Soulcalibur VI DLC Discussion Thread

[Rusted Blade]

How dare you. No one talks about Aeon like tha- oh you mean THAT guy. Oh well never mind.

Aww, I think the Ugly Green Guest (which name I like if nothing else--it rolls off the tongue like Jolly Green Giant), gets a lot more shit than he deserves. The design is a little Buck Rogers alien meets Professional Wrestler, I will grant you, but the moveset is actually quite a bit of fun if you dig into it. Alienboy has frame traps and other control mechanics for days.

I just wanna say do not underestimate Project Soul's ability to be out of touch. They could still be using that shitty poll from 2015 to determine the season 2 pass.

Meaning Yun-Seong would be next

I think Project Soul/Namco are only out of touch to the extent of their communication. When it comes to features in the last few games that the hardcore crowd abhor, I think those were made not because they were unaware of how top level players would feel about them, but because they were attempting a blue ocean approach to their sales that took them away from strict adherence to the expectations of their most loyal and longest-term fans. The extent to which this is reasonable because they "are after-all a company who wants to make money, and maybe particularly emphasize short-term profits as a business matter" is a 'your mileage will vary' kind of situation, of course. Ok, yes, in SCV, some of that was just simply the result of a bad design philosophy. But that emphasizes another important point: this is still a game at the end of the day that its developers will design with fidelity to principles other than just market research (though I'm sure Namco's marketing team inundates the developers with what data does exist on character popularity, to help inform and constrain those decisions to some extent.

Anyway, I think no matter where you're taking your ques from, Hwang is highly indicated this time around. I mean, honestly, I'll eat my hat if that yellow spot doesn't end up being him. I know you're gun shy after 12 years of disappointment, but I'm telling you, I think it's safe to start imagining your approach to him in SCVI, because I can feel him coming.

 

[LisaK]

I'll eat my hat if that yellow spot doesn't end up being him.

don't forget to record and send it to us.

 

[Rusted Blade]

don't forget to record and send it to us.

There's a reason I didn't say I'll eat my controller, as I was at first inclined to. ;)


On a separate note, this is as a good a time as any to talk about potential DLC character that I feel has fallen through the cracks. At this point, the notion of his inclusion in SCVI has a virtually negative chance of happening, but I can't help but feel he ought to be talked about a little more. You see in the SCIII console release, there were 17 bonus characters who had incomplete movesets when compared against the rest of the characters from the (already sizeable) main roster. Of thiese 17, 13 were completely new characters who emerged from the Chronicles of the Sword mode's lore. Four, however, were playable or featured in prominent series lore before hand. Three of those four (Amy, Hwang, and Li Long) all went on to get a full moveset and integration in Soulcalibur III: Arcade Edition, while the fourth was dropped entirely from that (superior) version of the game, along with the other 13 remaining bonus characters. In short, that character--Arthur--got the short end of the stick in one of the most pronounced ways in series history.

For those who are unfamiliar, Arthur is one of several obscure characters from the early franchise history that were the result of localization concerns relating to the inclusion of Mitsurugi to the Korean market. For obvious reasons, in the mid nineties, the idea of a Samurai (a historical symbol of Japanese martial authority) was viewed as something that, in the Korean market, was likely to dampen appeal at a minimum (and indeed, even be seen as potentially inflammatory)--if you're unaware of why this would be the case, you need to do more reading about eastern asia's history than that which involves wooden cyborgs and pirates who dress like Elvis, just saying. :) Anyway, Arthur was one of these solutions, standing in for Mitsurugi by utilizing the Japanese character's moveset but being notably caucasian, in Soulcalibur I. A similar thing had been done with Hwang standing in for Mitsu in Soul Edge. However, while Hwang would go on to become his own character with a diverging moveset inspired more by Xiangua than Mitsu by the very next game (SCI), Arthur had to wait substantially longer to receive his own unique moveset in SCIII:CE. Even then, he was the sole character in all of SCIII's roster who also had a previous place in series lore who did not get included in SCIII:AE. He has appeared sporadically in the single player modes of almost every game in the series since then, but usually tucked away in a singular, not particularly notable corner of the story, and always as a reskin character fighting with Mitsurugi's style.

