1.03 Tier List Discussion (aka Argument)

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I was talking to RedDjinn in my edit.
@Hellbottom: I actually prefer the fake mammoth head from the last game. Also, a kudos for quoting FOTNS.
 
Dullyanna said:
Edit: We're not saying Rock is better than Kilik when it comes to his moveset. We (At least, some of us) are saying the Rock is better than most people assume, and that Kilik is not as good as many people claim.
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QFT

Though I personally think Kilik is better, a good Rock player can easily beat a bad Kilik player. That's all I'm maintaining. Rock is NOT a joke character, as many people assume.
 
I'll post this so people will shut up about tekken already..... This is JinMasters list from calibur forums.... they're discussing it there so i figure we could discuss it here... Dont ask me why whos where what how.... cause I dont know... but hey you can discuss and break it down...


Teir 1: Sopie, Voldo, Taki, Setsuka, Kilik

Teir 2: Cass, Asta, Ivy, Amy, Ralph, Yoshi, Algol, Cervy

Teir 3: Mitsu, Seig, Lizardman, Hilde, X

Teir 4: Knightmare, Tira, Talim, Zas

Teir 5: Maxi, Yun, Mina, Rock

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Tell me if you agree or disagree, and give me reasonable points to why 'XYZ' Character is in the incorrect tier. I feel this is 90% accurate.


Jinmaster
 
I've said earlier in this thread that I am too much of a noob to have a valid opinion on tiers, but even still, something seems very strange about Kilik being in the top tier, especially *above* Yoshimitsu, Cassandra and Cervantes.
 
Sporko said:
I've said earlier in this thread that I am too much of a noob to have a valid opinion on tiers, but even still, something seems very strange about Kilik being in the top tier, especially *above* Yoshimitsu, Cassandra and Cervantes.
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I agree... I dont see anything but Range where kilik is better than Yoshi and Cassy but they both have easy ways to get inside anytime they want....

I dont agree with Kilik being top but I do think he has the tools to succeed.... I think his positioning of ALGOL is wrong as well

as we all know now... algol is in S tier all by himself... NO ONE can do the things he can do...
 
RedDjinn said:
I'll post this so people will shut up about tekken already..... This is JinMasters list from calibur forums.... they're discussing it there so i figure we could discuss it here... Dont ask me why whos where what how.... cause I dont know... but hey you can discuss and break it down...


Teir 1: Sopie, Voldo, Taki, Setsuka, Kilik

Teir 2: Cass, Asta, Ivy, Amy, Ralph, Yoshi, Algol, Cervy

Teir 3: Mitsu, Seig, Lizardman, Hilde, X

Teir 4: Knightmare, Tira, Talim, Zas

Teir 5: Maxi, Yun, Mina, Rock

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Tell me if you agree or disagree, and give me reasonable points to why 'XYZ' Character is in the incorrect tier. I feel this is 90% accurate.


Jinmaster
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i could post about tekken, but i'm going to refrain cuz this is neither the time nor the place to do it.

kilik top? i don't think so. i think he's good, yea, he's always been decent, but i really need a good reason why he's top in this particular game. i definitely think people could win tournaments with him, though.

yoshi dropped quite a bit. i think the loss a:b+k had something to do with this, but he's still badass imo.

taki, voldo, and sets top now? voldo does have some amazing options, even with his loss of juggling in 1.03. he's still got some wicked awesome moves in general, but i don't know because he's much different than previous iterations and i just restarted picking him up (old 3a+b is now 1a? lol).

sets completely lacks decent lows (sans 1a:a:a, which lacks range and tracking, detracting it a bit), but her mids are amazing (much like soph, but not quite). i'm not sold on that yet as i haven't played a really REALLY outstanding sets, so i'm biased.

taki... well, i don't know. i haven't played a really good taki yet either. she definitely has tools, but... i don't know.

asty moving up is a bit surprising. could it be that people have found ways around his vastly different style from sc3?
 
I woul move Kilik to 2, Mitsu to 2, Yoshi to 1, and Knightmare to 3. Not too sure about Voldo either, it seems risky to call him top, though he is easily high 2. As much as I wish Ivy could be considered 1, she just isn't, but I still love ya baby!
 
RedDjinn said:
I agree... I dont see anything but Range where kilik is better than Yoshi and Cassy but they both have easy ways to get inside anytime they want....
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Well one thing is that I think Kilik can abare to much better effect than Cassy can. His throw game is slightly better than hers as well, although Cassy's is still very good.

