Astaroth Anti...

Combatting Speed?

Ashlotte is the exact same character as Astaroth movewise, except the gimped range. So unless you're that huge an Ashlotte fan that you can't bear to part with her, there's never any reason to pick anyone in that little star up there.

And yeah they're all banned because of range issues, Shura and Schezherahehzehzhezhe4ahd have some silly crap guaranteed that the normal Cervy and Amy don't.
 
Combatting Speed?

Mwab said:
Well,

I used the advice that you gave me in this thread and they work nice as alternatives to the rather straightforward :6::K:... but above all, I tried using Astaroth instead of Ashlotte and wow! The difference is huge indeed. Throws become alot more viable when my arms have the length of a regular attack!

I think that I might go with Astaroth as my "main" for now, to better get the hang of playing as him. I'll save Ashlotte for either special occasions or when I just feel like a change of appearance. :)
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he dosnt actually have more range, this is clearly seen on the Nightmare bonus character. He punches appear shorter, but the blue swipe that follows them is the size of nightmares giant hand and is further out then her own arm.
Ashlotte is broken because her arms are shorter but her grab range is still the same.
 
Combatting Speed?

and that makes her broken? lol in any case

2K is faster than any of your mids are now, so you might want to use it as an interrupt often
 
Combatting Speed?

GI more.

It's seriously buffed in this game especially for throw based chars like Asta/Rock.

Instant command throw 50/50.
 
Combatting Speed?

Niichts said:
he dosnt actually have more range, this is clearly seen on the Nightmare bonus character. He punches appear shorter, but the blue swipe that follows them is the size of nightmares giant hand and is further out then her own arm.
Ashlotte is broken because her arms are shorter but her grab range is still the same.
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ashlottes grab range is WAY shorter than astas, test it in training mode.
 
Combatting Speed?

I feel your pain Mwab.

I've found my best tools against fast characters are:

1. 6K. The universal get out card for Astaroth. Not always appropriate, but effective much of the time. You need to learn after which enemy strings 6K is guaranteed to hit. Otherwise it may be more appropriate to throw or GI.

2. Throws. A surprising amount of enemy attack strings leave opportunities for Astaroth to grab either during, or after. Sometimes your likelyhood of getting the grab is better if your back has been forced against the wall because you naturally end up closer together. HCB A+G is guaranteed ring out if your back is to the arena edge when you grab.*** HCB B+G is more appropriate if you back is to a wall. But basic throws are great as well.

3. Guard Impacts. It can be difficult getting a successful GI against some faster characters. But as Asta users we only need one opening and that should be a hefty chunk of the enemy life-bar gone.

4. 7B (I don't recommend 7A as it is less likely to hit, or 7K because it doesn't knock down). If you know the next attack is coming low. Sometimes a simple 7B attack jumping backwards can get you space to breath and get you a knockdown.

5. Crouching K to interrupt followed by 3K Bullrush from crouching. Remember you can delay the Bullrush if you think it will help.


*** This is disputed. I will further test this and re-edit if I have been wrong.
 
Combatting Speed?

You have to make your opponent hesitate as they try to pressure you with speed. Knowing when you can interrupt their offense with GI, 6K_4B_2K and even stepping very will make them slow down their pressure. Once that happens, the pace is in your favor to get in range and pressure with throw_mid.
 
Combatting Speed?

Thanks for all your input guys, now I should have some more tricks up my sleeve to utilize if (when-.-) I find myself in that horrid situation again. It really is alot easier to pull it off when using Astaroth as opposed to Ashlotte.

And KowtowRobinson, I am that huge of an Ashlotte fan to part with her completely. Therefore I'll keep her as a means of mixing things up whilst staying true to Asty's spirit. :)
 
Combatting Speed?

ojste said:
im pretty sure that throw doesnt ring out, it looks like it should but it doesnt >.<
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yes, doesn't ring out.
it does the same thing that the a+g air grab does and puts up an invisible wall taht pushes you out.
 
Combatting Speed?

ojste said:
im pretty sure that throw doesnt ring out, it looks like it should but it doesnt >.<
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Ok. I'll double test this. I'm happy to be corrected

I put it down because I know I've got RO with it more than once. Pehaps there's a special circumstance for it to RO.

I have also managed to RO with the air grab (not 28B+G), but that was interrupting a jumping attack and not from my launcher.
 
Combatting Speed?

CHIP_STAXMAN said:
Ok. I'll double test this. I'm happy to be corrected

I put it down because I know I've got RO with it more than once. Pehaps there's a special circumstance for it to RO.

I have also managed to RO with the air grab (not 28B+G), but that was interrupting a jumping attack and not from my launcher.
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ah yea, i mean the a+g from 2b+k, a+g.
the other one RO's
 
Combatting Speed?

haha just to add to the confusion, 28B+G can also ring out. if you land close enough to the edge and not ring yourself out, you will drop them out of the ring

every throw that ive had ring out with:
B+G (facing edge)
2A+G (facing edge)
2B+G (back to edge)
A+G air throw (back to edge)
28B+G (facing edge)
63214B+G, 66k (back to edge)
left? side throw (up on 1p side, facing edge)

hes a beast :o
 
Combatting Speed?

ojste said:
haha just to add to the confusion, 28B+G can also ring out. if you land close enough to the edge and not ring yourself out, you will drop them out of the ring

every throw that ive had ring out with:
B+G (facing edge)
2A+G (facing edge)
2B+G (back to edge)
A+G air throw (back to edge)
28B+G (facing edge)
63214B+G, 66k (back to edge)
left? side throw (up on 1p side, facing edge)

hes a beast :o
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i got 63214b+g to RO like once in practice mode, and i thought i could RO with it.
got some matches with buddies online, and i tried to RO with it and never did it RO!
but i found about the 66k followup for guaranteed RO later haha.
 