I would personally not mind seeing Arthur return to at last claim a full and unique moveset of his own in the next game. I mean, he's kind of the living embodiment of that silly white samurai trope, down to the almost obligatory eye patch. But I had been thinking the series could use another Samurai, given the number of other weapons/character archetypes that have multiple styles organized around them at this point. Of course, that was before Haohmaru, who will establish extra coverage of that area when he drops. Arthur was already unlikely in the extreme for SCVI's continuing support, and now he would be redundant to boot. Still, insofar as (for SCVII) we're presumably heading deeper into events originally covered in SCIII, I think Arthur could be ripe for a return eventually.

 

[Crash X]

Aww, I think the Ugly Green Guest (which name I like if nothing else--it rolls off the tongue like Jolly Green Giant), gets a lot more shit than he deserves. The design is a little Buck Rogers alien meets Professional Wrestler, I will grant you, but the moveset is actually quite a bit of fun if you dig into it. Alienboy has frame traps and other control mechanics for days.

I think Project Soul/Namco are only out of touch to the extent of their communication. When it comes to features in the last few games that the hardcore crowd abhor, I think those were made not because they were unaware of how top level players would feel about them, but because they were attempting a blue ocean approach to their sales that took them away from strict adherence to the expectations of their most loyal and longest-term fans. The extent to which this is reasonable because they "are after-all a company who wants to make money, and maybe particularly emphasize short-term profits as a business matter" is a 'your mileage will vary' kind of situation, of course. Ok, yes, in SCV, some of that was just simply the result of a bad design philosophy. But that emphasizes another important point: this is still a game at the end of the day that its developers will design with fidelity to principles other than just market research (though I'm sure Namco's marketing team inundates the developers with what data does exist on character popularity, to help inform and constrain those decisions to some extent.

Anyway, I think no matter where you're taking your ques from, Hwang is highly indicated this time around. I mean, honestly, I'll eat my hat if that yellow spot doesn't end up being him. I know you're gun shy after 12 years of disappointment, but I'm telling you, I think it's safe to start imagining your approach to him in SCVI, because I can feel him coming.

Ehhh...I played him before but I never got any enjoyment out of him. He’s not my cuppa tea.

 

[Rusted Blade]

Ehhh...I played him before but I never got any enjoyment out of him. He’s not my cuppa tea.

I didn't like him much in the original run of SCII, but I came to a deeper appreciation of the style when SCII:HDO was released, and then the underwhelming features and shitty matchmaking caused online play to collapse within the first six weeks. It left me devoting a lot of the time I spent on that version doing couch play with friends again and just dicking around in training, so I gave a number of characters I had never liked in the early 2000's a closer look, and (being a much more seasoned and technical player by that point) I was able to appreciate that Necrid is kind of a beast. He just dominates the close and middle range, where he has massive frame advantages and really safe entries into decent damage combos. Of course, I came to appreciate all of this just in time to have no context to use it against anybody! :)

 

[DanteSC3]

Arthur

Issue with Arthur is that we already kinda have him, as a Mitsurugi alt.

 

[Ardenwolf]

Issue with Arthur is that we already kinda have him, as a Mitsurugi alt.

Apparently not an issue to project soul as we're getting Mitsurugi as a guest as well as a part of the original roster.

 

[Rusted Blade]

Issue with Arthur is that we already kinda have him, as a Mitsurugi alt.

Yeah. I mean I never honestly expected him to make it into SCVI, but as soon as I saw that alt, I thought "Eh, yeah, that's virtually outright confirmation: what we get for this game is an outfit allusion." Still, it does demonstrate that the guy is still on their minds. So when SCVII comes around...who knows?

 

[Thylacine492]

Yeah. I mean I never honestly expected him to make it into SCVI, but as soon as I saw that alt, I thought "Eh, yeah, that's virtually outright confirmation: what we get for this game is an outfit allusion." Still, it does demonstrate that the guy is still on their minds. So when SCVII comes around...who knows?

...Who wants to bet that he’ll become a wind priestess so he can keep Haohmaru’s tornadoes?

 

[SpellcraftQuill]

Arthur would have been cool to develop into his own character I guess. Probably the western longsword user with Geralt’s Witcher signs?

 

[DanteSC3]

Yeah. I mean I never honestly expected him to make it into SCVI, but as soon as I saw that alt, I thought "Eh, yeah, that's virtually outright confirmation: what we get for this game is an outfit allusion." Still, it does demonstrate that the guy is still on their minds. So when SCVII comes around...who knows?

