to block on reaction, and get 100% combos from them.

As good as these things were, neither character was top-tier in the slightest. SF players have learned to be extremely careful in these kinds of matches (rarely doing anything out of range, etc.), and I don't see why the Calibur scene can't do the same. =)


Finally, with all of that said, I may actually be on board with a ban on button binding. To go back to SF again, HD Remix has a glitch with the 360 pad: On the left side, you can freely move around with the d-pad while charging back with the analog stick. This allows many charge characters to do walk-up specials and even supers. Not only that, but with this bug you will also block high while walking forward, AND block crossups from either side.

This is an obvious ban to just about anyone, but stop to think about why it should be banned: It allows players to do things that are literally impossible with standard controls. The Hilde button-binding trick is just a much less extreme version of this, so I could see the same logic applying.

And regarding the problem of what exactly "standard" controls are, I think a reasonable rule is to use the bare minimum of buttons required to play. SC4 has A/B/K/G, which should be simple enough.

 

[MAILBOXARSON99]

Regarding the whole button binding situation...

Fuck you to anyone who wants universal button binding bans. You're a fucking pussy and you're afraid to fight one character, so you fuck up the game for everyone else?

Leave Hilde. Leave the doom combo. Let Namco sort that shit out, it's their fucking job. Learn how to fucking fight the character, or don't complain when you get your ass raped.

You boast about how fucking manly and badass you are for using only four buttons on an arcade stick, but you don't even have the balls to put up with a challenge? Pathetic.

 

[BanHilde]

I'm not a tournament level player, never will be. In fact, i pretty much suck so, i'll bet my opinion is completely invalid to most of you. Regardless, i'm going to throw in my 2 cents anyway.

I think Hilde is broke, more so than Algol(yeah, thats right) but whatever, thats not the point. Absolutely, positively, nothing should be banned. The game should be played to it's fullest as it stands(save adjusted health, soul guage). I feel that as we continue to subtract things from the game, it's not the same game anymore. You all need to realize that pretty much every new character in this game has either been banned or is in some sort of debate/discussion for being banned. Thats pathetic, and really fucked up to anyone who purchased this game, is at a competitive level, and tried to pick the new characters for the sake of trying new things.

Now, there's a flipside to this. You have to understand a players perspective(especially tourney level) going up against Hilde. I find that there's not really a strong argument given in favor of her. The bottom line is the risk/reward ratio, which is just too strong. We shouldn't really criticize everyone's opinions on the matter though. Naturally, if someone mains Hilde, they are going to defend her, as they should. Likewise for anyone who has to fight her.

Wether you believe she destroys the community or not, i say forget about it. The developers should know that they failed to properly balance their game. Maybe letting the community fall on it's face is the only way to get it done. I would assume that this game(despite it's issues) is better than 3 at least right? And didn't the community basically go to shit over all that VC garbage then? Now we have a better game. This may sound a bit odd to some of you but i feel you're doing Namco's work for them with all this shit. Seriously, do they pay you? Let them balance their game. Right now, i feel the only way they'll really notice is if it's blatantly obvious no one plays the damn game. Perhaps banning and such only sends them the message that they can continue to half ass testing because the community is fully capable of banning characters for them. Sounds a bit crazy i know but, in the midst of all this discussion, this is what came to my mind.

Doesn't sound crazy at all, because it's a perfectly valid opinion. You certainly added more than those who only posted to try and close this thread.

I certainly don't have faith in Namco to do the right thing when it comes to balance. Their track record is proof of this as time goes on. Here is where we disagree, however. Asking for a ban, even though it won't likely happen, may bring attention on the matter to the community at large and then to Namco. The nail that sticks out gets hammered, so we should push it out for them to see. Leaving something like a stripped screw loose by itself won't bring any attention until the thing falls apart, and by then would they know what went wrong?

Still, banning is very extreme, and should only be a last resort option. We're not that far along yet, but it's good to have a discussion going at the very least to prevent any knee-jerk reactions.

 

[BanHilde]

Regarding the whole button binding situation...

Fuck you to anyone who wants universal button binding bans. You're a fucking pussy and you're afraid to fight one character, so you fuck up the game for everyone else?

Leave Hilde. Leave the doom combo. Let Namco sort that shit out, it's their fucking job. Learn how to fucking fight the character, or don't complain when you get your ass raped.

You boast about how fucking manly and badass you are for using only four buttons on an arcade stick, but you don't even have the balls to put up with a challenge? Pathetic.

Erm, it's the Hilde players who want button binding either universal or not at all.

 

[GEMINI_KNIGHT]

Ok, so no button binding after Nats, no ban Hilde.

Nats will go on.

RESOLUTION!

On the same day that Obama takes office. History indeed.

Perhaps this community will make it after all. For now.....

 

[DrHobo]

Regarding the whole button binding situation...

Fuck you to anyone who wants universal button binding bans. You're a fucking pussy and you're afraid to fight one character, so you fuck up the game for everyone else?

Leave Hilde. Leave the doom combo. Let Namco sort that shit out, it's their fucking job. Learn how to fucking fight the character, or don't complain when you get your ass raped.

You boast about how fucking manly and badass you are for using only four buttons on an arcade stick, but you don't even have the balls to put up with a challenge? Pathetic.

After you make ap ost like that your accusing us of trying to pretend we're manly and badass?

 

[MAILBOXARSON99]

Ok, so no button binding after Nats, no ban Hilde.

Bullshit resolution.

Why the sudden change in opinion? When this topic started, we were saying fuck off to the pro-ban pussies, and now everyone wants to fucking ban button-binding?

No character is unbeatable. Deal with it.

 

[Fuzion]

I'm just curious why you think you know so much about the game anyways mailbox guy? You seem to have a lot to say about who is or isn't a pussy and how this or that vid is filled with idiots just playing stupid. To me, a pussy is someone saying all that shit behind their keyboard and then never goes to a tournament in their life.