Raphael General Discussion / Q&A

8A+B should catch those since they are i13. it seems the wiki may be mistaken cuz it says 8A+B dosnt work on SL yet thats the main reason why i use it in that situation is to catch 2As that will beat the throw. im not near my console but would neone like to dbl check that
 
youngfox said:
8A+B should catch those since they are i13. it seems the wiki may be mistaken cuz it says 8A+B dosnt work on SL yet thats the main reason why i use it in that situation is to catch 2As that will beat the throw. im not near my console but would neone like to dbl check that
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Special lows can be GIed by either anti-low or anti-mid aGIs.
 
Gamegenie222 said:
^Dont forget about 4A+B after 11K on people with a fast FC A/ 2A that are S.Low and that are fast like Leixia and Natsu.
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This works way better than it should. Also works after AB on hit too, basically, anything that's even or ok on frames makes a decent set up for Raph's aGI'es. Of course use at own risk, certain characters you should never try this though. Stick to jGing or 9Bing the 2A follow up instead.

CappuccinoJak said:
i assume this has something to do with all the iprep stuff in the glitch thread? anywho, i don't really use raph's aGI very often though. it's kinda tough to land since it only hits horizontals. the main aGIs i use consistently are hilde's, zwei's, and both pyrrha's.
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Don't listen to Zany, just don't act like you're some how better than us because we understand the inherent risk to said moves and think it's generally better to leave those alone when forming a strong consistent Raph style.
 
66K has ended up as basically un-comboable after, and a little too far for you to run up and apply a grounded mixup.

I don't like the move because i'm not too sure what to do if it hits, but I like it on block because the opponent rarely take advantage of their +9 frames while being pushed back.
 
CappuccinoJak said:
yeah definitely, i never really cared for his aGIs other than for the style points lol.

is there anything you can do after 66K? i know that 33B works after it, but only when you land the 66K really close or near a wall.
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After 66K.................. I dunno, I'm really curious too as I only use 66K against the ringside usually post GI so if it works then there's nothing left for me to do lollers.
 
i always thought 66k was used just to build space, its great against those short range characters when you need to go back to the keep away game
 
I noticed that 8A+B sends an opponent high in the air if you hit him while he is jumping. It also works with Yoshi's flying stance. How do I make use of it to do more dmg?
 
Delloso said:
I noticed that 8A+B sends an opponent high in the air if you hit him while he is jumping. It also works with Yoshi's flying stance. How do I make use of it to do more dmg?
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Paranormal Oreo made this video a while ago. It only works near walls. Otherwise people will air control after 8A+B. Thanks for this option against Yoshi btw.
 
It doesn't require walls, does it?

I always land a 33KB after the extra launch, regardless of walls. Then again, if it's AC'able - I'd be flabbergasted if someone knew Raphael so intrinsically that they would react to it quickly enough.
 
I've never messed with 8A+B like that although I should tinker with it also 66K is a whatever move to me but it is part of Raph's i20 club of moves along with 236B and 44K and it should be used more as a punisher for ring outs if possible.

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Zanaken said:
I always land a 33KB after the extra launch, regardless of walls. Then again, if it's AC'able - I'd be flabbergasted if someone knew Raphael so intrinsically that they would react to it quickly enough.
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I won't speak for players other than myself, but if there's any possibility of me getting hit in the air I'll already be holding an AC direction down. I got that ingrained SSB directional influence habit. However, if they get hit by just the 2nd hit while jumping they won't be able to air control until they get hit again.
 
Hey guys, just picked up raph so I could better understand his game ( he gives me alot of trouble when i fight him ) and i was wondering what everyone's thoughts on 2/8B+K were. It kills step from about a character length away and if it connects its 62 damage meterless. I realize it is situational and you have to be able to guess which way your opponent will step but alot of people tend to pick a direction and stick with it. But i dont think i've ever seen it used in any fight i've ever had with raph.

tl;dr: Thoughts on 2/8B+K?
 
Copy pasting some earlier post I wrote;

If anyone is interested by the way, Raphael's needle attacks are mostly string based in my opinion. They also deserve more investment by most players, even if you think you've gotten use from it already.

Some uses include;

Sidestep 2/8B+K
Raw 2/8B+K on opponent's step or attack (Lexia WS B is a good example, or nearly half of Xiba's moves if used right)
On attack - NH 1K (makes 1K a good punish due to the mix-up) / 4A, fair few actually
Catches tech (CH 2+3rd hit A+BA / CH 33B)
After the opposing needle wiffs. A sort of twitch cancel attack / taunt cancel attack variation. Try out 2B+K 8B+K and you will get a surprising amount of CH catches.

6B+K is just a golden STFU tool in my opinion. I use it a lot vs 6B+K happy Violas.

The best way to use 2/8 variations raw is to remember that they don't build a 180 degree cone around Raph, as might be intuitive to think, but rather a 90-120 degree cone - between them. This narrow range is actually weaker due to its deceptive size rather than lack-there-of. If you get my drift...

Talking of combos:

2/8B+K 3A WS 3A WS 3B Prep BB BE - Highest guaranteed wall combo
2/8B+K 3A WS 3A WS 3B Prep BBB - Leaves them standing in a brilliant mix-up situation + position.
2/8B+K A+BA 66A+B - Highest guaranteed meterless combo - 1A follows well, and you can try and swap 66A+B for iPrep.
2/8B+K 3B Prep BB BE - NOT WORTH IT OUTSIDE A KILL
2/8B+K 3B Prep BBB
2/8B+K 3A+B:5 - Bit iffy, but can lead to some good range if you need to start something new. More than anything, this gets your opponent more tech happy, and traps follow.

Good needle use, kinda like 33B and others, can make you a tech trap monster. Once they want to stop doing that, you move onto other parts of your game.

Also, Needle shares a stun with CH 3rd hit 6BBB, so you can't have both in one combo or tech trap string - Just FYI - No CE, 2B, A+BA follow-ups.
 
I think the needles are actually pretty good if your opponent sidesteps predictably (which they always do against Raphael) or abuses moves that TS/TC like Pyrrha's 22K.

Trust me my brother learned this the hard way.
 
2 points:
1. 6B+K is very interesting in that Raph's hurtbox retreats a bit while he thrusts forward, so he is surprisingly evasive during it. It'll look like he TC's but I think its because he leans back so much certain highs will whiff. You won't get CH by having your hand get caught in moves like 3B or 6B or even BB where Raph advances.

2. 2_8B+K: mentally i think you should only consider using it when you "could have" used 2A. The range on the move may be a bit more (it visually is more than 3A), but the further away from Raph the more exact your opponent's hurtbox must be relative to Raph's alignment. The rewards on hit on this move is tremendous (A+BA into 66A+B, 2A into mixup, or 3A into wall splat), and certainly this is an area where I lack in my game.
I suppose you have to strategically look for opportunities to land 2_8B+K (while I'm more content to grab/2A) since i'm pretty sure it'll definately shock your opponent.

--After A+BA on hit, if (instead of 66A+B followup) you dash up for a 11K mixup and it hits, you'll send em backturned so see what you can get from that position
 
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