Nationals: What Went Right/Wrong

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CO_hates_DFG... Don't worry, we don't hold anything against CO. In fact, I don't hold anything against the chapter leaders of NVGA either; they probably don't even know themselves what DFG was doing. However, I hold DFG accountable and as he is the leader of NVGA, and this event was run by the NVGA, that means that the NVGA name will be tainted as well. If we do run a nationals next year, it will not be run by NVGA since I don't want to give that kind of power to DFG. I have nothing against chapter leaders of the NVGA running regionals; generally, they all did a great job and I wouldn't mind asking them for their support in the future.
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For the record, DFG is not THE founder of the NVGA, he is a A founder. We have 3 founding chapters, New Mexico, Colorado and Dallas and also ownership support from an (excellent) law firm. We all work together equally.

At the next leadership level we have some very experienced gaming chapter leaders from different parts of the country such as OK and many others that are helping to lead direction for the association. The chapter leaders are independent and run thier own events but support each other through the NVGA.

Together we're working on ways to make all of this *#$! involved with gaming events better for all of our chapters. We do not throw DFG and CCC under the bus here. We have actually avoided starting too many chapters up to this point until we are satisfied with our system. Maybe this event's results will help us perfect it.

Most anyone who has run a lot of gaming events over the years has had successes and failures somewhere. We all share in the blame ( or credit if any :-) . DFG and CCC have done a lot to promote gaming in CO and now want to have a bigger impact nationally. Any fair view has to also put some checkmarks in the +++ column for Cutthroat along with any -.

Questions about how money was handled are very important to us all. We are reviewing the issues raised. Money issues are question marks we cannot have in the future. Our view is that an organization can run events for profit, at a loss (not reccommended), at break even or any way they choose to. The important thing is make clear what is promised and deliver on that.

If more was promised than delivered here then we will address it. If any sort agreements are in order going forward even to make some amends we are not beyond that either. Everything is potentially constructive here EXCEPT for personal attacks. They may be entertaining to some people but not constructive. In my experience, these are best dealt with in private communication.
 
Just to chime in for a second:

The fighting game community does not trust organizations by and large because of their "private" dealings.
MLG is a sham, VGames screwed us all.

If you don't conduct your buissness transparently, I (and by exstention the community I speak for) want nothing to do with you. Public admittance of faults. Public discussion of change. Thats what we want.

-Idle
 
Just to chime in for a second:

The fighting game community does not trust organizations by and large because of their "private" dealings.
MLG is a sham, VGames screwed us all.

If you don't conduct your buissness transparently, I (and by exstention the community I speak for) want nothing to do with you. Public admittance of faults. Public discussion of change. Thats what we want.

-Idle

That's what we're doing in this thread. That's why I've posted some more information about the nature of the NVGA and why we're also responding to issues raised. As we agree on resolutions we will post those as well, Greg has already posted some of his own plans for future solutions.
 
Except you say things like this:
If more was promised than delivered here then we will address it. If any sort agreements are in order going forward even to make some amends we are not beyond that either. Everything is potentially constructive here EXCEPT for personal attacks. They may be entertaining to some people but not constructive. In my experience, these are best dealt with in private communication.

IF??? This is PR bullshit. You know there were problems, EVERYONE knows, so just address them already. WTF...
 
To me, a leader is somebody who is going to try and improve situations that are bad. The point has been made Nats didn't go well by the community's standard. I still stand by DFG that he made SOME mistakes but shouldn't be hung out to dry like he has been. How about the "community leader" (do we have one?) starts thinking of ideas not just how to improve nats, but the next major. If we keep going down this road, people will run off and quit, which I don't want to see happen.

Jaxel, you are supposed to be the "leader". Why are you not acting like one? Go back and skim everything you have said. I said horrible things when the thread started. I then wanted a solution, called DFG, and got my answers. Maybe not every single one, but I got enough information to learn this wasn't all his fault. You are supposed to be the man in charge. Be a leader. Stop pointing fingers, stop saying what you would have done better, and just do it. If you treat NJ/NY great, that's awesome. But on 8wayrun, you're the big dog, so step up or move over and let somebody else be the community leader while you run the website. Pretty simple to me
 
:Eating popcorn enjoying the show: Hey where's your ticket, btw cant wait till nationals next year, lol if its as fun as this ill pre register this time.
 
wait...so ur saying that i can read all this...and it wont go to my hips!? THIS IS DELICIOUS!
 
