The SC Revival Thread

[HajimeOwari]

I am sad that no one has to present appropriate credentials to talk in these threads.

Tell Jaxel that's something new to implement to the site. A forum for people with credentials only. hah.

 

[AriesWarlock]

I think most of the issues don't revolve around the organizers or the community but the creators themselves, Project Soul.

Indeed. What I just want to ask is whenever Namco announces SCV and they call the same guys they call to test it and later appear on 1up's show (I forgot their names) is to please have them ask if for the new iteration they are committed to supporting the game longer not only through DLC but balance patches until the game is at least, somewhat, more balanced rather than leaving it in the state the SCIV was. Namco/project soul needs to understand they have to be a bit more community centric when it comes to fighting games.

 

[Malice]

Indeed. What I just want to ask is whenever Namco announces SCV and they call the same guys they call to test it and later appear on 1up's show (I forgot their names) is to please have them ask if for the new iteration they are committed to supporting the game longer not only through DLC but balance patches until the game is at least, somewhat, more balanced rather than leaving it in the state the SCIV was. Namco/project soul needs to understand they have to be a bit more community centric when it comes to fighting games.

Soul Calibur 4 is very balanced. Not only that, but it's still the best next-gen fighter out there. The problem is that people don't want to come out of the house to play it.

The only real way to support a fighting game is by bringing out a new iteration of it like what Capcom is doing with SSF4. Other than that, it's really up to the players to keep a fighting game alive. Mahvel is still alive. Super Turbo is still alive. The World Cup in Cannes had alot of hype. So why can't Soul Calibur 4 have the same lasting power?

It's also unrealistic for a company in Japan to be more community centric to a handful of tournament players. There's only 5000+ on this forum. The game sold 2.5 million. They aren't going to make major changes to a game based on what we say when casual players make up the larger market for this game.

Even when a new game comes out, we'll be back in the same situation again where after a year and most people will move on to something else, no matter how balanced the game might be.

A new game would make it easier to keep things alive, but it's really lies on the shoulders of the players and their local community to keep things going. You can't expect Namco to do it for you, and you can't expect a scene to just fall in your lap without some work. I just think most people are content with just playing this game online and will put up with lag and whatnot since it's less work than trying to play this game offline and offers an endless supply of opponents. Or rather just play something else entirely.

I have been trying to think of ways to revive this game, but as long as there's online play and people have weak ass excuses to not travel to a tournament, then the only thing that can bring a revival is a new game. So we'll see if one is announced at E3.

But SC4 is still awesome. Find some friends and play it.

 

[teflon2105]

Soul Calibur 4 is very balanced. Not only that, but it's still the best next-gen fighter out there. The problem is that people don't want to come out of the house to play it.

The only real way to support a fighting game is by bringing out a new iteration of it like what Capcom is doing with SSF4. Other than that, it's really up to the players to keep a fighting game alive. Mahvel is still alive. Super Turbo is still alive. The World Cup in Cannes had alot of hype. So why can't Soul Calibur 4 have the same lasting power?

It's also unrealistic for a company in Japan to be more community centric to a handful of tournament players. There's only 5000+ on this forum. The game sold 2.5 million. They aren't going to make major changes to a game based on what we say when casual players make up the larger market for this game.

Even when a new game comes out, we'll be back in the same situation again where after a year and most people will move on to something else, no matter how balanced the game might be.

A new game would make it easier to keep things alive, but it's really lies on the shoulders of the players and their local community to keep things going. You can't expect Namco to do it for you, and you can't expect a scene to just fall in your lap without some work. I just think most people are content with just playing this game online and will put up with lag and whatnot since it's less work than trying to play this game offline and offers an endless supply of opponents. Or rather just play something else entirely.

I have been trying to think of ways to revive this game, but as long as there's online play and people have weak ass excuses to not travel to a tournament, then the only thing that can bring a revival is a new game. So we'll see if one is announced at E3.

But SC4 is still awesome. Find some friends and play it.

I agree wit everything in this post
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Indeed. What I just want to ask is whenever Namco announces SCV and they call the same guys they call to test it and later appear on 1up's show (I forgot their names) is to please have them ask if for the new iteration they are committed to supporting the game longer not only through DLC but balance patches until the game is at least, somewhat, more balanced rather than leaving it in the state the SCIV was. Namco/project soul needs to understand they have to be a bit more community centric when it comes to fighting games.

SC4 is balanced i know your like the hilde's unbalance the game but she is an controversy char and controversy sells.

