Natsu Questions And Answers / General Discussion

Be careful with 8KA though. It's -18 on block and super (stab) punishable..

Same thing with A:6_A6 on block.. stab punishable.

-ASZ
 
Back after playing some with my bros. 8KA is most usefull when you use it to jump over lows/mids, if you use it random it will get blocked or dodged and you will get a sword to the face. A:6 is good, but suffers the same problems as 8KA, if they know its coming and they block it, you will get punished.
When im up close I like to use a grab or 6:A.

Against most characters I play hit-and-run, staying out of reach and fishing with A+B or 66B and if they block it I try to run away by canceling my moves into 4(back teleport) and block and try again. If I get my counter-hit/grab, I stick to them like bees to honey and never stop pressuring them.
 
Yeah, there's nothing wrong with a good 50/50 "mixup" (throws can be broken), but don't rely on it too much. If you guess wrong, they'll just punish you, like you said.

A+B on block is AA punishable from most characters, and A+B4 (back teleport) is even worse.. -21 and within range for stab or BB. :(

Same thing for 66B, that's -14 (stab) punishable or BB from most characters. 66B4 is still stab punishable but might get you away from BB's depending on range.

Not here to burst your bubble, but just to give you a heads up that eventually people will start punishing (every)thing that you do. So we'll have to play smarter.. safer (which natsu isn't.. really). Just don't think that you can get away with that back teleport, because it doesn't make her moves any more safe.

Also, jumping lows/2A's with 8KA is really good if you're able to react fast enough. It's like 61 damage for punishing a low that might even be safe on block? Worth it for sure. But.. 8KA = high risk.

Who was it that said natsu was low risk high reward again? Hmm...

-ASZ
 
Hmm, didnt know that they were that unsafe, thought they looked kinda safe.
I think the reason for why I get away with unsafe stuff is because like 85% of my matches are VS. beginners or button mashers.
Guess ill have to read up on Natsu´s framedata and experiment to see which moves works best.

Also, all critique is welcome. If you never listen to critique, you'll never get any better.
 
The fact that it's a guessing situation, sorta makes it "safe" like you said. Like:

A+B is -12, AA punishable for most characters.
A+B4 is -21. May get you out of AA punishment, but it becomes stab punishable and BB punishable.

So it's all in the air on what happens, but the first step is figuring out what's punishable, and what's not.. and ways to get around the frame data. Also remember AA and BB dmg was nerfed in this game.. so some players might not even care of the possibility of being punished by these. But if it's -14, and you're against Pyrrha, you'll care lol.

-ASZ
 
hey guys, this is my first Soul calibur game ive taken a liking to, and plan to play competitively.

so im wondering; if you guys would help me level up my Natsu?

i play on xbl: xxmromixx
 
Hello there, unfortunately im on PSN, so I cant help you with sparring, but I can help you with what I know.
Alot of Natsus moves are good on counterhit, but are not very good if they are blocked or dodged.

Usefull moves:
A+B - A fast rush attack, but its very unsafe if its blocked or dodged, so only use it when your sertain it will hit.
66B - A fast stab, good if you get a counter hit, bad if they block.
8K, A - Jumps over most attacks, not vertical though. Good if you know that they will do a low/mid since it does pretty good damage and knocks them down, but is unsafe if blocked or dodged.
4A+B - Kinda fast low that launches and leads into big damage, kinda safe on block, but dont spam it since people can jump over it. If you launch your enemy do: After 4A+B hits > 6 > 8B+G
A:6 - (Just frame, press 6 when the normal A hits), fast close range attack, is unsafe on block.

I think the best way to get better is to play alot and when you lose/encounter something diffucult. Save the replay and go back and watch and look for what you did wrong and learn from it.

Hope this helps.
 
AkuSokuZan said:
Yeah, there's nothing wrong with a good 50/50 "mixup" (throws can be broken), but don't rely on it too much. If you guess wrong, they'll just punish you, like you said.

A+B on block is AA punishable from most characters, and A+B4 (back teleport) is even worse.. -21 and within range for stab or BB. :(

Same thing for 66B, that's -14 (stab) punishable or BB from most characters. 66B4 is still stab punishable but might get you away from BB's depending on range.

Not here to burst your bubble, but just to give you a heads up that eventually people will start punishing (every)thing that you do. So we'll have to play smarter.. safer (which natsu isn't.. really). Just don't think that you can get away with that back teleport, because it doesn't make her moves any more safe.

Also, jumping lows/2A's with 8KA is really good if you're able to react fast enough. It's like 61 damage for punishing a low that might even be safe on block? Worth it for sure. But.. 8KA = high risk.

Who was it that said natsu was low risk high reward again? Hmm...

-ASZ
Click to expand...
Everyone is forgetting HOV. I know it requires more testing, (I think TaXi is working on it now) but I'd really like to see how incorporating that into the PO game might make the opponent have to guess whether trying to punish a blocked 66B4 or 6A+B4 is worth the risk of getting a HOV B to the face, and then a 120+ damage follow up combo. Maybe it's worthless, but I think it has potential to make her PO game stronger.

I'll look into it tonight unless someone does before me.
 
UnseenWombat said:
Everyone is forgetting HOV. I know it requires more testing, (I think TaXi is working on it now) but I'd really like to see how incorporating that into the PO game might make the opponent have to guess whether trying to punish a blocked 66B4 or 6A+B4 is worth the risk of getting a HOV B to the face, and then a 120+ damage follow up combo. Maybe it's worthless, but I think it has potential to make her PO game stronger.