To me, a leader is somebody who is going to try and improve situations that are bad. The point has been made Nats didn't go well by the community's standard. I still stand by DFG that he made SOME mistakes but shouldn't be hung out to dry like he has been. How about the "community leader" (do we have one?) starts thinking of ideas not just how to improve nats, but the next major. If we keep going down this road, people will run off and quit, which I don't want to see happen.

Jaxel, you are supposed to be the "leader". Why are you not acting like one? Go back and skim everything you have said. I said horrible things when the thread started. I then wanted a solution, called DFG, and got my answers. Maybe not every single one, but I got enough information to learn this wasn't all his fault. You are supposed to be the man in charge. Be a leader. Stop pointing fingers, stop saying what you would have done better, and just do it. If you treat NJ/NY great, that's awesome. But on 8wayrun, you're the big dog, so step up or move over and let somebody else be the community leader while you run the website. Pretty simple to me

Damnit Nori, quit being an adult and go back to flaming.

You're ruining the fun.
 
Ok, to NVGA-

You keep posting about keeping negativity out, without addressing any of the issues generating it. (need to tell parts of the story though)

Dhalsim, Chingaook, Dezzz, I recognize your names from being mentioned to me by DFG, but do you even remember who I am? (I'm not being sarcastic)

Yea, I'm the guy who got SC4 nats planned, laid the ground work, rules and started all the information/hype for it. I was the guy running it, until some unfortunate forum related drama that removed me from the (at one time) main calibur fourms, which impeded my ability to effectively organize and plan nats (since this website did not exist yet). At first NVGA was involved to help with equipment and match recording for finals, in TULSA, OK. After more issues that splintered planning further, I offered NVGA the chance to run it, as DFG seemed anxious to get nationals under NVGA's banner. At the time, I thought this could do no harm. He made promises of keeping the plans I had intact and also promised he had many sponsors lined up to help promote and fund the event, as well as NVGA's vast resources he claimed to have to make the event outstanding. Looking back, none of this took place.

Why did I ask if you remembered me? Because I don't recall any of you being involved to any extent in the planning emails that took place between me and DFG, where he supposedly included key NVGA members for input (via CC emails) (maybe chingagook occasionally?). Rarely did anyone provide input aside from "sounds great, go for it!" on whatever was being discussed. Up until the plan to move Nats finals to supercon (which killed it all for me), I was heavily involved in the plan making discussion, though there were already a lot of changes made that I didn't like. NVGA promised a high amount of hype for each regional, and it produced none. Communication was pretty abysmal with most of the regional coordinators as well. Over time, I saw this go from a valid community effort, to an NVGA agenda that served their needs, not ours.

It seems like the NVGA'ers posting are only here for some sort of damage control, with no real idea of why people have issues or what went wrong.

So again, siding with your pleas of 'solutions' rather than mass negativity... I will not post every single plan or idea that was changed for the worse and why, because the list would be long and negative. However, regardless of DFG not being the 'founder' of NVGA, he still made a lot of questionable changes to favor NVGA and profitability, under your banner and none of you questioned it, and assumed it was status quo (from our perspective). So there is some shared accountability for your whole organization. If you would like me to list them publicly in order and detail, I can... but would rather not.

So on to solutions for next years Nationals.

-- I would like to go back to organizing this year's nationals and bring it back, under the original structure it was planned for (only a few month span for regionals, with nats itself a month later). Why is this a solution? I, like many others here am qualified to run a large event and can with ease. No hassles, no mess. I would also like for NVGA's regional directors to be involved in running regionals, just under our rules and guidelines. This time I also don't have to worry about being removed from forums due to drama ect ect, this time. I would be working with CLOSELY community organizers and LEADERS such as Jaxel, Nori (ie. people willing to communicate and get shit done) and whoever else will really take charge of running a serious national/international tournament and salvage this community along with it.


--The money issues (from this year's nationals) need to be answered and accounted for. Not only do the numbers that Jaxel has provided need to be accounted for, but also NVGA's promise of sponsor money and a $4k pot (which was ALWAYS set as the standard pot since this began). There are too many questions and not enough answers, every day this goes unanswered creates more negativity. It's not something that should take time, NVGA should be making answers, not excuses about investigating it. But then again, it reflects your communication with each other.


