Hilde Guide & Strategy Discussion

Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

@TehEarl : Typo on my part =p Edited. Thanks! **Side note, for anyone studying the original combo, it works fine and better vs some characters with smaller hit boxes.

@RickSteaks : Sup dude =p This is the only place in the form where I've made any posts at all, like,.. needle in haystack that you found me =p BUT! I can address the one point you made pretty good. You said "find your own strategy and adjust". But what if you're not a natrualy talented battle genius who can see godly moves and tatics without reference? What if you needed ideas on how to adapt? Or want to look at your at a character from a diferent perspective =p That's what our discussions are about =p Even if you take nothing from the thread ideas, at the very least, it's usually an entertaining read!

@Ignis : That's the spirit! Although online is a joke when it comes to exacting and percision play, good players still use very good strat. And that is something you can learn from online! Woo for strat!

~Fei
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

I'm "great" offline, since I don't have to deal with lag, and I'm probably playing against people who aren't nearly as good as I am.

Fostering a community is hard if people you're playing against don't want to get better. But the good thing is that people I'm playing against DO want to get better. I need to get better against better people in order to get better...the vicious cycle continues onward forever.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

The vicious cycle continues on ad-infinitum or until our power level is over 9000 and we are screaming for hours on end before shooting kamehameha's....
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

IgnisPhaseOne said:
I'm "great" offline, since I don't have to deal with lag, and I'm probably playing against people who aren't nearly as good as I am.

Fostering a community is hard if people you're playing against don't want to get better. But the good thing is that people I'm playing against DO want to get better. I need to get better against better people in order to get better...the vicious cycle continues onward forever.
Click to expand...

The interesting thing in my opinion is that you can only teach the basics and some "tricks" to your friends. Past that, I feel they'll have to search forums and sit in practice mode for themselves. In my expierience, the only people that beat the teacher, are the ones that don't exclusively learn from "that" teacher. It's off topic, but opinion? =p

Second Side note: Teach them how to play Sophie =p They'll learn faster probably =p (Teach them, 236B. 4B. 2A, 66A, 66B, 1AA, 1K, 66A+G, BB, 3B and they should be golden =p )

@Runis: I figure when your powerlevel is over 9000 you should beable to win tournies from just like exploding other people by giving them dirty looks, I'm sure you wouldn't have to scream for too many hours.

~Fei
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

@ Fei: Exploding people with 9k P-lvl only werks on scrubs. I have to worry about the non scrubs who are also over 9000.

Also on your thing about not beating the teacher, that's actually very true.
One of my friends who doesn't play SC alot, when we played SC3, I taught him the basics and some tricks with mitsu, and he actually became one of the better players, but every time it'd be me vs him, I'd mirror match and you would notice that I would do all the same stuff as him, only 1-2 frames faster, so mine had priority, or would know exactly when 2KB etc was coming and could punish it. You really have to look up stuff yourself and develop your own play style.
Being taught is good, but you need to expand on that with experience.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

My friends want to learn Hilde.
They say she's so uber broken.
There's...a reason...>_<

I try to teach them Hilde...
...then they think that I'm ridiculous for knowing how to play her so well...
...and then they main Apprentice. Oh well, it's all good since they're also learning real characters. But everyone knows Hilde is the best female in the game. Hot, wears armor, AND uses two weapons at once. HELL YES.

Also, that's not true about students being unable to beat teachers. My friend who was pretty good, I made him better and he wanted to get better, so we played a lot and now he can beat me pretty much 50/50 when I'm Hilde. Kilik's a different story, but I'm shelving him because I am basically unstoppable with him, and it's no fun for anybody if I play Kilik.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

@Fei:Don't encourage people to pick up Sophie. Anyway, are there any good followups to C2 BB if you don't have C2 AA charged? Also, what are your experiences with FC C3AK series? It leads to an easy combo and mixup, but the range on the first hit seems pretty weak. It might work well as an anti pressure move, but I'm rather iffy about that.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

Dully, my favorite C2 BB followups is 3 B A, even if you're sitting on a C2 AA. As far as I can tell, it's guarenteed, rings out almost as well as C2 AA. But that's my opinion, I use it a crap-ton.

Also, I use FC C3 A K B, to go into 3 B A, it's an OK ringout opportunity if you're backed to edge and they're used to B+G throws as ringouts. Plus it's quite a bit of damage.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

To answer the C2BB if no C2AA is charged - well, stick to 3BA - it's the safest way to guarantee damage. If you're at a wall and have the timing down pat, you can try 6A+K, 7K. *WARNING* this is AC'able, which is why I say to try it at wall - they can't AC back, and if they AC to the side they might still be hit by the K depending on angle of approach. The timing is also very hard to get a grasp on as you must make both hits of the 6A+K connect or it will whiff. The advantage of this however, is that by the time you've finished doing all this crazy stuff and timing, you have had enough time to charge a C3B for Oki, and we all know that hidden charges are the bomb.

