I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) game

[Senzait]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

franman you completely misunderstood what im saying. I know you are a veteran SC4 player, which is way more than what I can say for myelf, you probably have a much more in depth knowledge of this game than I do (Im pretty sure I have even seen videos of you playing against oof in canada).

I was refering to the fact that Madnis said that he didn't play the game in-depth, therefore I doubt that he was talking about wall combos, and if he was I doubt that he ment combos like the one's you mentioned that not only are hard to execute but require an extensive understanding of Cervy.

We both dont honestly believe the combo system is like Tekken, if you honestly believe that no offence but you haven't played enough Tekken, specially T6.

 

[Hot Rod Dave]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

I can only offer this piece of ancient wisdom passed on to from the generations that stood before me.

"Take it to PMs."



Fuck you Dave

HEY HEY HEY...Take it to PM's bro. I will fuckin put a dress on you and put you on the streets. AFTER I infract you!!

 

[franman]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

I was refering to the fact that Madnis said that he didn't play the game in-depth, therefore I doubt that he was talking about wall combos, and if he was I doubt that he ment combos like the one's you mentioned that not only are hard to execute but require an extensive understanding of Cervy.

Well you did mention People and I was agreeing with Madnis on some of his points. Even if he didn't play enough SC4 I can fill in things to greater detail that Madnis may not know about.

We both dont honestly believe the combo system is like Tekken, if you honestly believe that no offence but you haven't played enough Tekken, specially T6.

I believe that SC4 still is SC but becoming less original than what I've seen in SC2. I accept for what SC4 currently is, but making it even more less original is what worries me.

 

[Tyrik32785]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

Archangel Sorry for my stupid response and i see your point now(since we have TkxSf,Sfxtk and Tekken tag 2 coming) and i don`t which one to buy first.It think soulcalibur could use a remake though for now(since some characters are getting stupid stories like talim,hilde etc.And hope the story never takes the turn tekken 6 did and ruin the other characters story lines(like t6`s scenario campaign which was one of the most stupidest modes i have ever played and you are forced to play it just to get decent fight money and Tekken6`s graphic wise is too ps2 graded that i think my ps2 can run those graphics.And i don`t get why the sc director is making a wish for sc5 instead of just making the game!

 

[Tyrik32785]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

IvyFanboy Agreed and i played soul calibur since soulcalibur 2(sc2 is actually still pretty popular) and i hated in tekken 6 and maybe 5 when the juggling crap came in and turned tekken from a game about strategy,range,skill into a game where you just have to launch him into the air and keep him in there for as long as you can(which is broken bullshit that you can`t counter that).If those T6 noobs played Tekken 2 or 1 they would get their asses kicked.

 

[Tyrik32785]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

Malice Agreed i think guests are becoming bad for sc(like we can`t make a sc game without throwing in some guest characters.the only current sc game that didn`t have guests and kicked ass was Sc3.I think for newbies we should have some Samurai warriors(sengoku era since it is close to sc time line but will be made in soul calibur style and could fill up the roster with new characters)tadakatsu honda(he is a legendary general who served in sixty battles without taking a single scratch and would a great sc addition and he could probably beat mitsurugi),Yoshimoto Imagawa(he is the legendary commander who fought against nobunaga oda),Nobunaga oda(I dont really know exactly who he is but people called him the demon king etc).You should look up the sengoku era in japan when you get a chance it is very interesting.

 

[IvyFanboy]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

Glad you cleared this and said every fighter cause I can think of a game that you can't punish on :cough: brawl :cough:.

d-d-ddid you just refer to Smash Bros as a fighter? The day I acknowledge that series as a "fighter" is the day I acknowledge "Barbie Horse Racing" as a racer... It may be a fighter per-se, but I think it was pretty obvious we're only pointing out competitive fighters here...where as thats a "fun-hybrid-fighter-best-played-drunk-with-all-items-on-that-Nintendo-fanboys-keep-trying-to-make-competitive-by-creating-the-most-absurd-ban-list-ever-conceived-despite the-developers-specifically-gearing-it-away-from-tournament-play" fighter.

 

[Archangel]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

Well -

A: Please do not triple-post. If you have to, go back and edit. But don't double or triple-post. It's extremely bad forum etiquette, and it proves you're either very young or new to the internet (or both, obviously).

B: The SC director can't just go ahead and make a new Soul Calibur. In the real world, people have jobs. And in those jobs, you will have a boss. And if you don't do what your boss says, you get fired. You will also get fired if you spend the boss' money without asking permission first.