--Make nationals an EXCLUSIVE Soulcalibur event. If the community wants to make it 'internationals', so be it, we will make the right decision based on informed opinions from all corners of the community. But the one thing that has to stay constant, is that this event is for SOULCALIBUR only. No sidegames on the day of the tourney, no distractions the day of nationals that take away from the prestige of the event. Its a tourney for the top players made possible by the top players. If they wanna play other games, we can run stuff on another day or after the event has wrapped. Team tournies and anything else are more than welcome to happen for SC, but after the main event.

--Also the whole debacle of LETTING RANDOM PEOPLE who showed up, into the NATIONALS bracket. Totally unacceptable, it has been explained 100 times as to why. A total insult to suggest ever letting this occur again. The difference between a major and nationals, is that nationals spots are earned and a major anyone can just walk into. Nationals is supposed to be all the best players, battling it out to see who's best, not a super large tourney where you invite as much cannon fodder as you can to fill a large bracket.


--Figure out the best way possible to set up a prize structure for regionals, that 1) keeps the placers interested in attending nats 2) Helps them get to Nats 3) Doesn't favor players who just want the 1st place money and do not plan to attend nats. The way it was originally designed, it was supposed to set up incentives to attend the final tournament, the plane tickets were supposed to be handled swiftly with the left over money being folded into the pot or used to assist another plane ticket for a farther away player's ticket from a regional with unfortunately low attendance (if needed). They hype was never generated to make this effective based on attendance. So we need to figure out a better way.

--Figure out a way to raise a $4K pot and make nationals worth bothering to qualify for. I think a combination of factors will make this possible. We can run a paypal community donation fund to raise some funds directly for the pot. Run a few charity style tournaments at majors where half the pot is donated to the nats fund, half to the winners. Plus we can look into real sponsors who may actually benefit the running of the event. Combined with the pot money we will get from hopefully largely attended regionals, this will work. I am just brianstorming though, I am open to any and all fundraising ideas.

--Constant community updates. Keep honest and inform the community about what is going on, what changes have been made and collect input from the people INTERESTED in making nats work and interested in attending it. There will always be naysayers, haters and troublemakers looking to pick apart your policies, but as an LEADER, you have to learn to deal with it, address important issues, and differentiate people who nitpick to nitpick from people validly trying to help the overall quality of the event.


There will be a lot of effort needed on ALL our parts to keep this community going. Let's not pretend that this community isn't shrinking by the day. We all hope SC: BD will re-spark some interest, and also pray T6:BR doesn't kill interest from what 3D fans we have left here. We may have to deal with the reality there will not be another patch, and this game will be what it already is. The question is do we have what it takes to hype, build community and keep a GREAT GAME afloat for another year? I hope so. We will need all the motivated players we can find to keep going out and showing the FG world that our game isn't weak, our game is beautiful on high levels and that we just don't roll over when hot new fad fighters drop on our casual fan base.

IMO no one person is going to have all the solutions. But we obviously don't like having committees with decisions being made by a small group of players calling the shots and ignoring others. We just have to look to the player-organizers who still have strong communities, player bases and INTEREST in the game, to help keep this going. We simply will have to rely on people like Jaxel, Nori, myself- who can get things like free venues that are good enough to host majors, can pool resources with others and has access to all the proper equipment to run such an event. Why do I only suggest Jax and Nori at this time? Because to me they are the only ones bringing up real ideas and solutions, also the only ones giving a shit enough to say "HEY THIS COMMUNITY DESERVES BETTER".

So this is the camp I sit firmly in, and look forward to comment.

NVGA- try to run majors, regain respect from our community. But your organization dropped the ball (whether it was your direct involvement, or the fact that you guys didn't keep tabs on how it was going and where it was headed), and turned our biggest tournament, into a side attraction at a convention, that was your chance. Now it should go back to the community leaders, and will.


cha cha
 
Ok, to NVGA-

You keep posting about keeping negativity out, without addressing any of the issues generating it. (need to tell parts of the story though)

Dhalsim, Chingaook, Dezzz, I recognize your names from being mentioned to me by DFG, but do you even remember who I am? (I'm not being sarcastic)


cha cha

No, i dont know you sorry, Cha Cha you never announced yourself to me. Our maybe i wasn't paying attention to you (i'm not being Sarcastic). Ok the event didnt satisfy everyone's need, but its over ok. There are many parts to this story but its over. I had a great time i made alot of friends, saw a lot of old ones. Hope to see yall come out next year it'll be ever better.
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To all the NVGA members that have posted.