As for FC C3AK set, I usually only use the first FC C3A and don't push it out into the full string unless the FC C3A is hit confirmed, next hit confirm is whether the K is a CH or not (whether they stun or not) at which point if it hit confirms CH I will use B, if not I will use A. Simply put, FC C3A is +3 on block, KB is combo-able into B+K C2BB C2AA, KA is just a low poke -4 though.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

Thanks for the replies. I was kind of iffy about 3BA, since it seemed like you could AC away from it after C2 BB. Also, I've never been great at hit confirmation, so I think I'll have to study the C3AK series more before I can actually integrate it properly. Wouldn't want to suck a 236B down from a competent Sophie player... One more thing (For now): how easy is it to shake out of CH C1 A? I like the move, since it's a relatively quick horizontal mid (Which Hilde kinda lacks, outside of other charge moves and 3A), and stuns long enough to combo with 1KK or 3BA. Again, I don't want a decent player to shake out of it and punish me.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

@ IgnisPhaseOne : You can beat your friends cleanly with Kilik, meaning they arn't better than you. My point stands. =p

@ Dullyanna : You can treat FC A's and FC B's as would your WS moves. Just duck important moves and CH fish. Ex. NM 3 uninteruptiable KK, last K is high. Taki 1B,A is fastest possession entry move, the A is high, Nightmare GS KK, the last kick is high. Sophie and Lizardman 66B+K etc etc, the second hit is high. They're all decent places to fish for hits.

The shake from stun is just as easy as with any other character. 5-6 directions and you're free. Any mixup is fine.

*Aslo: Sophie is great fun, yay for Sophie.

~Fei
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

IMHO, Sophie is too great, even after being weakened from SC3. Why? Because her punishing game still gives her idiotically good matchups against most of the cast. Of course, that's just my opinion, so it's no big deal anyway.

Getting on track: I didn't think of that usage for Hilde's FC charge moves (I usually use B or K, since the former TCs, and the latter hits mid, if I remember correctly). Then again, I still kinda suck with her, and have only recently begun integrating her charge moves.

P.S. I'd really like some solid practice with her, so if anybody has time to kill next week, hit me up on live. I can't really afford to **** around with her online, as that'll get me kicked and such.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

Well...
About a week or so ago, I posted here with questions on Hilde. I went to go try her out in Training mode and it just was not happening. I quickly hurried back to my previous mains and kept on playing. Then suddenly out of no where I decided to try out Hilde again...

Something just clicked. My brain finally wrapped its head around the "Release Button to Attack" which I had so many problems with. I was timing the length of my charges in my head while analyzing the battle situation, and most of all I was nailing down every single ring-out combo that I could land.

I didn't think it were true, so I decided to test myself out on the Online modes. That's when the winning streak started, I just kept plowing through people with Ring-Out Death Combos back and forth. Probably combined with the fact that no one knows how to deal with Hilde, I was enjoying it tremendously. Heck, I even managed to beat a lv.73 player (myself being only lv.8) who only had something like 135 losses, he then proceeded to send me a message saying UR DEAD afterwards (although he wiped the floor with me in the rematch lol).

Call me officially a Hilde fan/player!

Your guide has been extremely helpful Fei, Now that I've got the charging down... I got to learn my attack patterns when I'm under pressure, since that where I seem to be weakest.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

@ Dullyanna : If you were on Psn, I'd be up for games whenever =p

@ Card : Many people on the forum will shun me for saying this, but you can actually just Release A, then Release B recharge both, and do it again vs most people rushing you down (auto gi is awesome, and most people feel that they're at disadvantage so they let you release B without a hitch). You know, just really spam those charge A's =p If they suddenly start spamming kicks, just 2A *on hit* do WsK, it'll reset you back to something closer to your favor.

Anywho, most people at this point disregaurd the ladder system online since many players just abuse the system and avoid losses etc.

Last note: Ask questions, we offer answers!

~Fei
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

YAAAY! Thanks SW!

I've been ramping up my playtime, and I've got a ton of different ways to play her now. I love the advance on FC C3 B, nobody expects it to push forward so far. Also, it's hard to punish if the second attack is blocked.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

Card said:
Well...
Something just clicked. My brain finally wrapped its head around the "Release Button to Attack" which I had so many problems with. I was timing the length of my charges in my head while analyzing the battle situation, and most of all I was nailing down every single ring-out combo that I could land.

