SCV Yoshimitsu Q&A and General Discussion

(Is this the right thread for this?)

So I've been maining Mitsurugi, but I've always had a softspot for Yoshimitsu.

The TL;DR is I've been trying to transition to Yoshi as my main. I've been ferociously practicing with him.

Got any advice for me fighting Nightmare? These guys are both B ranked in the upper 60%. He seriously scares the shit out of me. Besides the obvious, like me screwing up basic moves/combos. I'm still learning and as a result, I turn into all thumbs when I get nervous. Like trying to do a doorknocker with 6A haha (I have A bound to triangle and B+K bound to square thanks to Yoshi and his odd inputs, so I kinda derp when I go to instincts). And on another note, I still can't get that aB+K, despite how I set up the buttons and how quick I can mash it. I always end up with a freakin' A+K or it thinks I'm just holding A. Hell, I've even gotten an A+B out of it before.... Anyway...

On that note, I DO think I have what it takes to beat them. I just feel like I need that "extra push" to get to the next level, if you know what I mean.

Something like "Oh, you did ___ here, ____ would be a better option" or "you can't punish for crap, don't use 22B so much you flaming retard" would really help me out. I know some of you are freaking awesome at Yoshi, and I'd love the advice.


Or maybe I just need to stop sucking?
 
When I picked up SC3 Yoshi for the first time, I thought I had was trapped in a horrible dream.

Also I just don't understand why they made a:B+K so hard haha. Aside from CH it's useless!! And if you can't MCF consistently it's useless on that too haha!! -6 on hit?!!!? I still use it though for it's pizzazz factor.
 
I don't think anyone who can't MCF can fully take hold of Yoshi. Spend your time getting that down instead of a:B+K. Just general stuff, I never use the FC1K series. I use FC3K cause it's the same speed and safety and on hit it's 40 damage with the 3B follow up. NM specific stuff, use 2A to cut NM out of his stances if you're in range, it'll beat all options and put you at +8. Step his CE and punish. Really with NM just go into the practice lab and figure out what you can punish. A lot of people freeze under Grim Stride pressure but 2A cuts it down as it TC is a SpLow and cuts step. This Nightmare is really aggressive and I feel if you know the frame data, that's works in Yoshi's favour.
 
2A for GS is a must. You also have to get used to teching in very important spots. Like after a GS K (BE) non-wallsplat, if you don't tech he gets another free one... and another... and another... meter permitting of course. Duck the 2nd hit of his 4KK (the two punch). agA is duckable. Don't fall for 22_88 A GS B or whatever the notation is. It's a funky looking spin around slash into grim stride B that catches a lot of people (myself included) trying to back dash. Know his strings and his frame data and it should become a managable battle since he's in negative frames a lot or takes a long time to get his moves out at the risk of getting Manji Dick Punched.
 
Oboro, I switched to Kilik towards the end of my SC2 tenure (which is why I main Xiba now) and I went to through that exact entire series of questions through SC3, a bit of 4 and now 5; why are you raping my character! (aside from the ws B which was the best addition added to 3/4 but ironically removed again in 5)

Anyway, I can get a:B+K about 90-95% now but iMCF I still get, AT BEST, about 40%. Please someone teach me the trick to hitting this consistently =( So I agree, it's pretty much useless if you can't hit constantly. This game has a very small margin for error, especially against solid opponents who use BE and CE correctly.
 
RedfooT said:
Oboro, I switched to Kilik towards the end of my SC2 tenure (which is why I main Xiba now) and I went to through that exact entire series of questions through SC3, a bit of 4 and now 5; why are you raping my character! (aside from the ws B which was the best addition added to 3/4 but ironically removed again in 5)

Anyway, I can get a:B+K about 90-95% now but iMCF I still get, AT BEST, about 40%. Please someone teach me the trick to hitting this consistently =( So I agree, it's pretty much useless if you can't hit constantly. This game has a very small margin for error, especially against solid opponents who use BE and CE correctly.
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It's all about placing the down at the correct moment. If you can slide other JFs like aPat's twister it should be too hard. Xiba is one of Yoshi's best matchups simply because we can 4B+K out of so many mixups. And since Xiba doesn't have shit for interrupts we can iMCF rape more than with most characters. I think it'll buff out though. Knowing PS they'll find a reason to nerf Yosh.
 
