[ARCHIVE] Raph vs the World: Matchup Thread

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darkfender said:
6B8 expecially but also 6B4 and B6 are longer than our pokes.
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That is just flat out false. A poke like Raph 3B easily outranges his 6B series. He doesn't even have a 6B4 last I checked. B6 would be the only one competing in range, and that's not exactly a poke. Much more commitment involved, more recovery, moving forward, etc.
 
All I know about Mitsu is 66B will ruin any dependence on Mitsu's 4B. You barely even need to anticipate it.
 
KowtowRobinson said:
That is just flat out false. A poke like Raph 3B easily outranges his 6B series. He doesn't even have a 6B4 last I checked. B6 would be the only one competing in range, and that's not exactly a poke. Much more commitment involved, more recovery, moving forward, etc.
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6B2...i meant ...and 3B against mitsu is a suicide.
 
He's exaggerating to further his propaganda. But hey, if his rants are being listened to namco, darkfender will be hailed as a hero for the impending raph buffs lol.

3B is pretty piss weak if you only look at the raw numbers in isolation. 18 damage. -14 on block. even frames on hit.
Any one of these can be tweaked a little bit in the positive direction without making the move too strong. I learned not to rely on a move like this against characters with strong wait-and-punish strategies (instead opting to spam 22B~QS 22B). I like 3B too much (from SC4 ) to give up on it completely in a non-guarnateed situation.
 
i was assuming as much. i had a bunch of matches with a A2 mitsu, never once felt like its was a bad MU or if 3b was ineffective. i know its online but the guy knew the MU pretty well
 
YounFox said:
i was assuming as much. i had a bunch of matches with a A2 mitsu, never once felt like its was a bad MU or if 3b was ineffective. i know its online but the guy knew the MU pretty well
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A2 rank is someone that wasted lot of time in ranked thus probably worthless by definition....unless he really played a lot in non ranked also.

Best players usually goes from e5 to D1 with few to a5 that for a simple reason.
Good players have lot of competent friends....so they don t need to waste weeks in ranked where you won t learn anything (unless they want the shiny precioussss tag).

said that as maxou showed me raph's problem in this (and most other) matchup is raw damage...

All they have to do is:
be careful to not eat 22B and guess right a couple of times, maybe gambling a crouch....expecially at throw range.
When they break your bar they get also a fee round probably whereas you have even to be careful how you break their bar or you will do laughable damage.
2KBE also is a huge threat considering that blocking one you probably go even in damage differently from scIV when you get 3-4X and even on hit you could reverse mixup.
Also you could evade his stance game without risking a backthrow >.>

Just to say that from scIV my main is raph my alt is mitsu.....people i played most against used mitsu.
 
online matters, ask all the up and comers like wolfkrone or hawkeye. im assuming maxou is using alpapat (i looked him up on youtube and hes a setsuka player in 4). according to kdz and bibilous commentary from final round Apat has as bad step punish as we do. why not space him out while gambling a step here and there. also b4 you say thats impossible or he is too gd or some nonsense, all you need to regain space is to land 3b or 6bb. you have enough advantage to go into prep 4 and maybe enough for se A just to get away.

In regards to GB im getting on avg 75 dmg off of all the major breakers, so again i have no idea what you are using where you are having probs. it sounds to me that you lack fundamentals and want the character to make up for that fact.
 
youngfox said:
it sounds to me that you lack fundamentals and want the character to make up for that fact.
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i wouldn t say so.....
I am one of those OLD raph mainers angry as hell after seeing namco hates raph......

But maybe you are from europe and on X360....so maybe you can show me "fundamentals i lack" :)
Ans also record the match.....