C: Here are some things that Sony has to think about:

How much money versus other projects has Soul Calibur made for us? How much has it made for us individually? Has there been a declining amount of sales with each game? Are sales so low compared to other games we do or could put out that the amount of built-in fanbase likely to invent in SC5 isn't enough to justify the expense?

If we do make an SC Tag, should it be just like Tekken Tag? Should there be a storyline? If there is a storyline, how many people should work on it, and how much should we pay them? How long should we pay them for? What should we tell them to go for in terms of story? Should we not make a story mode and instead just have a game that exists solely for persons versus combat? Does the amount of money we would save from not paying story people outweigh the risks of having what would amount to be a game with a very specifically targeted audience? Do we have numbers on the amount of people we think would buy either version of such an SC tag? If we don't have those numbers, would it be worth it to locate a company that would find those numbers for us? Would it be cheaper to do it ourselves? How would we know?

If after all that we decide SC Tag might be a good investment, what would the game look like? Should we just lift stages right off of previous versions or create new versions plus some all new stages? Should we include every single character that's ever existed in SC? Some of those characters were only on the first couple of versions. How much would it cost to restart their characters from scratch? Do we create any new characters? What about costumes? Do we keep the costumes the same from SC4? Do we keep those and add new ones? If we add new ones, what should they look like? Should we pay some costume designers to create clothes for our computer artists to copy? How many designers and how much should we pay them? Where would we start looking for the designers?

Once we've settled on our roster and what they look like, what about music? Do we keep the soundtrack from SC4? Do we add in the music from all SC games? Only from SC2, 3 and 4? Do we create original music? Who would we pay for that? Where would we find them, and how much should we pay them? What about gameplay? Do we keep the same game mechanics and balance as SC4, or SC3, or SC2? Do we modify it from SC2, since that seems to be popular with the gaming crowd? Do we modify the SC4 code? Create entirely new programming? What about moves? Does the move roster stay the same as SC4? Do we add in moves from previous versions? Create entirely new moves? Do we ask martial artists what moves we could add?

Once the game is done (if we decide to do it), how much would the production of the game cost? Where would it be produced? How would we market it? Where would we market it to? Solely America? America and Europe? Do we make the game for PS3 only? Do we try to include other consoles to expand the game's viability? How long until we have a beta version? How much would we spend until the beta version? How much after? How long would we test it? How much would we be willing to change after the beta version? Would creating a Soul Calibur Tag be worth the expense of above, or does it make more financial sense for Sony to skip Soul Calibur Tag and go right to SC5? Should we even make SC5?

Those are the things off the top of my head that Sony would have to think about, and I'm not within miles of being a businessman or a computer programmer.

Just so you know.

 

[Madnis]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

just you guys know, i'm not playing against simple random scrubs. the circle i ran with before some of them left for the army/ or went into their career jobs/ or my job got more hectic were some pretty reputable opponents. In fact, if you went to evo, i think you may have met two of them. Kura, and Seong Chul.

reason why i don't put in the hours to play this game that often is because i don't find it fun to play it for very long. and i have other games on my plate, and my job doesn't leave me with a lot of free time on my hands. Also, I don't play any game online, fighting or not (except for fat princess). so whatever online strats you're mentioning, please.. don't mention them to me, they're not worth mentioning because online play is crap and it's not worth even thinkin about.

having said that, I don't see the need to defend my "player status" to anyone so that's as far as i'm going to with that. yes, i consider myself a scrub at this game. yes i don't play this game all that often these days. but if you think that all i do is play with a bunch of scrubs in a niche circle, you're seriously mistaken. i'm going based on my play experience and if you think talim, yun seong, voldo, nightmare don't have damaging combos where you're like gee... i'm getting comboed right now, oh goodie... you obviously haven't seen the extent of what the whole cast of SC4 can do. in other words, please don't act like i don't play with experienced players and i'm just sitting in my room playing nothing but online. it's either offline play or practice baby! and i rarely do both these days... sigh.. still i needs my money and money is of higher priority then hobbies.

having said all that and digressed that far let me get back to my point. which franny said, soul calibur is losing its own identity. yes a lot of fighters use long ass combos but they still have something that differentiates it from being a simple rip off. in the case of soul calibur, it's even more so then other companies simply because of where it's developed. guilty by association if you will. and as i said before, from a business perspective, this makes sense. you have one successful fighting franchise where as the other is more catered to a niche market. if you want to make it so it's more of a wide spread success, you would have to emulate the successful franchise as close as you can.

