Voldo Match video and discussion

@Youarefail -
Pretty good, but 1[K], BS 2B+K, MCHT K*66 does more damage and leaves Voldo with better wakeup options...
@Ahriman -
Try to use 4A in your arsenal more, it's a good poke at range... Example you walk up and do 1K when you could have done 4A... 4A = Good...
 
Frostheart (Taki) VS Raphire (Voldo) FT3, 6th November 2010


I know I have a lot more to learn... Please advise
 
Well, advice breaks up into two parts, anti-taki and Voldo. I think the first is actually more relevant to your difficulties in that match, but I'll mostly talk about the latter since that will help you more generally. Some big things anti taki: if she goes into hover and you didn't try to hit her (i.e. you are just blocking), step or hop back and she will whiff giving you a free combo. Also, PO K is a frame trap, taki is neutral or positive after that. After you block PO K you basically have to keep blocking, or maybe GI. Also, watch out anytime taki is crouched and at minor disadvantage (i.e. after hover B on block, after a chip low), her WR K is very fast and leads to some good combos. So in those cases just go for BB and nothing fancier.

As far as Voldo stuff goes: you used a lot of nyeh moves far too often. in SC4, more often that not less is more, i.e. better off using a smaller number of a character's more powerful moves than the whole moveset. Randomly throwing out 44[K] as often as you do, CR A, MCFT B/A, BS 2B+K (too often outside combos), these aren't good. I would first simplifying your Voldo, stick to his main moves which have specific purposes and be clear on why you are using each one. Then you can bring back more variety when you understand better what their purpose is. I.e. 44[k] isn't a move to be spammed, it's good evasively when your opponent is about to attack and fairly close to you (so you end up behind them after they whiff).

In terms of specifics, i would say use more 2A+B. Always do 2A+B236, even if you plan to block after, it recovers faster. Usually though you should use CR B/K/A+B after 2A+B unless you are playing someone who is bunkering down. Always use 2A+B236 B/K when you are facing forward and they are on the ground, it's your best option. A few times I saw you just do 236 B when they were grounded, this is worse in general. Don't use so much 3BB, I know it's easy but it's not very safe, not very fast, can be GIed in between... Instead use 1[K], 2B+K, K. This is a very easy combo that does good damage, 1[K] is safe and puts you in blind stance at moderate disadvantage from where you can try a BS A+B (parries a lot of stuff) or BS 1A (crouches under a lot of stuff). Normal stance A+B is also excellent, very safe mid with good gauge damage leads to great combos. Work on hitting 66B and 66:B, its important for combos and punishment. Good use of BS 1A in one of those matches, it's a good mixup tool. A great way to shift into BS is with normal stance 4A, this move is neutral on block. Most people don't realize this and will attack after, so I recommend 4A ~ BS AA which will stuff most things. 6BB is also great as an interrupt and way to get into BS, it's tied for his fastest move from standing. 2A is also very important for Voldo because of his lack of fast moves. AA and BB and grabs are key as always. In blind stance, you can mix up BS 1A with 3B or 22B or 66B.

A comment not related to which moves you used: you whiffed a lot. Whiffing is really bad, you can eat a lot of damage for whiffing even something that seems pretty small. So don't just do moves you think probably won't even land on your opponent's guard. Sometimes you can anticipate that your opponent is about to run up to you and try to hit them coming in, but you were whiffing often.

I'd recommend reading some of the threads in here and in the general tactics section first, try to assimilate it, play some more, etc go back and forth. You can improve a lot by reading info that's already here without waiting for critiques of your game.

Oh PS nice in that one game, you hit A+B 66:B 1, that (well there should be an extra 66B after the A+B but whatever) is a pretty sweet combo.
 
Hey Nirf, thanks for taking the time to post such a detailed reply.
Looks like I really need to start using 2A+B more, all the experienced players I meet tell me the same thing. On grounded opponents, got it.

I have actually pretty much scoured the forums here in my last year as a lurker, so I know almost all the basics but when it comes to applying my knowledge I am quite hopeless, despite frequent practice. In the past, don't get to face human opponents often at all, in fact I could count my number of encounters with human players in the region of 40 to 50 matches(except this one guy I play all the time but we know each other so well it's more like dancing) so I have lots of bad habits from playing AI so damned much.(like whiffing those BS 2B+K to go into MC or sometimes even 2B+K as a feint to set up MCFT B which the AI always eats)

It also doesn't help that I'm a slow learner (what some people I know would call a person with psychomotor problems) I still cant get my 66:B down pat, (I need to spasm like a retard to do it) hence my frequent missing of free damage after CH 66B, A+B and NH 66:B.

