Sacharja
[12] Conqueror
After SBH B 66B (damage) and 44[ B ] (pressure, tech traps) are the best follow-ups.
Siegfried Videos
- Thread starter Cupui
- Start date
Cupui
[09] Warrior
IMHO SBH is the best sieg's stance for tech trap and mix up
you can do SBH B, SBH K or you can do a transition to SRSH
for a low or mid attack. :)
you can do SBH B, SBH K or you can do a transition to SRSH
for a low or mid attack. :)
Voidcrawler
[08] Mercenary
Awesome vids man, wish i'll be that good with Sieg someday ;)!
Comments:
1) Because this is offline I won't say the parries and counters and stance changes are impressive, especially against Nightmare who is one of the easiest characters to parry.
2) I watched 4 of your videos to see if you actually punish or attempt to counterhit, or are playing a little exchange of aggression game with your friend who you are playing. You are playing the aggression game and not playing a higher level counterhit game. So is your opponent, so I don't put the blame all on you.
3) The fully charged low you get from
+ was not parried or jumped once in the 10+ battles I saw. Because this is live that's basically a cardinal sin.
On the whole it's a good exhibition of combos but mainly because of insufficient sidestepping, ground control and a serious ass lack of counters. I do applaud the numerous cancels but question whether most were necessary given that half the time the attack would have hit your opponent. Typically you wait until the move stops hitting to cancel in a match... Also, no pounds with the flat part of the sword in the 10+ battles. You're not using your full moves set and I don't know why. No props for that.
1) Because this is offline I won't say the parries and counters and stance changes are impressive, especially against Nightmare who is one of the easiest characters to parry.
2) I watched 4 of your videos to see if you actually punish or attempt to counterhit, or are playing a little exchange of aggression game with your friend who you are playing. You are playing the aggression game and not playing a higher level counterhit game. So is your opponent, so I don't put the blame all on you.
3) The fully charged low you get from
+ was not parried or jumped once in the 10+ battles I saw. Because this is live that's basically a cardinal sin.On the whole it's a good exhibition of combos but mainly because of insufficient sidestepping, ground control and a serious ass lack of counters. I do applaud the numerous cancels but question whether most were necessary given that half the time the attack would have hit your opponent. Typically you wait until the move stops hitting to cancel in a match... Also, no pounds with the flat part of the sword in the 10+ battles. You're not using your full moves set and I don't know why. No props for that.
Sacharja
[12] Conqueror
Using Siegs full moveset is counterproductive.
Most of his moves are still situational or just plain sucky.
Narrow it down to the solid stuff and pick from there depending on your opponents style, experience and character. That being said Sieg doesnt have too many useful attacks that involve the flat end of the sword.
Most of his moves are still situational or just plain sucky.
Narrow it down to the solid stuff and pick from there depending on your opponents style, experience and character. That being said Sieg doesnt have too many useful attacks that involve the flat end of the sword.
SolidCake
[08] Mercenary
Lol, nice map.
But on the critique side, your Sieg is very good.
I would only say to 3 more and to also 6 more too.
3 is arguably one of the best sieg moves and 6 is very quick.
Your stance changeups were good, and the repeated CH's were great.
Good Luck with Mitsurugi, seeing as i have as much trouble with him as you do.
Nice Vids!
Characters don't have sucky moves, they have bad pilots who don't know how to use the moves correctly. Certain moves require more skill to execute well, flat pounds being a great example as well as
It's an easy way to show someone a way to get better at a character, and the misinformation that "Most of his moves are still situational or just plain sucky" is about the worst comment you could have added to this thread. It's not just counterproductive, it's wrong and anyone who believes you could suffer serious harm to their soul calibur skills. There are mainstay moves, a separate tier of often-used moves that get repeated, but that doesn't take away from the other moves. People who think that are underutilizing their character and likely suffering from the online syndrome I like to call "move spamming" Yes, online you can only use move spam. No, that's not the way to play a high level game of Soul Calibur, and as the person who posted the videos was posting live offline matches I doubt he wanted a low level critique of online play.
Sacharja
[12] Conqueror
Not every move can fill a niche. In fact many moves serve the same purpose, only that some moves have better properties and so using them over the rest makes more sense to maximize effiency. Some are situational, some are overall solid. And then there are those that just suck. SRSH A is a prime example for Sieg.
What you say sounds nice and all, but its idealistic and naive. In actual competitive play the opposite is the case. Movesets get narrowed down to the most effective and most abuseable moves. Maximum reward, mininum risk. Efficiency, thats what counts.
If you believe offline play doesnt have (successfull) move-spammers, then you clearly have yet to go to your first real tournament. Good luck, when you do.
PS: And who was talking about online, anyway? lulz
What you say sounds nice and all, but its idealistic and naive. In actual competitive play the opposite is the case. Movesets get narrowed down to the most effective and most abuseable moves. Maximum reward, mininum risk. Efficiency, thats what counts.
If you believe offline play doesnt have (successfull) move-spammers, then you clearly have yet to go to your first real tournament. Good luck, when you do.
PS: And who was talking about online, anyway? lulz
Stryker
[10] Knight
These matches doesn't show anything good about my gameplay... I recorded some good ones but my cam device suffer a electronic problem so those matches get lost...
I'm ready to read you opinions, but I know it won't be good...
-Stryker-
PD: I was so tired that day...
AshnardZero
[09] Warrior
Well...Damn, that's a good Taki whoever that is. Your Siegfried isn't bad, really, just more mixups and stance changes would help. Like using Sky Splitter, then SCH[ A ], then SSH A (which is low), then trying to mix up the opponent by using SRSH K which is low or B which is mid. Both hits stun and set you up for a combo (for the K, A+B, for the B, either 66B, or B4, which tech traps).