As far as vader and app go i dislike they in the game the idea of shooting out powers shouldn't be in SC5.

I'll like too see an char that does the ooposite of hilde and annoys people.

 

[Jaxel]

Frankly I don't plan on commenting on anything relating to the community at this point... 8WR will be going under a MASSIVE overhaul during the next few months, and right now my mind is more focused on that. When the new 8WR is ready to be launched, I will review the existing procedures (or lack there-of) and make sure everything gets streamlined, and as transparent as I can make them as possible.

That being said, I did not read OOF's thread, or S-U's. From what I have gathered though, I have been told that OOF's thread was mainly a discussing about BANNING in Soulcalibur V; in which he was trying to create a series of guidelines for why a character would be banned. I find this topic completely insulting to the community as a whole. Especially since I have stated many times that Hilde was NOT banned because she was "broken"; she has been banned because she is a detriment to the community, and if you want any chance of this "Soulcalibur Revival", she needs to disappear. OOF's thread assumed that we were a "ban-happy" community; and it insinuate to all other fighting game communities that this assumption is true. Yet, it clearly takes us FOREVER to make a decision; it took us forever to ban VC in SC3, and now in SC4 the damage has already been done. So obviously we are not ban-happy.

I don't know why OOF's thread was hard deleted, as it should have just been closed. This is one of the issues I will be resolving in the next few months. As for S-U's thread getting closed... S-U, STFU. You know EXACTLY why your thread was closed, and lobo even did post a comment before it was closed.

 

[AriesWarlock]

Soul Calibur 4 is very balanced. Not only that, but it's still the best next-gen fighter out there. The problem is that people don't want to come out of the house to play it.

The only real way to support a fighting game is by bringing out a new iteration of it like what Capcom is doing with SSF4. Other than that, it's really up to the players to keep a fighting game alive. Mahvel is still alive. Super Turbo is still alive. The World Cup in Cannes had alot of hype. So why can't Soul Calibur 4 have the same lasting power?

It's also unrealistic for a company in Japan to be more community centric to a handful of tournament players. There's only 5000+ on this forum. The game sold 2.5 million. They aren't going to make major changes to a game based on what we say when casual players make up the larger market for this game.

Even when a new game comes out, we'll be back in the same situation again where after a year and most people will move on to something else, no matter how balanced the game might be.

A new game would make it easier to keep things alive, but it's really lies on the shoulders of the players and their local community to keep things going. You can't expect Namco to do it for you, and you can't expect a scene to just fall in your lap without some work. I just think most people are content with just playing this game online and will put up with lag and whatnot since it's less work than trying to play this game offline and offers an endless supply of opponents. Or rather just play something else entirely.

I have been trying to think of ways to revive this game, but as long as there's online play and people have weak ass excuses to not travel to a tournament, then the only thing that can bring a revival is a new game. So we'll see if one is announced at E3.

But SC4 is still awesome. Find some friends and play it.

Well, you say it's very balanced but for the past months I do remember many people saying they are leaving SCIV because of Hilde, and I am sure there's even more of those outside this board.

It's not absolutely unrealistic if we assume the creators are also passionate fighting game fans. Just because there are more casuals doesn't necessarily mean the developers are entirely satisfied with sales only, they might like it if fans were play the game for long periods until the next sequel. But I can only assume.

I'd like to play SCIV offline more, but people over here are playing other games.

 

[Unknown Legend]

I think with online implemented into the game Namco has to pay attention to the community. This is because with online any scrub can witness and find out how to do the doom combo. This will make the game not fun for a lot of casual players who play online. So it'd be in Namco's best interest to listen to what the community has to say about what is broke, what characters are overpowered/underpowered because it will eventually start to be abused online making casual gamers find the game not fun at all.

As for the relevence of these threads.... To put it simply things could have been handled better in SC4. There were a lot of new and talented players who were on the site and going to majors etc etc who left because no measures were taken to neutralize Hilde's doom combo. Many suggested a stage ban so people would not lose there main to a ban but no one listened. As a result we lost many of those new players and even some good ATL players who've been in the community for a while. This is something that shouldn't be ignored. No one should be blamed because as Jaxel said the damage is already done. But the community as a whole should grow, attempt to do things better the next time. All these individual grudges do nothing for the community. So who cares if there was an intended insult(or not) in creating these thread, the overall point of the thread should be more important.