Oh, and I was taking quite a lot of liberties with 44K because I play Frostheart quite a lot( more than half the abovementioned 40 matches was with him) and he never stops attacking, and I've had quite some success with spamming this move against him. (apart from the times he yomi'd me so well he air grabbed me out of it but it only happened once)

So, any tips and tricks for a guy who cant get his execution down? (I've been practicing loads but the practice doesn't seem to stick)
 
To hit 66:B, just make sure you hit the second 6 and the B almost simultaneously. To get 66B just avoid this. At this point though I think your time is better spent on other things than training on this stuff, especially if you think it will be hard for you. You can just do CH 66B 2A+B236B, NH 66:B 2A+B236B, A+B (66:B OR 66B) 2A+B236B. You will still get 80% of the damage.

Instead, I would focus on using less moves and on when and where you attack. I.e. understanding frames in the game so you interrupt Taki successfully and mix her up, and making sure your attacks don't whiff. All the moves you really need are (I'm leaving out death roll and mantis crawl for now):
AA,2A,BB,grabs, 1[K], A+B, 2A+B (and followups), 66B/66:B, BS AA/BB/2A/grabs, BS 1A, BS 3B, BS 1K

In addition to that any moves required for combos. Basically in facing and blind stance you have interrupts, step catchers, grabs and power mids (and BS 1A) to mix up with. Be aware of all their properties. I.e. A+B has a better tech crouch and gauge damage then 1[K], but 1[K] puts in you in blind stance. Also, 1[K] has an easier combo afterward so you might prefer 1[K] for now. These moves alone properly applied could easily beat the Taki you played. Then if this is getting dull, throw in a few more setups: 4A from normal stance like I said is great. BS A+B is terrific as a followup to 1[K]. Once you have a good grasp on these simpler moves, you can slowly introduce more setups to vary your play. In all seriousness though, when I play online and I play people that seemed roughly on the level of that Taki, I only use a few moves outside of these. It's simply not necessary; these moves are some of the most efficient Voldo has and against someone who will get hit by them so often cause they're always attacking, you don't need fancy setups.

Oh, last random thing: never randomly charge 236A+B like that! 236A+B is high, so all you are doing is giving your opponent more time to duck. the only time to use 236[A+B] is if they are GI-ing 236A+B, I've had it happen to me once and it was fun making them eat the unblockable. But in general and certainly against your opponent who I didn't see GI hardly anything, stick with the 236A+B.
 
I'm not sure what missed punishment opportunities you mean. Early on you were whoring out 66B. The knee, bullrush, and 22B, some of his top moves: none of these are 66B punishable. You started using BS1A more later on, that's good, wasn't sure why you didn't use it earlier more. You can get AA for free though after a blocked knee (in theory, it's tight though), or you can take K (gives you one extra frame). 66B leaves you in pretty bad position on block, it's like -12, inside grab range. Way too often you tried to attack after it and ate the knee. Remember that the knee only hurts on counter hit, on normal hit it's not that bad. And on block, you get free damage. So just be patient, block the knee, take the free damage, and counter. Other than that, more 2A+B236 into follow ups. Another move I like vs Ast if you are having your way with BS mixups is 4A. Puts you in BS at neutral frames on block. Many astaroths try to knee after this transition; you can actually interrupt this because the knee is i16 but your BB in BS is i15. After you interrupt the knee followup (or after he learns to be passive after 4A) you can go into BS mixups. I wouldn't do so much landfish and mantis crawl vs asta, his crouch grabs are i13 and work against your stances. I don't think your opponent really exploited that but if you play a good asta they will.
 
Well, I meant I didn't punish the knee as much as I should have.

Yeah, after 66B, I usually don't attack. I was probably trying to be fancy and GI, but I don't really remember.

People tell me I need more 4As. I guess I really do. I'll start incorporating it.

And yes, I know not to abuse mantis crawl against Astaroth. I was just trying to test my cousin. Haha.

Thanks for the feedback though!
 
I guess what I didn't make that clear is: besides attacking less after 66B, you should throw it out way less in general. If you want something fast, use BB and if you want something powerful use A+B or 1[K], these moves are all better for various reasons than 66B (outside of punishment). I only ever use 66B outside of punishment if my opponent is really cheating on frames a lot, in which case 66B can be nice because its big damage for i16.
 
I think the tech trap might be affected by the CH property you still have on during the tech trap... I belive the combo would still do about 90~92 damage, I'm not 100% on this but since the combo isn't always garaunteed and could possibly ring yourself out (if not careful) I think BS 22B, 2A+B236G, 6:6{B} is a better option... Its an 82 damage combo (84d. on tech catch I believe), it can be hard to time but getting used to it is worth it, the combo also carries them a good distance toward the edge because from the edge the combo carries them to about the center of the stage (give or take a few)...
 
Enk, not taking away anything from your game but dang Mammoth was just not with it in those matches. It wasn't even competitive. You had some nice setups in there that I might steal at some point though, gotta watch that vid again sometime.
 
@Enkindu: One word to describe all those matches: "shenanegans"...
Tip: After Voldo's MCH 66 hits ground an immediate MCH K tracks 100%...
Also, new idea! BS 22B, 2A+B236A+K~BCR B = ~77d. and signature BS wake-up...
 
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