I'll look into it tonight unless someone does before me.
Click to expand...

well i've done some very basic testing; the rough notes are in the PO transition thread. anyone wanna do 6A+B PO?
 
Thing about 66B4 PO is that it has some pushback (plus the PO retreat) on block, so some characters are limited on how they punish, so yeah HOV might be a good idea depending on the matchup and how they punish. I'll leave it to TaXi on the actual frames and stuff, but on quick testing:

VS Pyrrha:
66B4 PO (blocked), ...

HOV B - Pyrrha can 236236B natsu before the "teleport" becomes active.
Mist (PO 2) - Pyrrha can 236236B natsu before the "teleport" becomes active.
PO A+B+K PO - Pyrrha's 236236B whiffs, Natsu appears in front of Pyrrha in PO (With Pyrrha back against a wall, or something to prevent the pushback distance, Natsu will teleport behind Pyrrha in PO after PO A+B+K); PO K_BT PO K guaranteed.
PO B_A:6_K_B+K - Pyrrha's 236236B beats out all other PO options.

4A+B6 PO (blocked), ...

HOV B - Pyrrha can 236B natsu before the "teleport" becomes active.
Mist (PO 2) - Pyrrha can 236B natsu before the "teleport" becomes active.
PO A+B+K PO - Pyrrha's 236B whiffs, Natsu will teleport behind Pyrrha in PO (BT PO K guaranteed).
PO A:6 - Pyrrha gets CH out of 236B by Natsu.
PO K - Pyrrha's 236B beats out Natsu.
PO B+K - Pyrrha's 236B beats out Natsu.

Very interesting though.. 4A+B6 PO Natsu is -3 on block. PO A:6 (i7?) beats out stab but PO K (i10/11) loses to stab (-14).

VS Natsu.
From what I've found, Natsu has nothing to punish another Natsu's 66B (-16) due to pushback, except for 6A+B4 PO, PO A:6 (50 dmg punishment). 66B4 PO however, is -14.

66B4 PO (blocked), ...

HOV B - 2nd hit of 6A+B hits natsu out for 12 dmg. Punishing natsu should be at +11 (? test) and in PO, but PO A whiffs due to range. Uninterruptable PO B?
Mist (PO 2) - Same as above.
PO A+B+K - Natsu evades and teleports behind 6A+B, at 66B4 tip range, Natsu teleports in front of the 6A+Bing natsu.
PO B - 6A+B4 PO lands CH.
PO A:6 - Same as above.
PO K - 2nd hit of 6A+B hits Natsu out of PO K.
PO B+K - 2nd hit of 6A+B CH's Natsu.

4A+B6 PO (blocked), ...

HOV B - 6A+B hits Natsu out of HOV
Mist (PO 2) - Same as above.
PO A+B+K - Natsu evades and teleports through 6A+B, appears behind the opponent.
PO B - 6A+B CH's natsu out of PO B.
PO A:6 - 6A+B CH's natsu out of PO A:6.
PO K - PO K interrupts 6A+B.
PO B+K - 6A+B CH's natsu out of PO B+K.

So PO A+B+K is a good way of getting out of trouble, as discussed yesterday. But that's still 1/2 meter used. Hopefully this'll open up better possibilities/ideas for Natsu's PO game in regards to punishing punishment.

-ASZ
 
just wanted to make a comment that not going into PO after 66B is an option that will beat things like 236236B. also, pyrrha's 236B on block gives natsu a free 6A+B.

in any case, BE teleport is there as an one-size-fits-all escape option if you have the meter and you don't want to play the guessing game.

also, outside of pyrrha, 2A is the move of choice for opponents after blocking 4A+B. out of curiosity, does anyone know how many frames patroklos' 236B is?
 
Hey everyone, I'm new to Soul calibur and 3D fighters in general. Anyways, I'm wondering what is a good way of getting the FC 2AB from standing? I'm familiar with the method of holding guard and tapping crouch and inputting the 2BC as i release guard. However, ever so often i end up getting her 2BC by accident. Are there any tips so that i can avoid this?
 
@Eugene: I'm guessing you're talking about FC A+B (poison dart, caltrops)? And I'm guessing 2BC is actually 2A+B (unblockable bomb). If this is the case, you have to be sure that you're fully in crouch animation before pressing A+B. A method I like to use to make sure I don't accidentally get 2A+B is pressing and holding down a few frames before A+B. Don't press them at the same time.
 
frost said:
@Eugene: I'm guessing you're talking about FC A+B (poison dart, caltrops)? And I'm guessing 2BC is actually 2A+B (unblockable bomb). If this is the case, you have to be sure that you're fully in crouch animation before pressing A+B. A method I like to use to make sure I don't accidentally get 2A+B is pressing and holding down a few frames before A+B. Don't press them at the same time.
Click to expand...
Ahh yeah. I somehow managed to mixup 2b+c with 2a+b. It always seems that I end up getting the 2A+B more often when I'm trying to combo for some reason. Thanks for the tips though, I think practice is pretty much what i need now haha.
 
speaking of the 2A+B unblockable, does anyone know how to follow it up? when i play the cpu, she always follows it up with a sick combo, but i can't figure it out.
 
prof.oblivion said:
speaking of the 2A+B unblockable, does anyone know how to follow it up? when i play the cpu, she always follows it up with a sick combo, but i can't figure it out.
Click to expand...
ok so i figured it out. i'll post it here in case anyone didn't know. 2A+B, 214, 8B+G
it's unblockable attack, followed by possession, and the follow up is called haunting drop (during possession)
 
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