I hate to say this but after working with a corporation for the last 2 years and being in the military for 5 years, I know a smokescreen when I see one. I have done nothing but read this thread to figure out why a lot of the people I knew who went to this event found more things wrong then right and after reading the posts of the people who are apart of the organization that was helping run the event, and seeing only small answers, this is the only real response that I can say I see.

My advice, I think DFG should scan every single recept for the event and place them up for the community to reveiw it. Show the community where all the money went. Right now, it really looks like this missing money was pocketed and honestly with the smokescreen play I have seen so far, it would make me believe that more than anything else. Yes there are a lot of costs that are to be had when running an event such as this, and because of it, there should be accurate bookeeping for such. Now if the organization is willing to provide this information, un-altered of course, then things between the community and the organization would be settled, and people would be able to go ahead and continue. If they do not, then this will be a heated thread for awhile and I am pretty sure that a lot of the people who were apart of the running of Nationals will not be as trusted as before because this event will remain in their minds.

That is what I personally think you all should do. I point no fingers because i was not there. As you can tell, I am not a lawyer. I do not know any of the people from the NVGA. I am only saying this after reading everything that has been posted.
 
To me, a leader is somebody who is going to try and improve situations that are bad. The point has been made Nats didn't go well by the community's standard. I still stand by DFG that he made SOME mistakes but shouldn't be hung out to dry like he has been. How about the "community leader" (do we have one?) starts thinking of ideas not just how to improve nats, but the next major. If we keep going down this road, people will run off and quit, which I don't want to see happen.

Jaxel, you are supposed to be the "leader". Why are you not acting like one? Go back and skim everything you have said. I said horrible things when the thread started. I then wanted a solution, called DFG, and got my answers. Maybe not every single one, but I got enough information to learn this wasn't all his fault. You are supposed to be the man in charge. Be a leader. Stop pointing fingers, stop saying what you would have done better, and just do it. If you treat NJ/NY great, that's awesome. But on 8wayrun, you're the big dog, so step up or move over and let somebody else be the community leader while you run the website. Pretty simple to me

Good post Nori, This is how Ive felt since this has begun.
 
To all the NVGA members that have posted.

Right now, it really looks like this missing money was pocketed and honestly with the smokescreen play I have seen so far, it would make me believe that more than anything else. .


Dude who are you? Lmao do you even play soulcal :sad clown face:
 
To me, a leader is somebody who is going to try and improve situations that are bad. The point has been made Nats didn't go well by the community's standard. I still stand by DFG that he made SOME mistakes but shouldn't be hung out to dry like he has been. How about the "community leader" (do we have one?) starts thinking of ideas not just how to improve nats, but the next major. If we keep going down this road, people will run off and quit, which I don't want to see happen.

Jaxel, you are supposed to be the "leader". Why are you not acting like one? Go back and skim everything you have said. I said horrible things when the thread started. I then wanted a solution, called DFG, and got my answers. Maybe not every single one, but I got enough information to learn this wasn't all his fault. You are supposed to be the man in charge. Be a leader. Stop pointing fingers, stop saying what you would have done better, and just do it. If you treat NJ/NY great, that's awesome. But on 8wayrun, you're the big dog, so step up or move over and let somebody else be the community leader while you run the website. Pretty simple to me
Nori... trying to find out where $2,000 disappears to? Thats not trying to improve the situation? Why do I keep ragging on DFG/NVGA? Because so I have NOT received the answers that both myself and the community deserves. How to improve nats for next year? We need these questions about this year's nationals answered FIRST. What can I do about answering these questions? NOTHING. As I said in a previous post, NVGA has run Nationals behind closed doors, with zero transparency. So I will keep on pushing them until they give us the answers we deserve. No one knew what was going on, NOT EVEN YOU, after having spoken to DFG! You spoke to DFG on the phone, that doesn't mean you got any answers; that simply means you got more PR bullshit from the man himself.

I have no interest in calling DFG. He should be able to answer these questions over IM, PM or even email. DFG has been pretty much IMPOSSIBLE to contact for the past year. Everything has to be his way, and has to be over the phone (because phones are a lot more secretive/private than the other contact methods I have posted), and even with the phone, DFG is only contactable in a short periods throughout the day (because he claims he is so busy) that are INCONVENIENT FOR EVERYBODY. If DFG didn't have the time/chops to run such a big event, why didn't he hand it over to someone else? DFG's mismanagement fucked up this entire situation.