I use a pad Redfoot so if you're using a stick I can't help you. On a pad I hit both moves 90+ percent and I always finish off practice with 20 MCF in a row. I have my buttons reversed so that A is B and G is K and I just flicked my thumb across A onto B in a sharp snappy manner. I'm not fussy about when I press 2. As long as Yoshi doesn't start to move before you make the button inputs I find no difference for myself though others recommend pressing 2 and A absolutely together. Experiment and feel it out. The button timing is definitely the key problem most have.
 
mkl said:
It's all about placing the down at the correct moment. If you can slide other JFs like aPat's twister it should be too hard. Xiba is one of Yoshi's best matchups simply because we can 4B+K out of so many mixups. And since Xiba doesn't have shit for interrupts we can iMCF rape more than with most characters. I think it'll buff out though. Knowing PS they'll find a reason to nerf Yosh.
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Funny you mention that, I had deciphered that hitting down at the right moment HAD to be the issue since the timing essentially the same as the a:B+K as far as execution goes. Do you have anymore specific advice or tips for hitting down at the correct timing? Any particular methods or tricks, etc? I don't use aPat so I don't know what the timing is for his twister. But from the sounds of it, it seems like it's just a good ol' fashion time and practice... that blows, haha. Thanks for the input though dude.


Oboro said:
I use a pad Redfoot so if you're using a stick I can't help you. On a pad I hit both moves 90+ percent and I always finish off practice with 20 MCF in a row. I have my buttons reversed so that A is B and G is K and I just flicked my thumb across A onto B in a sharp snappy manner. I'm not fussy about when I press 2. As long as Yoshi doesn't start to move before you make the button inputs I find no difference for myself though others recommend pressing 2 and A absolutely together. Experiment and feel it out. The button timing is definitely the key problem most have.
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2 and A absolutely together, I'll make more of a conscious effort to pay attention to it. It seems for, I tend to slide A too quickly. I notice in practice mode more than half the time I'll do 2B instead of the iMCF. The little inputs will show that I'm hitting 2 and B but NOT A. But I'm 100% sure I'm hitting A so I guessing I'm just sliding it too fast? The only reason I don't think its the button timing rather the pressing down timing is because I hit a:B+K 90% easily. Thanks for the advice though, I appreciate it. 20 iMCF in a row? I like your discipline dude. Good stuff.

PS . I switched to Kilik in SC2 towards the end because I enjoyed how strong his overall range game was. Yoshi, Cervy, Taki, Talim and even Ivy all had that really strong close up game and it just started to feel like I was having poking matches towards the end with everybody. With Kilik, it just felt like I could range and set up strats much more. That's pretty much it.

PPS. I'm super old school BTW guys, I hit MCF from couch EVEN LESS than I do standing. When I do a 2A, I will usually RCC into an iMCF rather than do it from crouch, I can't seem to time it correctly =/ So if you guys have any advice on that, that would be awesome too.
 
I can make a video showing that you don't have to hit them exactly. I know this for certain but it seems it helps people with the timing. Also a:B+K and MCF don't have the same input window. Some people will perform MCF by using the same buttons they use for parting thrust as you can press 2a:B+K and MCF will come out. Test how much more slowly you can do parting thrust but get 2A if you try MCF at the same speed. But if you are doing it fast enough for MCF it's is more than fast enough for parting thrust.

Also MCF from crouch is a frame faster so don't RCC. This makes the 2K set up and a second MCF after one is blocked better for traps! The 2K trap is great cause good players know that low pokes leave the poker at a disadvantage typically and will attack as a response. Throwing out MCF after 2K is awesome cause you are only -2 and FC MCF being i9 will beat anything shy of another MCF or aPat's CE. Very handy!
 
