Mi-na Matchup Discussion

TidalLeaf

[09] Warrior
So I'm new to Mina, currently trying her out, and I like her alot. She's fun, but doesn't seem like a particularly good char (which I'm fine with heh).

Anyways, I'm having alot of trouble against Hilde. She too, is a spacer, but seems to do it better then Mina does. Any tips? (I try and do 33AA at range to counter C3B, and it works sometimes)
 

Dullyanna

[10] Knight
Mina VS Hilde

You should try to step Hilde's C3 B, IMHO. Also, go for mixups or the appropriate SG damagers when Hilde's at disadvantage, if possible. She has a bit of an edge at close range, though all of her fast moves are high and/or linear. Also, remember that many of Mi-na's spacing moves leave her at slight disadvantage, which means you should focus on your defensive options against Hilde (i.e. GI, sidestep, 4B+K, and guarding). I wish I could give more/better advice, but I don't play good Hildegards enough. I also believe ShenYu has better experience with this, if I'm not mistaken.
 

TidalLeaf

[09] Warrior
Mina VS Hilde

4B+K I find works well. I usually get hit with C3B when I do a move, and my opponent moves an inch and sidesteps it (as either 1. I can't find good range, semi-fast horizontals that cover step to both sides or 2. She doesn't have any) then I get C3B'ed :( Damn C3A giving adv on block lol. I usually try to 22_88A up close, works okay.
 

Dullyanna

[10] Knight
Mina VS Hilde

Try to keep in mind how much Hilde's been charging her moves. 22_88A is great, but you have to be in mid-close range to hit with it, and Mi-na prefers mid-long range. If you're stuck up close, you should use throws and some quicker mids, since Hilde's likely still charging (And prolly expecting a throw, which she can counter with FC charge moves). Another issue is that she can pull charges out of her ass while stepping, which weakens Mi-na's FC 1B (Try to use that move a lot, though, especially after blocking C3 B). I'm just operating on theory for the most part, though.
 

TidalLeaf

[09] Warrior
Mina VS Hilde

I find that her being able to release charges while stepping weakens Mina a lot in general. Her mid-long range pokes seem to be extremely linear :( So basically the wind can blow Hilde an inch, and she will evade it. Any long range moves that cover step I'm missing?
 

Dullyanna

[10] Knight
Mina VS Hilde

33AA can be used to pressure the SG, but watch out that the second hit doesn't get GI'd. You should also keep stuff like 1A and 11A in mind (No, she can't really punish them if used properly). Anyway, I'm really thinking Mi-na needs to stick to mid range for this match, as much as possible. That's where she can deal step, hurt the SG, and get some safe mixups in, without worrying about ish like 6A+K.

Dullyanna abuses his mod powah! This thread is now about all of Mi-na's matchups. Still, let's talk about Hilde moar. She's one of Mi-na's worst matchups, IMHO.
 

TidalLeaf

[09] Warrior
Does Mina even have any matchups in her favour? And Hilde does seem to be her worst, as they both play at the same range (but Hilde does it better).
 

Dullyanna

[10] Knight
Mi-na has range, and ways to force opponents into range that is often favorable for her. She also has decent SG damage and pokes. Hilde gives Mi-na trouble, but not because she's better at range overall. She just has a few very threatening tools, as compared to Mi-na's entire moveset (Nothing really threatening, but it's all OK at range. I just wish more of her slow shit did good SG damage). I'd say her best matchups are against close/mid range characters like Mitsu and Yun, but that's just me.
 

ShenYu

[11] Champion
Hilde IMO is one of her worst matchups. Because Hilde can play at any range Mina does, and pretty much do it better than Mina. (at least in this matchup.) Oh and try any of your long range lows. You will get 6B+K'd on reaction by any decent Hilde with decent reflexes. Or if she was holding a B charge, you can enjoy getting punished almost no matter what range you were at. Except 2A+B. In which case you've probably alredy been 6B+K'd because even if you cancel the thing you can get hit by it on reaction.

When playing against Hilde with Mina I often resort to 9B+K series/throw mixups.
1) Because Hilde can't charge A that shit.
2) Because Hilde doesn't exactly have the greatest punishers for it if she guesses right.

Other moves to keep in mind would be 6B series once again for her generally weak punishers and inability to be charge A'd unless she by chance caught you while holding a B charge after blocking 6BB. In which case, keep doing 9B+K and B-throw MOAR so she stops that shit. And 22A, to stop her from abusing what might be the second best step in the entire game. Also, 4KB if she's trying to frame trap you. And against Hilde it's not bad by itself because of the weak punishers issue and the second hit tracking very well.
 