the thing is, when the ORIGINAL producer for soul calibur left namco bandai, that's no longer his game. his ideas, his vision, all went with him, and they handed the game off to some other schmuck who had his own ideas on how to make this game. that's how this game began losing its original identity. then harada takes the helm as codirector and you can see how he would add tekken's influence into soul calibur directly. I'll compromise and say that the combos aren't everything in soul calibur, but the way the game is played is again, very tekken like. refer to one of my prior wall of texts as i feel i outlined it there.

why i believe this franchise should end is also because of the reason above, the original producer is no longer at Namco. it's handed off to some other guy who listens more to Harada (because harada is his boss) versus trying to follow and build upon the game that the original producer made, he's going to listen to the guy who made a successful title. you know i don't doubt that soul calibur will become soul calibur in name and weapon based combat only and would be an entirely different fighter all together.

now,
do i know that people like this game? yes.

do i know there are fans out there who love this game? yes.

but would it make a difference if they released the next game as a completely different title and the start of the new franchise but keeps the spirit of this new idea of soul calibur? not at all.

but would those fans accept this new title? probably not, because it doesn't have the name "soul calibur"

will i object to a new soul calibur if it's made? not at all, it's not my decision to make. but i'll give it a dabble. and will i be surprised if it feels even more like tekken? not in the least.

still, if you were to come up to me and ask me, what kind of game is soul calibur?
i would respond with "think tekken but with weapons." and in all honesty that response didn't come to mind until i played Sc4. SC3 as much as i hated it, still felt like it's own franchise... not a continuation of 2, not at all... but it still "felt" like a soul calibur title. and just so we're clear, i've been playing sc4 since day one. i haven't put in all the hours as some of you vets out there, but it was enough for me to develop my own educated opinion on it.

say it's not all you want. my mind has been made, and no one has sold me on why it's not, aside from listing the broad general ideas i.e. it's a weapons based fighter.

 

[Unknown Legend]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

Madnis

you openly said you dont dive too deep into these games so I would say you have a very general view of both games. Those who actually study SC(or Tekken) and then play Tekken(or SC) and can see that both games are not the same are probably more informed than you.

Playing high level players being uninformed about the game will also severely affect your perception of the game. It's my opinion the players you mentioned are among the best in the world so if you are not too informed about the game they can pull of some ridiculous stuff which is what I think is happening. They can sit there and stun you with shakable stuns all day, knock you down, hit you with a tech trap or down trap, and to you who is uninformed it seems like an endless combo when in reality none of that is practical. Even if they are pulling off practical combos on you, you are probably unknowingly opening yourself to the same combos over and over again. Then you go and play Tekken where people hit you with 10+ hit combos all day and conclude that both games are the same. Honestly I think it's your lack of knowledge in the game coupled with playing against high level players which cause you to think the games are the same.

But really people who study the game have a better understanding than you, that is fact. I mean to someone who is an expert golfer two different golf clubs are drastically different, but to someone who plays occasionally two different clubs might seem the same but they would be wrong.

 

[Madnis]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

that's a fair assessment.

it's a little more then just that though. you're right that i should learn this game more, but i played it enough to where i feel i can make this statement. and understand, though i consider myself a scrub and just a dabbler, i ain't no bitch. i can still hold my own when i play. madnis ain't no bitch.

having said that, still doesn't change my view. tell you what, when i play soul calibur, and it feels like a soul calibur game.. then i'll stop saying soul calibur is just tekken with weapons. as far as i'm concerned... that's that.

 

[IvyFanboy]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

Pretty sure dman hit the nail in the coffin on that one.

Don't feel bad a LOOOOOOT of people don't really understand fighting games and think they do because they do flashy things. It takes a lot of time with every fighter to really understand the key differences. Most people think it's just about performing moves and blocking at the right time. A fighting game is more of a mental thing backed by dexterity and that requires deep understanding of your options versus the opponents. I gonna be blunt and say simply by your showcase of knowledge you do not know the basics of the game, and once again don't feel bad. A lot of players are unaware of simple things like shaking, step guard, and tech traps. Do yourself a favor and look in the forums for general tactics THEN try to learn the character.

You'll do yourself a major favor by being humble here and educating yourself. Once you REALLY understand a fighting game you can look around and explore the depths of others. Don't harm your rep by acting tough and stating polarizing things when you know you're low level and probably don't really understand the game enough (and based on this, no you don't).

(Because all the things I'm telling you not to do, is what I did and it held me back till someone was kind enough to sit with me at Evo and help me out.)