Oboro said:
I can make a video showing that you don't have to hit them exactly. I know this for certain but it seems it helps people with the timing. Also a:B+K and MCF don't have the same input window. Some people will perform MCF by using the same buttons they use for parting thrust as you can press 2a:B+K and MCF will come out. Test how much more slowly you can do parting thrust but get 2A if you try MCF at the same speed. But if you are doing it fast enough for MCF it's is more than fast enough for parting thrust.

Also MCF from crouch is a frame faster so don't RCC. This makes the 2K set up and a second MCF after one is blocked better for traps! The 2K trap is great cause good players know that low pokes leave the poker at a disadvantage typically and will attack as a response. Throwing out MCF after 2K is awesome cause you are only -2 and FC MCF being i9 will beat anything shy of another MCF or aPat's CE. Very handy!
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Bro, you just dropped some mad knowledge on me. I thought that the Ear Slicer and iMCF timing were the same timing. I had no idea the input window was different, that explains a lot. So the iMCF and MCF have to be done faster than a:B+K? Can you drop the exact frama data for both? (as far as input time window if you happen to have it). Also, I don't want to RCC into iMCF, I simply just cant do from full crouch consistently, even less consistently than iMCF =/ So I just RCC into it which is totally redundant and stupid since I'm losing 2 frames or so.
 
I don't know the exact numbers to be honest. I recalled hearing a 4 frame window for Ear Slicer which was SC4's Parting Thrust. It may be the same. The reason it's harder in this game is because you now have to release A in the same manner that MCF is executed in place of behind able to plink it. I wouldn't be surprised if MCF was a real 1 frame slide but it may be 2. Definitely faster than a:B+K. How are your controls for MCF set up? I'm faster flicking my thumb from Y to X so I swap the buttons. The good thing now is that FC MCF stun is no longer shakeable. Before to get the guaranteed combo you had to RCC but now you can simply enjoy the extra speed!
 
Thanks guys, I'm devoting the day to learning to get that MCF down since I've just been putting it off haha. Also, didn't know you could duck the second hit in his 4KK, I just naturally figured it was a mid for whatever reason. That alone will probably win me some matches!

I'll try a few hours into training mode VS a nightmare and try to get natural with this advice before heading online again, thanks again guys.
 
Well I uploaded some Replays to to YT so you guys can see yourself, but I know I lack defense, and I guess you could say I should pick up a combo or two, but I don't think that's the major problem, tired of losing is all, my ranked record is at a 30% win chance, and player is like 45% =X
I played Yoshi in 4 too, but I was mediocre due to lack of combos.

What am I doing wrong?
Know you Yoshi vets would know.


I'm the Yoshi of course.
 
I think your problem there against Sieg was your D. Trying to attack at poor times and also not avoiding and punishing as much as you can against him. Offensively I'd say you seem to be forcing what you feel will give you big damage rather than the appropriate tools for the situation. Yoshimitsu 2 biggest strengths are traps and pressure with MCF and variety.
 
I was getting raped by that Sieg, I couldn't even really get in though, he was so..... quick. And unpredictable, an azz beating I'll never forget.

Perhaps I should work on variety, yet that depends on my fighting situations.
 
you lost to sieg because you didnt block his lows and kept getting stunned into combo's

just learn to block his stances
 
Yoshi can cut down all of Sieg's transitions and mixups up close. I'm working on a strat list for Sieg at the moment actually.
 
Oboro said:
Yoshi can cut down all of Sieg's transitions and mixups up close. I'm working on a strat list for Sieg at the moment actually.
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It's difficult to say this seeing as you were online, but you gotta read the lows better. Sieg has a few lows that to this day give me trouble (turn around stance kick being high on that list for some reason), but most of them are realllly manageable. Especially if they're thrown out in normal form and not mixed up like they were in that battle.
 
Also you gotta build the muscle memory to cut down his options. Knowing if just the first step for sure! You gotta be able to read them.

Man I bought a sub 1 frame of lag monitor! It's got 5ms of input lag 1/3-1/4 of a frame. It's funny but little things like that make a difference! Particularly online!
 
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