Viola Combo & Tech Trap Discussion

oh ok. so is there any thing in the combo filler where opponent become air controllable that I should avoid doing? I remember something about only being able to do AAB for 2 times or something like that
 
There is a sort of 'anti-viola' system in the game that restricts your ability to re-launch the opponent, similar to the wall splat system, where after using certain BEs in a row within the same combo, the opponent will instantly fall to the ground and escape the combo. This is generally relevant for all of her relaunches excluding 1 combo I am aware of.

There is a high level combo that consists of B+KBE>6B+K>B+KBE etc which is not considered in this system. Otherwise, things such as 44ABE>Back Throw>44ABE, 2B+KBE>air combo>2A+B>2B+KBE (more than two times in a combo will break it etc)

It sort of makes sense after you learn what is reasonable or not. However I can tell you that in a proper match, any combo that takes up more than 1 bar of meter is not worth it on a meter to damage efficiency ratio, as using 1 bar into a 6B+K mix-up has potential for significantly more damage, then say using 1 extra bar fo a mear 10-30 bonus in damage.

Kinda tired, just rambling my knowledge and exp in training mode.
 
undefined.yuuki said:
There is a sort of 'anti-viola' system in the game that restricts your ability to re-launch the opponent, similar to the wall splat system, where after using certain BEs in a row within the same combo, the opponent will instantly fall to the ground and escape the combo. This is generally relevant for all of her relaunches excluding 1 combo I am aware of.
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This isn't true. You can actually combo 66B 2B+K BE until death (unless they tech, of course).

I believe it's after about 25 hits that they fall to the floor, seeing as in the combo..
SET 3B W! 44aBE 2A WR B 2b+kBE A.A.B 2A+B 2b+kBE 6B+K B A.A.B
..they'll instantly fall down after any two hits, regardless of their properties..

Either that or there's the rule that if you do four-five in-air moves that make an enemy move uniquely (like Ivy's 1bBE), they'll fall down after the fourth or fifth.
 
MuffinMan123 said:
just started with viola, gonna ask tons of noob shit here and not gonna crawl through the 40 pages again, did it once half a year ago and already forgot most of the them because I haven't played sc5 since then.

so here goes the 1st one.

how do you cancel set 4A+B into B+K BE? I can't do it, consistently, what are the cues to help wit the timing? which moves are cancelable with B+K BE and what are the proper timing for them?

what can I do after set 4B? is 66A+BB the only good option?

is set 22A+B worth throwing out? it combos into 2B+K BE but the timing is so strict, and I can't figure out how to connect the AAB afterwards. do I need to run forward to connect AAB?

also, the combo listing says set 66B can combo into 2B+K BE, but computers keep teching out. I am guessing this was patched out but the combo listing wasn't updated?
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To answer your question about 22A+B, I like to use it as my stepkiller (besides 66AAB). The ORB version is the best because it combos into 66A+BB. If you land it SET, I like to only do 66A+B and then go into her 6B+K mixups.
 
MuffinMan123 said:
can you replace every single 6A+B 2B+K BE with 2A+B 2B+K BE in 50%~100% bar combos? how much is the damage difference?
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Yes you can. I never use 6A+B because if you do it wrong they can tech and you'll waste a BE. The damage difference isn't crazy, so it's fine to use 2A+B since it's very hard to mess up.
 
The "launch staling" system doesn't affect escapable combos, which is why 66B 2B+K BE "loop" works. Situations where the opponent can ukemi (and they do) without escaping the combo will reset the "launch stale". The number of allowed hits seems to vary based on moves used. Moves that allow air control seem to loop longer before dropping, such as Algol's 3B BE or Hilde's C2B BT K nonsense.

As for 6A+B versus 2A+B, the damage difference is substantial due to 2A+B's stun. Getting 2B+K BE to remain untechable is primarily a matter of launch height and is more consistent after B+K BE than after 3B AAB, for example. The damage is worth experimenting with to find what works for you. Also if they're teching after air hit 6A+B, introduce them to 44A BE tech trap's broken-ass damage.
 
MuffinMan123 said:
can you replace every single 6A+B 2B+K BE with 2A+B 2B+K BE in 50%~100% bar combos? how much is the damage difference?
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Ninjaguy446 said:
Yes you can. I never use 6A+B because if you do it wrong they can tech and you'll waste a BE. The damage difference isn't crazy, so it's fine to use 2A+B since it's very hard to mess up.
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You can only use :2::A+B: once in combos - it will only stun the first time you use it, and after that will not combo with :2::B+K: BE. You can use :6::A+B: as many times as you like.
 
Synalon said:
You can only use :2::A+B: once in combos - it will only stun the first time you use it, and after that will not combo with :2::B+K: BE. You can use :6::A+B: as many times as you like.
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Yeah but in my opinion it's not worth it. You can hoard the BE to get another combo for more damage. I'd cry if I landed 44AB but didn't have the meter because I spent it on 6A+B combos. It's more worth your while to stock up brave edges and minimize your chances of messing up and letting the opponent escape the combo. But in the end, it's your preference.
 
Synalon said:
You can only use :2::A+B: once in combos - it will only stun the first time you use it, and after that will not combo with :2::B+K: BE. You can use :6::A+B: as many times as you like.
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is there any other easy way to go into 2B+K BE? I don't want to mess up the timing for 6A+B

Ninjaguy446 said:
Yeah but in my opinion it's not worth it. You can hoard the BE to get another combo for more damage.
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but if I have the opportunity touch of death and end the game right there, it's definitely worth using up everything rather than gamble with mixups
 
Yes, I do combos with :2::A+B:, not least because I haven't got the :6::A+B: timing down right. I was answering MuffinMan's question; whether or not you can replace every instance of :6::A+B: in long combos ("50-100%" metre) with :2::A+B:, which you cannot, unless the number of instances is one.
 
MuffinMan123 said:
is there any other easy way to go into 2B+K BE? I don't want to mess up the timing for 6A+B


but if I have the opportunity touch of death and end the game right there, it's definitely worth using up everything rather than gamble with mixups
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Unfortunately not. :/ I have pathetically low execution skill and so have been bitten by this fact as well. Then again, if I can do :6::A+B: combos at least some of the time, you might have better luck with a little practice.
 
MuffinMan123 said:
I can't even do AAB consistently right now, I don't know why
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What? AAB is the easiest part. Are you sure you are doing AAB immediately after 3B? And after 6B+K B/66A you just pause for less than a second and wait until you feel that AAB will connect (usually almost immediately after also)
 
Ninjaguy446 said:
What? AAB is the easiest part. Are you sure you are doing AAB immediately after 3B? And after 6B+K B/66A you just pause for less than a second and wait until you feel that AAB will connect (usually almost immediately after also)
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Or you could just mash A until the second hit, then continue to mash B '^'
 
undefined.yuuki said:
Or you could just mash A until the second hit, then continue to mash B '^'
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Yeah, that works too, but sometimes they relaunch weird and they're falling to fast or were launched to high so you have to vary the timing or else you'll whiff. For instance, like if you do 4B 2B+K BE then the timing can be a bit awkward depending on the character, or when you're starting a combo off of double 2B+K. I can't think of any specific examples right now but there's a couple.
 
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