P.S: maxou switched to mitsu i think
P.P.S: also agter you said raph is good because you won against an A2 i would stop going in all threads saying people lacks experience...expecially since you didn t say that only to me and we are all raph mainers from at least 4 years....
 
oh dont get it twisted, ive played raph since sc2. i was originally on caliburforums and spared extensively with dr.dogg, oofmatic, icychains, crow winters in Sc4 until i dropped it in favor of SF4. ill see if my friend can upload a match of mine but if you are gonna demand a vid, i expect you show one of you and how hopeless raph is
 
youngfox said:
oh dont get it twisted, ive played raph since sc2. i was originally on caliburforums and spared extensively with dr.dogg, oofmatic, icychains, crow winters in Sc4 until i dropped it in favor of SF4. ill see if my friend can upload a match of mine but if you are gonna demand a vid, i expect you show one of you and how hopeless raph is
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well we didn t drop it for scIV :)

but actually i won alot with raph in scV unfortunately i know i profit of people lack of experience in the matchup...(seriously nobody cares for the matchup it seems but this is only hiding the truth).
 
youngfox said:
ill see if my friend can upload a match of mine but if you are gonna demand a vid, i expect you show one of you and how hopeless raph is
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He's never gonna do that. Trust me I tried. Practically begged :)

Anyway I do agree with him on ONE point. Raph's MAIN problem is raw damage. He hits like a girl outside of his 22B combo stuff. He has to chip and chip away.
 
Surprise / ignorance factor is Raph's biggest bonus going into tournament matches - it always has been, since he isn't played by very many people, and is played well by significantly fewer.

I play against a lot of Mitsu, good ones, offline. The matchup is rough, 2K BE is really, really good, and super tech crouch shenanigans are rough, but unless you are playing against RTD who will interrupt every button you press with 6B8, you can still use the normal stuff and it isn't a terrible, terrible matchup, it'll just make you wish you had something as good as 2K BE. No magic win button, no super good setups, just keep in mind that Mitsu can get caught getting too linear as well, and you have 22B.

3B I really try to use as a distance closer. If they push into me and I'm not 22Bing for some reason, I'll try to tag them with a 3B, that's really the only time I use 3B in a situation that matters.
 
darkfender said:
i wouldn t say so.....
I am one of those OLD raph mainers angry as hell after seeing namco hates raph......
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I've seen a LOT of old players with poor fundamentals. Being a "veteran" doesn't make you good. Just means you've had time to maybe get good. There's a few players that started in SC4 and would whup me clean in this game, even though I've been around twice as long as them.

Bottom line, play a character that you think can win. If you don't think Raph can win, then quit. Stop playing him. I would have dropped this character if I thought he was ass, because I'm trying to win.

WuHT said:
He's exaggerating to further his propaganda. But hey, if his rants are being listened to namco, darkfender will be hailed as a hero for the impending raph buffs lol.
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Not gonna lie, I got a chuckle out of that lol. I'm also curious to see what we get (if anything) in the patch. Also don't forget 3B's strengths. When you use it, they will have to show their hand as to how they plan on beating Prep. You can use that info. Also it's your -16 punisher with a TON of range that lets Raph easily punish moves with pushback, whereas some other characters may not get that damage. Same goes for 6BB, his punishes may not hit the hardest (lolmaxi) but the odds of you not being able to punish something because of pushback are slim. Not to mention if you're using it from long range, those -14 or even frames start to look a lot less appealing for the opponent, in terms of their quickest options.
 
4B loses against Xiba's 3B REM B at all ranges, not just tip.

Against Seig step~4B beats all options he has from 3[ B ], can combo with a Prep BBB, A+B. A+B works 90% of the time, because it puts Raph off axis.

Seig can use 3[ B ] at tip, to avoid this or just use 3B, put it is helpful against a stance game.
 
yea just use A+BA now after blocking 3b. you get 61 if he does remA, 38 if he does remK, and 42 if he does remB(the first part of A+BA clashes and the rest connects)
 
Sigh, came to check in here for some Mitsu match up advice, but nothing yet, I feel will give me the edge. I can't beat him out in long range, and I don't want to be too close to him, when he has meter. so Far i feel this match up is like 7-3 for Mitsu.
Anyone 1 have some advice on the match up? last resort, I might pick someone else up just for Mitsu.
 
Gamegenie222 said:
Any advice against Asta, Algol and Leixia with Raphael and how to approach them?
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All I know; Raphael is a grab happy Astaroth's worst nightmare. When Asta has meter, be ready to break the B+G grab. And if you know a grab is coming. Just 4B the grab for a combo. And a good Asta player will know his 66K beats all your prep options.
In short for Asta: punish all whiffs with 236B, with meter break B+G, and 6BB is great for zoning him.
Not much info for Leixia, but you can punish most of Algol strings with 6BB.
 
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