I didn't think it were true, so I decided to test myself out on the Online modes. That's when the winning streak started, I just kept plowing through people with Ring-Out Death Combos back and forth. Probably combined with the fact that no one knows how to deal with Hilde, I was enjoying it tremendously. Heck, I even managed to beat a lv.73 player (myself being only lv.8) who only had something like 135 losses, he then proceeded to send me a message saying UR DEAD afterwards (although he wiped the floor with me in the rematch lol).

Call me officially a Hilde fan/player!

Your guide has been extremely helpful Fei, Now that I've got the charging down... I got to learn my attack patterns when I'm under pressure, since that where I seem to be weakest.
Click to expand...

Tip, online, you wanna pick the Grand labyrinth level [huge purple square with no traction on the edges] if he challenges you again and you get stage selection. It's a level where it's quite hard for people to ring hilde out, whereas it's quite easy for her to ring your opponents out.

It rings out on every direction with FCC2B and C3B besides the long diagonal [literally, you have to start on the end of the diagonal too], and C3A will ring out from center.

If you so happen to "miss" ringing him out by a bit...

*C2BB[i21 - although the startup is negligible if you're going to use it as a tech punisher] - Seems like a lot of idiots try to tech the end of C2AA. Relaunches are always fun and will quickly teach them to stop... being... retarded.
** Note: if they don't want to get up, you can always just back up and spam 4A+B from range til they die.
*4B+K[i17] - Sparta kick. It ROs forwards. Fairly fast, so it gets counterhits sometimes.
*2A+K[i27] - Will ring out on the very edge, also low.
*2A+B~K[i31] - Low. If you need more than a small push to get them off the edge, this one shoves them fairly far. If you're doing this move close in, be careful because it can also ring yourself out.

Oh, might as well throw in some anti-spammer tactics online, although they won't really make you better offline.

Note, these are fairly low level gimmicks/tactics that should only be one of the few options you have against them. Don't rely on them too much or eventually they'll shut you down :p

*Vs. 2KB Mitsurugi - Don't let him get on the offensive. Spam any move you have and keep him back. If he starts stepping, make him eat C3A. Usually they start acting a bit more conservative after you connect a few and you'll have more time to prepare your setups.

*Vs. Lv352 Siegfried - I don't know why, but they keep thinking they have range on their side. C2BB's reach is pretty amazing and seems to punish whiffs well from ridiculous ranges. Just don't use it too close or you'll slide right into their attack.

*Vs. 1[A]A/B Astaroth - 6B+K to 4A+B punishes it fairly nicely if you're out of range of the attack. If you're in range, 9K does the job as well. I don't know why, but some astaroths spam throws and lows once I'm in close range, thus I just keep laying on 9K for free.

*Vs Kilik The Savior - On start... sidestep a lot, keep distance, and C3B launch when they whiff to beat 99% of newbie kiliks in the first 7-10 seconds or so. Prepare to get complaints + people saying your ringout business is "bullshit" online. Also, 9K-ing lows work for certain kilik moves as well. If you get the C1B stun instead because they whiffed REALLY early... consider trying the C1B 66A+B 2A+B~K stun combo. If they aren't going to shake out of the stun, might as well make them eat it, right?

*Vs Guard Break Teleport Cervantes - Try to keep C2BB instead of C3B if the stage is small. If they try the horizontal teleport, you get a free ringout pretty much due to C2BB's ridiculous range. If they try the vertical one, step, crouch, FCC2B, you should know what to do from there.

That should cover around 99% of xbox live. No idea about PSN.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

@ ZephyrF : This is a really great post Zeph, I hope a lot of people take advantage of it!

Now, let's address a few points that stood out:

You made a point to get advantage by picking stage. Myself, I think it's a good idea, yet I never do it, I perpetually just random (stages) intentionally. Can we have opinions on selecting the stages that give you most advantage? Is it a good strat? Is it cheap as hell and shouldn't be done?

My opinion: I guess it's in the same vein as some people now wanting to bind buttons to play Hilde, if binding helps win better, you should get over the mental handicap and do so. Same for picking stages. I still don't do it for some reason =/

You made this point here:
** Note: if they don't want to get up, you can always just back up and spam 4A+B from range til they die.
Click to expand...