Well on that note, Hwang and Li Long have never really left their minds, either. Broken Destiny and SoulCalibur V both had custom characters for them.
Arthur was in Broken Destiny too, and while technically not in SoulCalibur V, there was a blonde samurai with an eyepatch that could be a reference.

 

[Rusted Blade]

Arthur would have been cool to develop into his own character I guess. Probably the western longsword user with Geralt’s Witcher signs?

Nah, he's always been a wielder of Japanese single edge blades; basically he's the SC iteration of the "White Samurai" trope. Giving him a western weapon would be antithetical to his entire design and raison d'etre as a character.

On a side note, forgive my being pedantic, but the weapons that Geralt uses are not longswords--not using accurate historical terms for classification, anyway. As far as I've ever been able to tell, this inaccuracy arose way back when "Longsword" was the name that Dungeons and Dragons (inaccurately) gave to that size and style of sword about 35 years ago--and as a result, it got adopted by hundreds of pulp fantasy novels and video games that adopt a generic medieval fantasy setting. But using the actual technical terms for real historical weapons, the "longsword" is actually a two-handed weapon with a blade that is subsantially longer than a one-handed sidesword (Dungeons and Dragons and the many hundreds of games and fictional works that borrowed its faulty scheme call this larger sword a "great sword", but that is another mis-labelling). The weapons that Geralt uses are actually a combination of what are more accurately described as "arming swords" (which came into use in the early-to-mid middle ages), as well as weapons such as the estoc and spada-da-lato (variants on the same basic design with thinner blades and more involved guards, which evolved in the late middle ages). Siegfried's default sword is the closest thing to what was historically called a "longsword" that you can find in Soulcalibur (though of course the blade on his sword is absurdly more massive and impractical than any sword ever wielded by a human being in any historical culture).

Arthur was in Broken Destiny too, and while technically not in SoulCalibur V, there was a blonde samurai with an eyepatch that could be a reference.

Yup, Arthur has shown up in some form in the single player of every game since SCIII, I think. I can't recall with absolute certainty that he was among the Tower of Lost Souls opponents in IV, but some variation of the design shows up in BD, V, LS, and VI.

 

[I_Love_Aogami]

I just wanna say do not underestimate Project Soul's ability to be out of touch. They could still be using that shitty poll from 2015 to determine the season 2 pass.

Meaning Yun-Seong would be next

 

[Heniek]

@Rusted Blade
Geralt's default swords are absolutely longswords. Not to mention that estoc IS a type of a longsword but that's just a nitpick. As for Siegfried - one of his weapons is indeed something we can call a great sword and that was always my favourite weapon of his. Wouldn't call that thing a longsword tho

I would also pick a longsword for Arthur. It may be completely out of the way when it comes to period of Arthurian legends (because let's be real - name Arthur in a historical setting always brings the legendary Arthur into mind) but if they made him into a Last Tom Cruise Samurai then I don't see a problem

 

[Starringrole]

Hwang is hot too....

 

[Heniek]

Hwang is hot too....

Introducing Yun over Hwang would be a really sad thing to happen. Not only was this character in a gutter for so much time but he was also established pretty well in chronicles. Yun on the other hand had so much exposure that if someone starts with SCVI as a first game he would be like Ozzy Osbourne "whothefuck is yoonsoong?"
I would definitely bet that Hwang is the character we'll be getting and I would suspect him in this season pass.
I would preffer Rock but no one likes him sniff

 

[DanteSC3]

I can't recall with absolute certainty that he was among the Tower of Lost Souls opponents in IV

Hwang, Li Long, and Arthur weren't in SoulCalibur IV at all. There were some weird reimaginations of Chronicles of the Sword characters, but not them.

I would preffer Rock but no one likes him sniff

I like him, he's the male equivalency of Talim, a pure being who can't be corrupted by any means. I'd like to see him back, I'd say he's got a 50/50 with Aeon for the last slot of season 2, but if we get a season 3, he'll surely return if he hasn't already.

 

[Heniek]

ike him, he's the male equivalency of Talim, a pure being who can't be corrupted by any means. I'd like to see him back, I'd say he's got a 50/50 with Aeon for the last slot of season 2, but if we get a season 3, he'll surely return if he hasn't already.