Dezzz said "stop hating and give us solutions". Solutions to what? The complete fuckup that was manufactured by NVGA?

So we as the Soulcalibur community have to solve NVGA's problems... under NVGA's rules? Sorry, it doesn't work like that.
 
Dude who are you? Lmao do you even play soulcal :sad clown face:
This is EXACTLY what ChaCha, Kit and Myself are talking about!

Dezzz, you are contributing NOTHING to this conversation. You are NOT providing solutions for any problems, not even asking any questions; you are only making things worse by deflecting the main issues to periphrial issues. What does Kit's skill in Soulcalibur have ANYTHING to do with ANYTHING? You are avoiding the central topic because you have no valid responses for it, and you are instead latching on periphrial issues to try undermind the efforts for TRUTH many of us have been making in this thread.

For that matter? WHO THE FUCK ARE YOU? You get last place in every event you have ever attended; something Kit could EASILY do as well. Not to mention. you are NOT a vocal part of this community, Kit is. If you are NVGA, stop fucking around and get us some answers.
 
So what are you trying to accomplish? Do you think you are being some kind of hero by continuing to attack the guy publicly? A year from now, I guarantee you NOBODY will say things like "You remember after Nats how Jaxel continued to bust DFG's balls EVERY DAY? That was so cool". Right now, realize it or not, you are doing a lot more damage to the community than you are helping. It is not your job to find out where the missing money at Nats went. You know who's job it is? The guys who were there, and got paid, and if THEY feel they were under paid, they can simply be big boys and talk to DFG/NVGA.

At this point, what are you doing to improve the game besides a giant wall of text on the main page? You're a smart guy, use your head, you clearly can't possibly think you are doing more good than harm going down the route you are right? People can hate on WCMaxi all they wanted (I didn't care for him), but he didn't let shit like this happen. If you had all these "questions and concerns" about Nats, why weren't you involved? Trust me, reading a bunch of posts from you saying "see guys, I told you so, look at this old email" is not winning you any points. Sitting in the owners box criticizing the coach/players will not get you very far as a leader. All this negative crap you're spewing left and right, put it towards

-Finding ways to keep SCIV alive
-Making sure majors have SCIV in the lineup
-Keeping the vets INTERESTED in traveling


From what I remember (I met you Clash 05) you continue to this day to put in a ton of work in the NJ/NY area for tourneys, organizations, etc. Nobody is questioning your work up there, sounds awesome. However, now you're the "leader" of the SC community. If you are overwhelmed, pick regional leaders, or a "co-leader" or whatever, but this game needs some positive direction fast, cause this "Jaxel vs the world" is getting pretty old, pretty fast.
 
Except you say things like this:


IF??? This is PR bullshit.

Not at all. Just because I use language that is careful and also respectful of others does not make it "bullshit". At the same time your great ability to throw around terms like "PR bullshit" does not keep it from actually being "bullshit".

If you read carefully some statements were made about the organizational structure of the NVGA. They were mistaken so I corrected them. No BS there.

I said "IF" because it appears to me from going back and reading a lot of the email that different things were said and planned at different times, as occurs in planning. It looks also likes plans were changed as things developed. I can see how that may have caused confusion and became contradictory. That's my read on a quick skim. We say "IF" because we need to investigate further before reaching conclusions.
 
Nori... wtf are you talking about? As the "leader" of this community, what I am doing here IS to keep interest in a possible nationals for the future. People are sour about nationals, even if they aren't posting. Have you even been reading this thread? I did have questions and concerns about Nats, and I was involved, and I DID try to get it fixed. But I got blackballed by NVGA and they pretty much ignored all of both mine and ChaCha's questions.

I am still posting because I want people to know, especially the hardcore players that I will do everything in my power (although limited, because of NVGA's smokescreen) to make sure the wrongs have been righted. I want them to know that this kind of TRAVESTY will not happen again. I want them to know that when we run nationals next year, those involved with scam of this year's event will not be involved.

And Nori... stop changing the subject; you're not helping the community get answers to these questions. That being said, I can't understand how people can just let $2K disappear and not question it. Bernie Madof stole $40 billion, should we have simply let it go as well because it doesn't look good on our society to bust on this guy's balls? If NVGA want to finally post their financials, and say WeI fucked up, and because of our mismanagement, plane tickets were too expensive, and thats why the pot was so small", then this conversaton would be OVER and I would stop asking about the money. But NVGA hasn't, so until then, the money is still an issue.
 
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