But Malice is completely right in the fact that people should keep playing. It's kind of hypocritical for me to say seeing as I haven't attended much offline, but I do try. And someone could ask why I even care about what goes on offline if I don't show up much... The reason is that when I log on and see huge numbers at a tournament it's actually motivation to to show up and try to improve, but when numbers dwindle as much as I may love the game it kills the motivation.

 

[BLACKSTAR]

I agree that Namco-Bandai could and probably should have handled things better with the lack of compelling DLC, issues in balance, and other things. Things like the halloween, and x-mas dlc (which were extremely weak), the fact that they never released the collector's edition pieces as dlc, and gameplay features like, the one patch in January that nobody can figure out what was for (making it seem like it provided marginal if ANY improvement to the game), or the lack of any small updates to balance things to make the entire cast as a whole a little more competitive had shown me that NB's interests had completely shifted from SC4 to Tekken.

but then reality sets in, and i contrast the fact that Namco-Bandai is a BUSINESS. In light of their past record (SC3) as well as the lack of any arcade release to as a way to help balance the game, I have to say NB did a good job, or at least a "good enough" job to keep the game fun for a long period of time before the next entry. I still play it.

Aside from hilde and the joke characters (including algol), sc4 overall is a more balanced entry in the series, with pretty much everyone in the cast able to reasonably win against the other members (again, aside from hilde/joke characters). I believe NB probably realized this and decided to shift all of their resources their next money-making resources, including SC4:BD, T6, and *hopefully* SC5. My point being, to certain members, you cant really point the finger solely at NamcoBandai for the decline in the SC community. Even if NB DID bring out another patch for SC4, judging from Broken Destiny, I doubt that anything would change much (with hilde as an example, it could arguably be WORSE)

SC4 sold over 2 million copies, mainly because there was nobody else on the market at the time. The success is well more that any pre-SF4 fighter could hope for, and because of that, 8wayrun and the SC community thrived. That being said, the biggest test of the SC community was when SF4 came, and when Tekken came, both would be the biggest determining factor in swaying players away from SC. Many players were inevitably lost because of that, but honestly, from coming from a situation where SC4 dominated to where there's a million different decent fighters on the market, its hard to keep community momentum, no matter what game is in the situation.

Also, on another note, in my opinion as a Georgia player, anyone mentioning ATL or ATL players as some kind of 'major determining factor' in SC's community needs to just stop talking. ATL and ATL tournament organizations are actually monopolized by pretty much one group of people, and because of which, suffers heavily from a 'clique-ish' mentality of where if you aren't friends with Magnicious, RTD, or about 4-5 other people, then your opinion really doesn't matter. There is no 'community' in SC in ATL because that same group (including those trolling 8wayrun threads claiming SOUL CALIBURS DEAD over and over after evo) chose to STOP SUPPORTING SC4 and move to pretty much exclusively SF4 and Tekken. Biggest proof, Final Round XIII, the 'biggest tournament in the south' or 'first major of the year' (take your pick), which I attended last weekend, decided to completely AXE SC4, instead supporting such wonderful games as KOF XII. Seriously? Its impossible to foster a community with out community events, and by this token, 'ATL', or what the community KNOWS as ATL, pretty much has no say in the SC community as a whole.

By this I think that Malice is right, we have to get SC going in our own communities in some way. In the small town I live in, everyone is all into madden or smash. I'm thinking about starting my own event with FGs in the fall, so if I can get it started, hopefully I can get that going for SC4 support.

 

[Marginal]

SC4 is balanced i know your like the hilde's unbalance the game but she is an controversy char and controversy sells.

Use a low tier character for a while then see how well the claim it's balanced holds up.

 

[Unknown Legend]

BLACKSTAR84

When I mentioned ATL I wasn't talking about tournament organizers, nor did say that there was a large SC community in ATL. My point was that there were a handful of players there and some of them were top players in the community. I wasn't inferring that SC was the biggest game in ATL or anything like that but just that people who were valuable to the community who happened to live in ATL left suddenly. It's true other games came out but that was not the reason expressed by those members as to why they lost interest in the game... So to sum up what I'm saying is 3-4 top players is important to the community. I mean it's like losing the some of the best players in a sports league like the NBA, NFL, MLB, public interest would drop.

 

[LP]

Soul Calibur 4 is very balanced. Not only that, but it's still the best next-gen fighter out there. The problem is that people don't want to come out of the house to play it...But SC4 is still awesome. Find some friends and play it.

Fuck Malice; your name should be the Truth!

Use a low tier character for a while then see how well the claim it's balanced holds up.