 

[Madnis]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

that's real cute. fair enough.

but that doesn't do anything to change anything aside from calling me an a know nothing noob.

obviously i know nothing of this game because i make the preposterous statement that that soul calibur = tekken with weapons, because if i knew the basic concepts for any fighting game i would know that that's impossible! a direct comparison of these games can't be made.

how about we go about proving how soul calibur isn't like tekken with weapons, rather then discussing my knowledge on fighting games. true my credibilty may be low, but it is what it is, and i call it as i see it.

i already discussed how it's done, and all i get in return for the most part is "no it's not!" and "you don't know shit about fighting games!" if we were to basically sum up your retorts. (by your i don't mean everyone who replied to me, i mean you Ivyfanboy)

the way i see it, franny already hit the nail on the head when he made a related post with the major point being:
and i quote:

I believe that SC4 still is SC but becoming less original than what I've seen in SC2. I accept for what SC4 currently is, but making it even more less original is what worries me.

may not mean tekken with weapons sure. but it still can mean that soul calibur is changing into something other then soul calibur. maybe you don't feel this way? that's fine. but from a veteran soul calibur 2 player (myself) seeing the changes made to sc4 also makes me feel this way.. when i first started playing sc4 i saw more and more combos then pokes. amy with her three to four hit combo, raph with his little combo, and me simply practicing combos for kilik vs learning the system (learn by playing opponents and having fun while doing it). but guess what? from variety in the all around move list (which guess what, not as robust), i found my movement more restricted to one plane and i found myself moving around only when i felt the need to where as i was constantly moving in sc2. and then eventually i noticed it, i'm playing this game like i would tekken. i'm not thinking this game out like it's a soul calibur match, i'm thinking the same way i would tekken. and that's how it started. that thought solidified more and more i played sc4 which includes playing my korean buddies.

but of course.. i don't know what i'm talkin about because i'm just a noob apparently.

fair enough ivyfanboy. fair enough. but just to ease things up a bit, let Dman do the talking from now on. let's just have you sit on the sidelines and cheer. You're not really contributing anything to the conversation at hand. you're just trying to find a nice way to insult me. which is again.. cute.

and for me to be humbled... well, i'm hard headed.. and as mosdef says,

the hard headed have to feel it to believe it.

can't wait to play you someday.

Edit: on a side note, i'm having fun. i haven't been this engaged in a soul calibur related topic since soul calibur 2. by that i mean long winded. thank ya'll for that!

 

[franman]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

After all this debate I understand Madnis more better as to why he won't support the upcoming SC5.

As I've stated in one of my previous posts, gamers can't do anything to change the creative aspects of the game. However, I do want to add that the only thing gamers can do is either buy the game or don't buy it at all.

I want to further express problems in buying the game and not buying it:

-If ppl buy the game, then the company will invest more time in the game and may make it even more less original (that's what concerns me).

-Otherwise, the company may drop the game and never make it again because there's no point in making a game that isn't profitable.

But if I were to choose either one I would go with the first. Why? Because I'm a fan of Soul Calibur. Despite my concerns over originality, I still have optimism. I hold onto this spark of hope that a new producer may eventually take over and follow the old routes of the original producer.

PS: maybe you guyz should check this out http://www.gametrailers.com/video/episode-139-pach-attack/707094

 

[Hot Rod Dave]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

BACK ON TOPIC:

I for one have an interest in the history of this game. Especially its characters (setsuka's & maxi's for the most part) I always liked how some of the stories inter-twine with more than one character. Scrapping the whole story line and starting over is not a horrible idea.

However: I think what the hardcore fans of this series wants is a more balanced fighting mechanics, less hokey guess characters and more refined move lists rather than an in depth story mode. I personally always go through the story or campaign mode before I do any online or vs stuff for any game. A good story interest me quite a bit while Im playing different games. The Old Star wars force unleashed I thought had a great story, but come this new one, It was horrbile and now I have no interest in playing it (there are other reasons more suited for a different thread).

So developers have quite a chore. They have to figure out who is more important, Us the hardcore players that want extensive restructering of the core mechanics of the game, OR, the casual player that wants more in depth character creations and better story. Unfortunatly for Us hardcore peeps, we are the minority, the casual people will be the ones they will make more money on. Gaming developers want 1 thing on top of anything else...MONEY!! thats what keeps the world moving. If SC4 sold a million copies total, probablly only 75 to 100 of those copies are still being played today by us...the die hards

So Mr. OP, I personally would like to see either an in depth story OR a new story all together, but I want better machanics first


HRD

 

[IvyFanboy]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

I'm telling you based on your reasoning, not your conclusions. You could make a comparison to Tekken, but what your basing it off of is flawed...thus I peg you as uneducated. It's not to insult you, its to give you a chance to maybe go back, check your notes, and rethink it.