Dullyanna

[10] Knight
Hilde IMO is one of her worst matchups. Because Hilde can play at any range Mina does, and pretty much do it better than Mina. (at least in this matchup.) Oh and try any of your long range lows. You will get 6B+K'd on reaction by any decent Hilde with decent reflexes. Or if she was holding a B charge, you can enjoy getting punished almost no matter what range you were at. Except 2A+B. In which case you've probably alredy been 6B+K'd because even if you cancel the thing you can get hit by it on reaction.

When playing against Hilde with Mina I often resort to 9B+K series/throw mixups.
1) Because Hilde can't charge A that shit.
2) Because Hilde doesn't exactly have the greatest punishers for it if she guesses right.

Other moves to keep in mind would be 6B series once again for her generally weak punishers and inability to be charge A'd unless she by chance caught you while holding a B charge after blocking 6BB. In which case, keep doing 9B+K and B-throw MOAR so she stops that shit. And 22A, to stop her from abusing what might be the second best step in the entire game. Also, 4KB if she's trying to frame trap you. And against Hilde it's not bad by itself because of the weak punishers issue and the second hit tracking very well.
Something that I noticed: Hilde can't punish stuff like 1A, 11A, and 33AA at a distance on block. It may possibly be best to focus on CFs for this matchup. Like ShenYu said, though, you should be very careful using them (i.e. when you're sure she's holding a B charge). Lol, many Hilde players on here forget that 6B+K even exists, but it's stupid to base your game on something like that.
 

ShenYu

[11] Champion
I really don't know why some Hilde's forget about 6B+K. That move is like god against slow long range lows. (ie. Mina's)
 

Dullyanna

[10] Knight
I really don't know why some Hilde's forget about 6B+K. That move is like god against slow long range lows. (ie. Mina's)
Because they're too busy mindlessly whoring charges, I'd imagine. One person in her forum was talking about the issues that Asty's 1A gave Hilde before I reminded them about 6B+K, lol... Regardless, I'm trying to think of how to go about CFing Hilde when the player in question doesn't have their head up their ass. I'm starting to think it has a lot of guesswork involved... lol, I have to go check Mi-na's best horizontal SG damagers.
 

Dullyanna

[10] Knight
That depends on how he plays. Does he do a lot of JF throws? Does he have a solid wakeup game? Also, remember (Or learn, if you haven't), how to deal with Asty's slow, long ranged attacks.
 

hotnikkelz

johNNy blaZe
Heh Asta is a brute...you have to note when he can use the ground pickup over the stomp. If you sideroll in certain situations then you would get tagged. My advice, is get up and prepare to break throws. Or get up and instantly gamble an 8A+B (which has a great starting TC). Of course depending on how well you read him. Harass him at mid range exclusively with your 1B stuff, 4A and 6B stuff. Asta can't punish 6B string for instance. Work that gauge severely and deliberately.
Introduce 9A into your game as it covers Mina's weak side. 33A is actually very decent against him at mid range since he won't be able to punish it. And don't forget to GI.

8A+B is very important cuz it's cover all, it's like a shield to protect yourself. Asta can punish with probably bullrush if he knows that he can, but still at least try it in the matchup (at tip) to see how he responds to it.
B+K is actually decent aginst fatties like him, cuz of his hitbox. Remember 5.5 blocked B+K = CF. It's not too unsafe vs Asta i don't think, don't take my word for it, try it yourself. He might at most get a WS K....but somehow i doubt it.
 

ShenYu

[11] Champion
Yeah my advice is to abuse 6BB in this matchup. At least until he stops bullrushing you. Not really sure what other advice to give. Except that 3bK can be pretty useful in this matchup as well when you dont have enough frames to beat bullrush with 6BB.
 

page

[11] Champion
As of a about a week ago my Mina is pretty much just an anti-Taki tool, or against people who I think might actually fall for stuff.

Of all the characters I currently play against Taki is the only one I'd say Mina actually fares well against, and that's only because 4A solves PO 99% of the time.

I also feel alright against NM, but I still think Rock serves me better there. My main problem is usually that I just can't punish well enough to keep good players from walking all over Mina.
 

hotnikkelz

johNNy blaZe
I also feel great against everyone, when i use Rock. My main problem is usually that I just can't punish well enough to keep good players from walking all over Mina.
I corrected your post a bit :)

Mina's punishment game....blows.
You're not going to punish much with her. Your tools for punishment however would be 8A+B vs whiffs.

6B+K, 6AK, 4B and K for poor bs moves.
 

Kuriko

[08] Mercenary
Right now, I'm definitely not good enough for things like tiers to matter for me (or the people I play against), but if I decide to go to tournaments in the future, would Mina be able to compete at all? It seems the consensus is that she's a pretty bad character, and people are even saying she's the worst in the tier discussion thread. I play SSBM competitively, and hoping to avoid a repeat of what happened there (first main was a low tier, eventually deciding to switch to top/high after some tourneys). Really asking an honest question here, please no flames. Thanks.