Unless you're using Mina, I don't see your point. Characters are going to have bad match-ups - it's a sign of any diverse fighting game, but to speak as if some characters are just so terrible that they can't win is a horrible act.

On top of that, though entirely opinion (and I'm not saying some characters don't have it better than others), I think half of the reason you rarely see anyone beasting with low tier characters (especially in a game like this as opposed to, say, SF4) is because you get people who have this attitude that they can't play with a character because they're low tier or, so much worse than that, the player who DO choose to take up those characters and then, instead of looking back and fixing what they may need to work on, blame their character's 'tier' for their own ass-whipping they caught.

P.S. - I happen to think that, if not for her great fundamentals, step, and high damage output (when all taken together, mind you), Sophie is honestly one of the worst characters in the game.

 

[Malice]

Fuck Malice; your name should be the Truth!

I need to put that in my sig once I leave work, but right now, quoted for muthafuckin' truth. I got more truth for y'all later on. Stay tuned.

 

[BLACKSTAR]

Dman, I'm with you all the way on that. I'm just a little salty because there's more of us out there...! There were OTHER good GA players just coming into the scene, such as me, smallsouljah, and BAIKOU (who I had seen beat RTD's top-placing Hilde on several tourney matches, with TALIM, his main), who were cut short over some politics before we were given proper chance for real enjoyment and recognition; even though the game is still relatively new! I shouldn't have to go to another state to play a SC tourney but that's what its come down to.

But anyway, back to the topic....

 

[Marginal]

Unless you're using Mina, I don't see your point. Characters are going to have bad match-ups - it's a sign of any diverse fighting game, but to speak as if some characters are just so terrible that they can't win is a horrible act.

Maxi can consistently win tournaments? Really? LMAO! Yeah, you go and play him right unlike everyone else. Bah.

Why does anyone get a pass with M-In-Ah? They should just sack up and play more awesome too.

 

[InsaneKhent]

Mina

M-In-Ah?

Haven't you guys heard the news?

Seong Mi-na vs. The World!

 

[LP]

Maxi can consistently win tournaments? Really? LMAO! Yeah, you go and play him right unlike everyone else. Bah.

Why does anyone get a pass with M-In-Ah? They should just sack up and play more awesome too.

It's the player (not the character) who wins tournaments. I don't play with Maxi as I don't like the character, but what, do tell, is keeping him from winning tournaments? If you have to completely outplay your peers, so what? I thought that was what competition is; no one said that it'd be easy. Hell, your peers are trying to get the monies, why would they give you a easy chance (as opposed to trying to give you no chance at all) because you chose to pick a character you have the misconception has no chance and think everyone should pity you? If you honestly feel that way, why don't YOU change from Maxi to one of these magical top tier characters and show me that YOU can consistently win tournaments with those characters and he's the only thing supposedly holding you back? Otherwise, remember the blessing's in the struggle.

 

[Chickenwing]

Haven't you guys heard the news?

Seong Mi-na vs. The World!

the....best...post.....ever

 

[Marginal]

It's the player (not the character) who wins tournaments.

That kinda defeats the whole concept of balance. Some characters have concretely better tools than others. If you use a low tier character, you can possibly win, but you have to work much harder to do so.

The whole idea that a game where two characters are banned and at least two characters are at a major disadvantage before anyone's even picked up a controller is considered balanced is absolutely absurd. (Especially if you compare it to a game that actually is better balanced like VF5 etc.)

If you honestly feel that way, why don't YOU change from Maxi to one of these magical top tier characters and show me that YOU can consistently win tournaments with those characters and he's the only thing supposedly holding you back? Otherwise, remember the blessing's in the struggle.

I don't think we're talking about the same concept. I'm saying that the game's not especially well balanced on a mechanical level. You are making up a brand new definition of balance to make your case. By your reasoning, every game is balanced, and it's just up to the players to try really really really hard to overcome any massive shortfalls that a character might have built into them.

I play Maxi because I enjoy the character, but look at the match up charts. I'm simply being realistic here.

 

[MONEYMUFFINS]

Sorry, but Marginal is correct.

Too many characters don't stand a good chance at competing on a fundamental level, based on their options for damage alone. The cast is unbalanced because not enough characters have viable moves against other characters. This can be measured if need be.

 

[teflon2105]

Use a low tier character for a while then see how well the claim it's balanced holds up.

No thx. The low tier characters are capable of winning just need too put in more effort wit them. Me preferably i'd rather stiick wit all high tier characters.