Davo87
[09] Warrior
If they were to make SCV, what route should they take? What aspect from: SC2? SC3? SC4? and ofcos new things!
Just make sure that this thread doesnt turn into a discussion where we toss things such as comparing BD ivy with SC4 ivy which is what the BD thread is for. The posted ideas needs *direction* to how it affects her with respect to your model of how she is capable of fighting, which would be refined by balancing out by nerfs in certain areas just like what developers would think.
So...what would be good if ppl form conceptual ideas of how the *NEW* ivy's mechanics should be designed, while also giving her weaknesses that can be accepted but not downgraded to the point we feel ripped off and uninspired like BD, which is my opinion already.
So...Ill kickstart with some ideas.
How should CS and SS be implemented?
No doubt everyone wants CS and SS a mixup just like in SC2 which isn't a change nor does it seem to be a step forward. SC3 Ivy's 66[K] into mixup is one of the interesting changes I have seen so far as it allows her to frametrap ppl into command throws, plus she had plenty of other SW tools which give good frames for setup back when Command throws were fast! SC4 Ivy is designed for SW iCS and WP SS before CL was discovered to be possible. BD demonstrates what their original intentions were for accessing command throws but actually quite an obsolete method. SC3 in my ranks is still the big step forward, where SE allows both command throws. CL being useless due no throws and weak lows imo is dull if not a failure. SC3 having one stance making her throws deadly is one thing I wish to see in SCV. The next thing I want to see is a new looking command throw not some shakable SE A, 236A. I like SCIV's swap of command throws from SW and WP and would like it if they gave her a secondary command throw for each stance which can be weaker but still more damaging. And possible for different purposes such as crouch throw or AT.
How should her stance system be designed?
This one is an open-ended discussion where possibilities are endless. Bcos ppl dislike CL, we go how about just having WP <> SW? Ppl enjoyed SC2 freedom of access to tools and so did SC4 Ivy's CL before BD's changes. Everyone wants their char to be versatile, but sure limitations force us to play a certain style, that could be their argument to BD's changes. But the thing is, BD Ivy's CL stance isnt rewarding enough just to have instant access from being cutoff to make it fun. For CL was to be a true transtional stance between WP and SW, it needs to be MUCH MORE versatile than WP and SW. Tho bcos she can 8wr and throw like her other stance, CL isnt really a transition. By more versatile I meant having MORE of "2 mix" choices like the BD's CL 66B into 66B+K or 66B,A+K. More to the point where it can make frame traps like SC3 Maxi or access to many stances like SC2 Ivy. Or I wish for SC5 to have more than one transitional stance than just SE. (Proper special stances, not just simply WP 6B+K into CL like BD.)
I disliked the purpose of stance barriers, if the middle stance is crap. Simple as that. Either give her a versatile CL back, or one with more transitional options. Any cool ideas also post up!
How offense and defense game tools:
SCIV did get her treatment of good tools and being accessible. This one is a discussion where it can never be easily agreed on as conceptual and on game will never be the same. This topic is to say what she can HAVE and at the same time FOREGO so that its a viable design to make her fun and not too broken or pathetic as we witnessed from 1.01 or BD. As a starter, say what moves she can go with each stance and what shall be removed as a result of a buff etc. Tho ofcos its too easy to get greedy like I may be already doing so from the following: :P
-Personally Im happy SC4 have retained her SC3 RO cannon and made use for WP WS BB.
-I like how [A] 6B+K is like her SC1 and SC2 main space offense and ppl can play on that as much as they like.
-I enjoyed the new CL236BB's use as a poke and as a followup.
-Versatile things such 9gB from all stance, her get out move, interupt move with a cost but rewarding.
-More fast close quarter moves back from SC3 Ivy like her 44B, 44A or low SW 1A.
-maybe....maybe CL 214B being relatively more balanced in BD. But I did thought SC4 was unsafe enough as it never matches SC3 X.
Ill post more on this one later.
Just make sure that this thread doesnt turn into a discussion where we toss things such as comparing BD ivy with SC4 ivy which is what the BD thread is for. The posted ideas needs *direction* to how it affects her with respect to your model of how she is capable of fighting, which would be refined by balancing out by nerfs in certain areas just like what developers would think.
So...what would be good if ppl form conceptual ideas of how the *NEW* ivy's mechanics should be designed, while also giving her weaknesses that can be accepted but not downgraded to the point we feel ripped off and uninspired like BD, which is my opinion already.
So...Ill kickstart with some ideas.
How should CS and SS be implemented?
No doubt everyone wants CS and SS a mixup just like in SC2 which isn't a change nor does it seem to be a step forward. SC3 Ivy's 66[K] into mixup is one of the interesting changes I have seen so far as it allows her to frametrap ppl into command throws, plus she had plenty of other SW tools which give good frames for setup back when Command throws were fast! SC4 Ivy is designed for SW iCS and WP SS before CL was discovered to be possible. BD demonstrates what their original intentions were for accessing command throws but actually quite an obsolete method. SC3 in my ranks is still the big step forward, where SE allows both command throws. CL being useless due no throws and weak lows imo is dull if not a failure. SC3 having one stance making her throws deadly is one thing I wish to see in SCV. The next thing I want to see is a new looking command throw not some shakable SE A, 236A. I like SCIV's swap of command throws from SW and WP and would like it if they gave her a secondary command throw for each stance which can be weaker but still more damaging. And possible for different purposes such as crouch throw or AT.
How should her stance system be designed?
This one is an open-ended discussion where possibilities are endless. Bcos ppl dislike CL, we go how about just having WP <> SW? Ppl enjoyed SC2 freedom of access to tools and so did SC4 Ivy's CL before BD's changes. Everyone wants their char to be versatile, but sure limitations force us to play a certain style, that could be their argument to BD's changes. But the thing is, BD Ivy's CL stance isnt rewarding enough just to have instant access from being cutoff to make it fun. For CL was to be a true transtional stance between WP and SW, it needs to be MUCH MORE versatile than WP and SW. Tho bcos she can 8wr and throw like her other stance, CL isnt really a transition. By more versatile I meant having MORE of "2 mix" choices like the BD's CL 66B into 66B+K or 66B,A+K. More to the point where it can make frame traps like SC3 Maxi or access to many stances like SC2 Ivy. Or I wish for SC5 to have more than one transitional stance than just SE. (Proper special stances, not just simply WP 6B+K into CL like BD.)
I disliked the purpose of stance barriers, if the middle stance is crap. Simple as that. Either give her a versatile CL back, or one with more transitional options. Any cool ideas also post up!
How offense and defense game tools:
SCIV did get her treatment of good tools and being accessible. This one is a discussion where it can never be easily agreed on as conceptual and on game will never be the same. This topic is to say what she can HAVE and at the same time FOREGO so that its a viable design to make her fun and not too broken or pathetic as we witnessed from 1.01 or BD. As a starter, say what moves she can go with each stance and what shall be removed as a result of a buff etc. Tho ofcos its too easy to get greedy like I may be already doing so from the following: :P
-Personally Im happy SC4 have retained her SC3 RO cannon and made use for WP WS BB.
-I like how [A] 6B+K is like her SC1 and SC2 main space offense and ppl can play on that as much as they like.
-I enjoyed the new CL236BB's use as a poke and as a followup.
-Versatile things such 9gB from all stance, her get out move, interupt move with a cost but rewarding.
-More fast close quarter moves back from SC3 Ivy like her 44B, 44A or low SW 1A.
-maybe....maybe CL 214B being relatively more balanced in BD. But I did thought SC4 was unsafe enough as it never matches SC3 X.
Ill post more on this one later.