SC, like any franchise, has gone through changes, but these changes are more natural improvements, not a completely new game. What's the dif between a combo and if a move is simply upped in damage to equate the same as the combo? Combos simply give you options...you could finish it...or drop it and go for a reset or perhaps another variation for spacing or RO purposes. Things have only been added, not really taken away (stepping was nerfed). The only thing I can really agree on is losing soul charge. Beyond that though, the same skills and movement still apply.

While people agree SC2 was the games high point, it doesn't stand the test of time to SC4 despite the loss of soul charge. Side by side SC4 is regarded as the best SC game currently because of these improvements. To go back and not include anything would be bad. Perhaps rework SG damage and return charge, but keep what we have now, it's better...and more importantly not Tekken.

 

[Hot Rod Dave]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

I thought we were talking bout SC history...did the name of this thread change to "IFB and Mandis penis length discussion"? If so I missed it.

I vote Mandis for biggest penis....dont ask me how I know

HRD

 

[Dullyanna]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

you're right that i should learn this game more

Naw, you prolly shouldn't.

 

[Madnis]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

hrd you're mistaken sir..

it was a dick measuring contest between me and Dman. fanboy just wanted to be the "mr me too" of the group. go figure.

and i'll be real. my dick is average in length. but i'll tell you right now, i'm a marathon runner. if she ain't willin to clock in and put in the hours, i dont' want her steppin up to the plate. ain't got time for the bull shit.. but i'll be real. i hate bein a marathon runner. i envy the minute men. i'm too damn lazy to be puttin in all this work got damn. i wanna be like bernie mac (RIP!). 3 minutes! that's all i really want... ain't got no damn time to be puttin in all nighters.. fuck i look like? that's why i mastered the art of fakin it... didn't even know dudes could do that did ya? if you a marathon runner like me you'd know. ain't got the stamina to be doin that shit every night. clockin in at 9 pm finishin up when it's daylight outside.. ain't got time or stamina for all that.. sheit...

for real!

i wish my longest was five minutes...

all aboard the bullshit train got damn.

IFB: i'll be honest with you. i saw that you replied... but i didn't bother readin it. i'm just going let you know like this.. you're done. have no idea what you said. and in all honesty. i lost interest in what you have to say.

hrd thinks my dick is longer then yours. what do you have to say about that?
reply via pm. if you wanna continue that conversation, for whatever reason. just know..

that hrd believes my dick is longer then yours. smile! it's the internet.

ya'll forget who i am? allow me to reintroduce myself.
my name is madnis got damn. realest mothafucka on these got damn boards got damn. think it's some bullshit? i'll give you some bullshit but it'll be the realest bullshit you done ever seen got damn. for that matter the realest bullshit you ever read got damn.. but realize i'm dictatin this shit as you readin it got damn. MY VOICE COMING THROUGH GOT DAMN. fuck what you heard got damn.. it's what you readin that's being dictated as you read got damn.

official second edit: *looks at dully anna's post*

aww you poor thing. scared my opinion won't change even if i go "in-depth" with the game? well you ain't got nothin to worry about. that was just a formality. my life as an animator has literally killed most of my social life along with a good portion of my free time that i could use to play video games. most free time goes to shit like cleaning my apartment and trying to please my girl friend. so.. yeah. your poor attempt at a troll and or flame really wasn't necessary. you just look like a sad thing. like i picture you in front of your computer like, this man soiled on the name of soul calibur.. how dare he!
oh gee, my ass hole side is about to come out. let me stop.

official third edit:

GOD I MISSED BEING LONG WINDED!! THIS FEELS GOOD!!! onto the random post thread!

 

[IvyFanboy]

I have a idea:what if there wa s a soulcalibur history(like tekken tag ) ga

think I already handled replying to the OP prior to this mess. And in a round about sense I'm still somewhat reflecting upon it by answering the statements of someone responding to the OP...

but no...I'm the one who diverts these topics...cuz absolutely none of my posts talk about games mechanics, the evolution of the game, why going back is a bad idea, my opinion on pushing for new mechanics in response to the OP, my thoughts on returning SC charge, and the SC storyline...

Also I would like to state I'm a proud Magnum wearer. (because this is totally necessary to post and you all probably want to know more.)