Couldn't people just roll up or down while staying grounded and evade this tactic? I suggest just running up and 11K so you can have your A and B charges, I dunno =p

Your Mitsu advice:
Most Mitsu spammers I see abuse 1A and not 2KB, strange, no? I mean, it knocks down, and they can spam while you're floored, and it's even simplier than 2KB. 1A 1A 1A etc. I find that 9K does amazing things vs this strat. Blocking it and FC3 B B A is great too =p One off note, does anyone notice that Hilde juggles are harder to pull off vs Mitsu than say Nightmare? I sometimes miss the C3 A in the juggle even though he's kinda big as a hitbox. (Try in training vs Mitsu, then vs Nightmare)

Your Kilik advice:
Kiliks love 6A+B, it's "fast" simple, and like random 60dmg on counter, perpetually stepping like you advice will avoid this. But Kiliks also like 66AA, which is high low, you kinda have to pay attention and block and / evade.

PSN players play very similiar to what you've already described. What can we say? It's a small world or something.

~Fei
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

Fei said:
@ ZephyrF : This is a really great post Zeph, I hope a lot of people take advantage of it!

Now, let's address a few points that stood out:

You made a point to get advantage by picking stage. Myself, I think it's a good idea, yet I never do it, I perpetually just random (stages) intentionally. Can we have opinions on selecting the stages that give you most advantage? Is it a good strat? Is it cheap as hell and shouldn't be done?

My opinion: I guess it's in the same vein as some people now wanting to bind buttons to play Hilde, if binding helps win better, you should get over the mental handicap and do so. Same for picking stages. I still don't do it for some reason =/

You made this point here:


Couldn't people just roll up or down while staying grounded and evade this tactic? I suggest just running up and 11K so you can have your A and B charges, I dunno =p

Your Mitsu advice:
Most Mitsu spammers I see abuse 1A and not 2KB, strange, no? I mean, it knocks down, and they can spam while you're floored, and it's even simplier than 2KB. 1A 1A 1A etc. I find that 9K does amazing things vs this strat. Blocking it and FC3 B B A is great too =p One off note, does anyone notice that Hilde juggles are harder to pull off vs Mitsu than say Nightmare? I sometimes miss the C3 A in the juggle even though he's kinda big as a hitbox. (Try in training vs Mitsu, then vs Nightmare)

Your Kilik advice:
Kiliks love 6A+B, it's "fast" simple, and like random 60dmg on counter, perpetually stepping like you advice will avoid this. But Kiliks also like 66AA, which is high low, you kinda have to pay attention and block and / evade.

PSN players play very similiar to what you've already described. What can we say? It's a small world or something.

~Fei
Click to expand...

Hey Fei, get on flashchat already so we can discuss slightly less simplified strategies :v

@ 1KK - Sure, but make sure you have at least FCC2B and C3A before poking them up or you might be cruising for a brusing as C1/2 are slightly more vulnerable to quick moves [and throws... man I hate those ledge ringouts that I get plastered with due to lag + b-charging] and charging both slows you down a bit [G-cancelling] unless you're button binding. I also tend to notice people block charges fairly well after getting up, and for some reason, they don't block things like 2A+K or 2K to 4B+K or 4B+Kx2 [after the first is blocked, they always seem to think they can poke out... which is not always true]

66AA - Is that the one when he makes a huge overhead swing then a sweeping low?
Blocking the high and 9King the low is always fun if you don't have much lag. Although it's rather timing dependant and blocking low will probably give you adv.

@ Stage picking - For myself, I play random or select pyramid on purpose. About 80% of the stages have enough ringout space to give hilde a decent enough advantage. On the other hand, if the person says "You're dead" and you so happen to be lucky enough to land stage select, why not rub it in with a 15 second match? Usually they're out for blood, which means they'll run at you... then you sidestep, C2BB, C3A, C2BB, C2AA ringout and then they plug pull or press the lag button in hopes of disrupting your combo.

@ Juggles - I don't know about the difficulties... I seem to be able to land the combo off of memory fairly well regardless of the character, unless they fall too fast [cough asta rock]. I guess at a certain 'time' of the move, I just react to it. I might look into how lenient the 44K and C2BBs are off of the C3B and FCC2B combos over the weekend or something when I have time by varying my timing to see how strict it is.
 
Starting off Right: A Hilde Guide

@ ZephyrF :

I'ma hide out here dominantly =p Anything we talk about over flash chat will be lost to the community =p

11K not 1kk =p *Assuming typo On that topic you mention how people block mid good and you suggest various lows. I typically run up and throw instead. The throws and the C series are about 18-23 frames ish, so it is pretty difficult to tell whether to duck or eat throw or eat insta death.

Vs Kilik : Blocking low gives advantage, but typically you're REALLY far away =p I dun think you can punish with C3B after block.


Try Mitsu specifically (then compare results vs Nightmare) =p Come back with results =p

~Fei
 
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