Siegfried Patch 1.02 Change List & Discussion

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Reptile said:
Wow stop complaining about backdash already it wasnt even one of siegfried strenghts anyway. I'm finding this a buff for him as most characters have more problems dealing with his frame traps now. For example after AgA on block B6 and 3B works really well now that they can't block it instantly if they try to move. Actually I'm finding 3B to work wonders against retreating opponents now. Oh man I need to stop playing this guy and concentrate on my main already.
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We're not complaining. I don't know where you got that from my post. We're discussing what options are available once the opponent gets inside. There were many ways you could used backstep pre-patch. It worked especially well against characters like Pyraa and Natsu. Backstep --> whiff --> 3B everyday of the week.

Of course there are advantages for Sieg (like the one you mentioned) with the nerfed backstep, but there will be times when you just want to GTFO.
 
Reptile said:
Wow stop complaining about backdash already it wasnt even one of siegfried strenghts anyway.
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It's not about the character necessarily, it's about the system... and it just so happens that this affects his ability to zone/control space which IS one of his strengths.

Reptile said:
For example after AgA on block B6 and 3B works really well now
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That worked before, thanks... Although I do imagine that i will work better now... So will 1k -> WR B.

- I.C.E.
 
I dunno about you guys....

I never thought Siegfried was close to bottom tier to start with... but this patch just made him much stronger....

that's just how I personally feel

-LAU
 
I agree, a lot of his MU's feel easier. The most difference i can tell is in the Natsu and Leixia MU.
Xiba, Maxi, Mitsu, Pyrrha and Omega feel easier as well.

Ivy still feels like a fairly even MU tbh.
...Viola feels harder :(
 
LAU said:
I dunno about you guys....

I never thought Siegfried was close to bottom tier to start with... but this patch just made him much stronger....

that's just how I personally feel

-LAU
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I haven't had a chance to try against a huge number of match-ups, but people cannot simply backstep out of sieg agA/ SCH B on oki pressure in this iteration and are forced to block and eat guard damage or try something risky. Moves are unsafer from the rest of the cast. I am sad to say I was unfamiliar with how awesome (B) was for getting into SBH for loads of damage pre-patch but am glad to see it is intact.

I almost had an anxiety attack because I was worried they changed the timing for iagA, but the not being able to do 2/4/8~ agA due to fixing a/b/kG cancel fix is a bit of a loss. 6~agA remains untouched which is the most important but those other ones were nice for whiff punishing.

My only complaints with this patch are the unnecessary buffs to Astaroth such as 63214:A+G doing close to 100 damage, 107 with meter, and about as much as 22bA+B+K, 28:B+G -_-. Couple that with 22B being deceptively hard to JG and 44A having enough pushback to backstep safely afterwards, I think astaroth has become significantly stronger.

However, I think overall the changes to movement make Siegfried much more threatening, something he could definitely use.
 
I played a bit today and he still has no tracking, do not whiff punish with SCH B. or 22_88BB. >.<
 
PyroZamfir said:
My only complaints with this patch are the unnecessary buffs to Astaroth such as 63214:A+G doing close to 100 damage, 107 with meter, and about as much as 22bA+B+K, 28:B+G -_-. Couple that with 22B being deceptively hard to JG and 44A having enough pushback to backstep safely afterwards, I think astaroth has become significantly stronger.
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At the same time, backstepping was severely nerfed, and that hurts Astaroth in quite a few matchups. Also, he's still going to have a tough time against Viola, Pyrrha (both normal and omega), APat, and Cervy.

You of all people should know that the Sieg/Asta matchup is pretty much 50/50 from the hundreds of matches we've played. That single A grab buff won't be changing that any time soon.
 
LAU said:
this is why your focus should be on 22A because that shit never whiffs.

-LAU
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Bad advice. You cannot survive on a whiffpunisher that doesn't even do 20% the opponent's life. If you really must use a horizontal to whiffpunish, at least use jagA or 3A.

Or even better, learn to use iWS B from step. Ive been experimenting with this one a lot lately and havent run into any whiffing issues at all. That includes stupid shit like Omegas DNS B or Leixias various retarded hitboxes.

Also, I don't want to make the impression that I defend Namcos laziness, but a lot of the trouble with whiffing whiffpunishers can be fixed with knowledge. As stupid as that is, the whiffing is actually consistent. You can reproduce a whiffing scenario from matchplay in training mode a thousand times and learn how to adapt to it. That's how [2_8]B+K~SCH B was discovered. While this doesn't fix SCH B's whiffing issues in every situation, it makes it a lot more reliable for its intended purpose.

Similarly, you can learn when 22B series and 3B work and when they don't. But really, learn to use iWS B from step. That shit is gold.
 
Sacharja said:
Bad advice. You cannot survive on a whiffpunisher that doesn't even do 20% the opponent's life. If you really must use a horizontal to whiffpunish, at least use jagA or 3A.

Or even better, learn to use iWS B from step. Ive been experimenting with this one a lot lately and havent run into any whiffing issues at all. That includes stupid shit like Omegas DNS B or Leixias various retarded hitboxes.

Also, I don't want to make the impression that I defend Namcos laziness, but a lot of the trouble with whiffing whiffpunishers can be fixed with knowledge. As stupid as that is, the whiffing is actually consistent. You can reproduce a whiffing scenario from matchplay in training mode a thousand times and learn how to adapt to it. That's how [2_8]B+K~SCH B was discovered. While this doesn't fix SCH B's whiffing issues in every situation, it makes it a lot more reliable for its intended purpose.

Similarly, you can learn when 22B series and 3B work and when they don't. But really, learn to use iWS B from step. That shit is gold.
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I guess i was just being vague but i do feel this move isnt used enough by most sieg players.... obviously depending on situation different punish is better.... im not gonna only do 22a when i can easily combo them and stuff i just think the move is under used thats all

-LAU
 
Sandman said:
Sorry if I'm an idiot...iWS B? There's a just input for WS B?
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i = instant. It's not really a just input, it's just a way to signify doing a WR move from neutral, essentially. The notation looks kind of like this:

:(2)::G: ~ release :G: ~ release :2: ~ :(B):
 
Not sure if anyone has tried this out post-patch. Go into training mode, pick Leixia as your opponent, set AI to guard all, and do 66A at point blank range. It'll whiff randomly. I've whiffed it 5 consecutive times. If you put some space between the characters, it won't whiff. I'm not sure if this happens against other characters. Something to keep in mind during tournaments I suppose.
 
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