Yoshi's 2a:B certainly allows him to abare very well but only from very close range. Killik can continue to pressure at mid range from disadvantage which is very important if you want to stay at mid range. Kilik's A break is clearly better than Yoshi's but Yoshi has by far the better B break options.

It would be hard for me to argue that Kilik is better than either overall but those are some areas where I think Kilik is stronger.

If you wanted to get more specific, I'd be willing to bet that Kilik can get out of a lot of Yoshi's mix ups and wake up shenanigans better than most characters thanks to his off-the-ground stuff and Asura. But I haven't tested it.
 
imo its a decent list still, i dont agree with 2 things algol and astaroth, im intrested too on why asta moved up he was my main back in sc3.
 
Sadrabbit said:
Well one thing is that I think Kilik can abare to much better effect than Cassy can. His throw game is slightly better than hers as well, although Cassy's is still very good.

Yoshi's 2a:B certainly allows him to abare very well but only from very close range. Killik can continue to pressure at mid range from disadvantage which is very important if you want to stay at mid range. Kilik's A break is clearly better than Yoshi's but Yoshi has by far the better B break options.

It would be hard for me to argue that Kilik is better than either overall but those are some areas where I think Kilik is stronger.

If you wanted to get more specific, I'd be willing to bet that Kilik can get out of a lot of Yoshi's mix ups and wake up shenanigans better than most characters thanks to his off-the-ground stuff and Asura. But I haven't tested it.
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Actually alot of his off -the ground stuff is no good against yoshi... 2[A+B] cancels out any ground moves he does.... Asura is still good though... and as for range once yoshi gets in Kilik doesnt really have the push to keep him out...

Again like i said yoshi can get in anytime he wants with 33B,B+K and theres not much he can do about it... Once he gets in Asura can save him but hes going to be hard pressed if Asura misses and yoshi hits he's in trouble...

Yoshis are underrated because many of them just dont do the things he can do if your good with him... the 4:A:A:A:A:A just frame is awesome... does soul cauge damage , guard breaks, and on hit guarantees a combo... his iMCF up close shuts anything kilik does down... his stances evade most of kiliks lows on reaction except for 1K set-ups...

His throws are some of the strongest in the game... He has more useful JF's then anyone and his RO game is just as strong as kiliks...

IMO i think yoshi vs. kilik is an easy win...
 
Jinmaster's list is hot garbage. Talim not in bottom tier? Cass a tier below Taki? Sieg in tier 3? I could go on, honestly. Let's just pretend he never posted that.

And for anyone that isn't sure about Voldo in top 5 yet, three words for you. Just Frame elbows.
 
Anybody feel like making a new tier thread? 30 pages is a crapload to go through. Maybe start fresh, reference the new patch in the title?
 
Tiamat Tier List

S: Hilde, Algol
A: Kilik, Amy, Voldo, Setsuka, X
B: Soph, Asta, Cervy, Lizard, Yoshi
C: Raph, NM, Sieg, Cass, Mitsu, Tira, Ivy, Yun, Taki, Apprentice
D: Zas, Maxi, Rock, Vader, Talim
E: Mina, Yoda

Foxbot Tier List

S: Hilde, Algol, Amy
A: Kilik, Voldo, Setsuka, Sophie
B: Cass, Asta, Cervy, Lizardman, Yoshi, Ivy, X
C: Raph, Sieg, Taki, Apprentice, Mitsu
D: NM, Yun, Maxi, Tira
E: Zas, Rock, Talim, Mina

Noface Tier list
S
*Hilde*, Voldo, Kilik, Algol
A+
Cassandra, Setsuka, Yoshimitsu, Amy
A
Sophie, Lizardman, Cervantes, Taki
B
Astaroth, Xianghua, Ivy, Siegfried, Mitsurugi, Nightmare, Apprentice
C
Raphael, Tira, Vader, Yun, Maxi, Talim
D
Rock, Seong Mina, Zasalamel
Short Bus
Yoda
 
I don't understand why Amy wouldn't be higher ... the patch didn't change her too much and I would definitely say she's at least as solid a character as Voldo

Also, Lizzy looks good right where he is ... don't see that changing anytime soon.

Setsuka so high? Hmmm... dunno bout that ... she's not low but she's not up there with X, Sophie, and Amy either

Well that's my 2 cents.
 
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