That was a hit in the nail. Was trying to find a good way to describe why I like him so much. Usually I would say that it's because he is a simple, strongly motivated character with a good heart and those characters are really welcome in the age of more complex and/or gritty characters but that comparison to Talim is way easier and faster to do so thanks!

 

[Starringrole]

Introducing Yun over Hwang would be a really sad thing to happen. Not only was this character in a gutter for so much time but he was also established pretty well in chronicles. Yun on the other hand had so much exposure that if someone starts with SCVI as a first game he would be like Ozzy Osbourne "whothefuck is yoonsoong?"
I would definitely bet that Hwang is the character we'll be getting and I would suspect him in this season pass.
I would preffer Rock but no one likes him sniff

I'd be miserable. I've been waiting forever for Hwang, he's been one of my biggest obsessions with the series now in terms of who I want to come back.
Since SC6 has attracted a bit of a new audience it would make sense to reintroduce Hwang I agree, I believe they'd also try quite hard to raise his appeal.
I hope he arrives, I'll send Okubo crying selfies if he doesn't.

As for Rock I want him back too. I actually have a bit more hope for him than Hwang in a way, though I'm fairly confident about Hwang.
I actually told myself my mains in SC6 would be: Amy, Hwang and Rock. I plan to try and do it too especially since it seems Rock could change a bit due to Asteroth in SC6. I'm really excited for him and he's one of my favorites. He's always been what I viewed as a male alternative to Talim, and I like both of them a lot, I also like the fact they openly keep the fatherly theme with him. The family trait on characters always serves as a way to make me like them easily.

 

[Rusted Blade]

@Rusted Blade
Geralt's default swords are absolutely longswords. Not to mention that estoc IS a type of a longsword but that's just a nitpick.

I'm sorry Heniek, but you're wrong about that. As I said before, "longsword" is a term widely promulgated by nerd-speak arising out of pulp fantasy novels and video games. But as a factual/technical/historical matter, that term is more or less incorrect for any of the weapons of a length commiserate with those that Geralt uses (in this game): no historian, archeologist, or professional arms keeper would be likely to call any of those weapons a longsword, and the tendency to call them longswords in pop culture circles only arose in the last couple of decades.

For most of the entire rest of the more than 1400 years that these weapons existed (and up until today as far as experts and sources that actually discuss and classify historical weapons are concerned) those were not "long swords" and if they are designed to be wielded one-handed, they just are not best described as long swords, as a technical matter. There was some variability in the use of the term throughout history, but in terms of how they are technically classified today, as a historical and archaeological matter, "long sword" references a class of two-handed weapon. The estoc evolved out the late middle ages variant of the arming sword (also sometimes called a knight sword), to which it is substantially similar, but with a much slimmer blade and a curved guard that was a fore-runner of the more elaborate guards that would shortly evolve when the side sword became more of a weapon of upper class dueling than a mainstay of warfare.

Just to be extra clear here:

• This is a longsword, not a great sword.
• This is an arming sword, not a longsword
• This is an estoc, not a longsword
• This is a spada da lato, not a longsword

You'll notice that Geralt has close approximations of each of those last three, but I assure you, as a technical matter, none of these is very accurately described as a longsword. that is to say, they are not called longswords by experts on middle age warfare, nor by any other source that formally describes them today. They are mostly only called longswords in fantasy games and novels, and by those people who are more familiar with such weapons through fantasy rather than an understanding of actual historical combat.

Note: I edited this to soften the tone and be a little less absolutist and strident, as I realized I was coming off as a little bit of a pedantic dick and not spending enough time discussing the intricacies of the terminology and conceding that these terms did vary somewhat via the disparate linguistic, time frame, and regional considerations. The truth is, for any of those weapons, if you look around enough in the historical record, you may very well find them referenced as a "long sword" (or something similar) in some language or another. Nevertheless, in terms of how they are classified by experts today in English, 'longsword' is reserved for a specific class of swords that evolved a long time after the arming sword and its immediate variations, whereas the common parlance nomenclature in fantasy works is to label just about any western-looking sword bigger than a gladius but smaller than a great sword as a "long sword", as a ginormous class. But that label is imprecise and overbroad when used in that manner.