Who do you have the hardest time against?

Maxi and Setsuka for me.

Maxi because he's a stuffing machine, and I'm notoriously predictable as a "throws knees after everything" guy, especially online. I'll try to predict mix up spots and go for the knee counterhit instead of a GI, and this'll get me in trouble a lot when they're actually just cramming away D:

Setsuka because not only is she very good at stuffing once up close, but her options for closing are nasty. Its very very hard for astaroth to keep her out.
 
Who do you have the hardest time against?

Can people stop saying high/low game, high/low isn't even a mixup, mid/low is a mixup.

So from now on, the people saying high/low mixups start saying mid/low mixups.

That is all.
 
Who do you have the hardest time against?

Amy- Annhilates Soul Guage other then that no problems, since i have been playing against her a lot lately
Cassy- have to play incredibly safe because she can punish almost everything asty has
Sophie- Same as Cass
Raph- God its so hard to get use to not being able to step raph's shet. Lots of moves that tech crouch and it fcks me up..


For people saying maxi you can punish him between most of his strings as asty using 66K , 1B, 6AB depending on range ,6k, 2k, 1a. I have not had much issues with maxi. Taki is not too hard to deal with either, I play a nice GI game against her, Possesion is not too hard to deal with, and if they do hover your either hitting them in the air with 22_88B or GI the B. I hit hover all the time with 22_88B hover is not that fast. Whoever said cervy learn to shake. Like Amy a lot of cervy combos are shakable. Mitsu has a good 50/50 mixup game so it is not a matter of having issues dealing with him but guessing right and having a good post GI game.
 
Combatting Speed?

Things i use to combat speed hmm....

1.) 6k- But this can be punished so you have to train your opponent so this hits they will most likely expect this when your cornered so try not to abuse it.
2.) 6AB- I only use A most of the time except on CH which I will do B and combo into 2A+K which is unescapable now. The only thing bad is 6A has HORRIBLE RANGE.
3.) 6b- I use 6b sometimes especially on CH cause when they are close it will stun and lead into 22_66[K] to 22_88B (huge damage)
4.) 4b- Good and its not too slow and if it knocks down and they dont tech you get 1A+G for a nice wakeup game. You can command throw right after 1A+G.
5.) 4a- Situational but if it hits you get a huge spacer. I say situational because i use it depending on way char I am fighting.
6.) 2k- Like Tiamat said incredibly useful since it is much faster then most mids now and!!!! going into the next number
7.) WRK- Tech Crouches under highs, good for using randomly after 2k, if you get CH you get 2B+G which is like 81dmg, 2A+G (great spacer) mixup which all can be broke but great damage.
8.) 66K- Not incredibly fast but tech crouches and has great push back on impact useful for getting that spacing you need back.
9.) 63214B+G_A+G- A+G will flip the the fight around and now their back will be against the wall after they get up. B+G you can 22_88B for a great spacer, or 28B+G for less damage and to gtfo.
10.) Normal throws always good
11.) GI can make or break you so be careful
12.) 1b- Tech crouches hits low can be useful not fast though

Anyways hope that helps all you asty's out there.
 
Combatting Speed?

Very helpful indeed Nelson, a compilation of stuff to (try to, at least) use when you find yourself in a picky situation. Just last night I found the joys of the :2::K:, this is especially since since it's a low attack and should catch people off guard when they're used to the mid attacks.
 
vs. Taki Posession

Fighting Taki's PO game is one big guessing game between you and the Taki player. One thing to look out for is the pattern of the Taki player. A basic strategy is to simply observe her PO strings and see what PO move they generally spam.

Just remember that you have a better chance of countering Taki's PO if you block the the strings (usually AB or 1BA) that lead to PO. If her AB or 1BA strings hit you - its better to block, guess right and wait.

On block you have a couple of options for guessing the right counter, PO A and K can be ducked and countered by bullrush, PO B is relatively slow and you can either parry or sidestep it. Hover moves can be caught by 82B+G on reaction (or you can bullrush to cross under her and do a BT move). A simple 2A or 4B will quickly interrupt her PO A+B unblockable. 4B is good when she tries to circumcise...er...I mean exorcise you in your face and 2A is good when she moves at your side before using the unblockable. If you are fast enough, you can also go for a crouch throw.

I noticed that her PO 8wr is probably a big problem since she has a lot of dirty tricks like canceling the PO into Ninja bombs or a throw. I suggest that trying a PT when you think she will PO side step. Also be careful not to throw verticals haphazardly when you know that the Taki player likes to PO 8wr - her PO 8wr has a property called PO step that can literally teleport her to your backside if she manages to push 8 or 2 the moment you throw out your verticals. You might end up eating a unblockable from your back.

Also remember the only time Taki is in tech crouch mode is during her PO Rush (PO and running towards you) and when she activates her PO A+B unblockable.
 
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