Stryker
[10] Knight
I was very disappointed about the other set of videos so I record these new matches. This time Magic told me before the match that he will win 10-0, so I did my best to show that he was wrong about me and my skills. Also I try to fight fiercely as Magic do. Enjoy.
-Stryker-
SRSH A I would use in a stance transition against an opponent in the air, and as a rescue against an opponent in unblockable such as ivy's horizontal unblockable if you are medium distance away. It doesn't hit much but it is also the only move you can reliably count on in those situations. Yes, it's a niche, but it's still completely necessary in two specific situations that I can name off the top of my head. I completely agree that it's worthless outside of it's niche, but for what it does for that niche it's totally worth throwing in there.
The reason tournaments can have so much repetition is it's just an opening sequence, it's the bread and butter to initiate the battle. When that opening sequence gets repeated because both characters have excellent defense or the matchup doesn't call for the move it doesn't mean there isn't a use. It just means with those matchups it totally wasn't necessary. So yes, I will agree that in some matchups certain moves are plain bad. I'm not gonna dispute that, and SRSH A is a move you should probably not be tossing into most matches. I'd still suggest getting comfortable with all the moves, and learning their niche, but when practicing for an amy-yoshi-cass tourney it's true that you're not going to need to practice a ton of moves because you'll be playing a ton of defense and using mainstay moves almost exclusively.
The reason tournaments can have so much repetition is it's just an opening sequence, it's the bread and butter to initiate the battle. When that opening sequence gets repeated because both characters have excellent defense or the matchup doesn't call for the move it doesn't mean there isn't a use. It just means with those matchups it totally wasn't necessary. So yes, I will agree that in some matchups certain moves are plain bad. I'm not gonna dispute that, and SRSH A is a move you should probably not be tossing into most matches. I'd still suggest getting comfortable with all the moves, and learning their niche, but when practicing for an amy-yoshi-cass tourney it's true that you're not going to need to practice a ton of moves because you'll be playing a ton of defense and using mainstay moves almost exclusively.
Sacharja
[12] Conqueror
Against an opponent in the air use SRSH B. Actually lands before theyre back on the ground and gives guaranteed follow-ups on both standing and airborne opponents.
Second scenario. Ivy using some horizontal unblockable against you at mid distance with you standing there in SRSH.
...
For real now. Youre just being desperate.
First. The only situation where youd be in SRSH at that distance is after 88[ B ] (SRSH is a close-range mix-up stance to be used when youre on the offensive, its not supposed to be used at any range but close except in that particular case because its the only the way to get guaranteed follow-ups after that move). Its a pretty slow move, but has big damage potential and a built-in sidestep. Naturally you'd want it to hit. Of course that aint happening all the time so sometimes youll see it blocked or whiff. After block youre at disadvantage, but have a few roulette options to get away from most punishers. Do SRSH A and you get raped, unless your opponent for some reason does an attack that is like i40 or slower.
Admittedly, UBs tend to be that speed in most cases, BUT those 2 unblockables you speak of still beat out SRSH A. The 1st one is chargeable, so releasing it early after seeing the slooooow start-up of SRSH A will interrupt the latter. The 2nd one is cancelable and a TC. The player can choose to either cancel in time and duck the SRSH A or just stand by watching with a big grin on his face. Either way SRSH A is not gonna hit.
If you want to beat out the charge UB, roulette around it. If you want to beat out the natural UB, dash forward with 6B+K and follow it up with SRSH K to go under the high or just switch to SBH right of the bat and launch his ass with SBH B (TC).
After whiff youre most likely eating guaranteed damage. Depending on the circumstances, distance and reaction time of your opponent you may get lucky and be able to cancel->block or roulette away in time, though. If you do SRSH A... youre just giving him a free ch.
Again, there can not be a niche for every move in the game. And some moves are just too bad to be used at all. SRSH A is a prime example.
Second scenario. Ivy using some horizontal unblockable against you at mid distance with you standing there in SRSH.
...
For real now. Youre just being desperate.
First. The only situation where youd be in SRSH at that distance is after 88[ B ] (SRSH is a close-range mix-up stance to be used when youre on the offensive, its not supposed to be used at any range but close except in that particular case because its the only the way to get guaranteed follow-ups after that move). Its a pretty slow move, but has big damage potential and a built-in sidestep. Naturally you'd want it to hit. Of course that aint happening all the time so sometimes youll see it blocked or whiff. After block youre at disadvantage, but have a few roulette options to get away from most punishers. Do SRSH A and you get raped, unless your opponent for some reason does an attack that is like i40 or slower.
Admittedly, UBs tend to be that speed in most cases, BUT those 2 unblockables you speak of still beat out SRSH A. The 1st one is chargeable, so releasing it early after seeing the slooooow start-up of SRSH A will interrupt the latter. The 2nd one is cancelable and a TC. The player can choose to either cancel in time and duck the SRSH A or just stand by watching with a big grin on his face. Either way SRSH A is not gonna hit.
If you want to beat out the charge UB, roulette around it. If you want to beat out the natural UB, dash forward with 6B+K and follow it up with SRSH K to go under the high or just switch to SBH right of the bat and launch his ass with SBH B (TC).
After whiff youre most likely eating guaranteed damage. Depending on the circumstances, distance and reaction time of your opponent you may get lucky and be able to cancel->block or roulette away in time, though. If you do SRSH A... youre just giving him a free ch.
Again, there can not be a niche for every move in the game. And some moves are just too bad to be used at all. SRSH A is a prime example.
Well, I hate to admit it, but you definitely would have to be desperate to throw in SRSH A. Move shouldn't see the light of day outside of its niche which as you've pointed out probably is like 2-3 frames when you're in a messed up stance and haven't started the probably more effective move yet, and are at the wrong range for your stance. Totally avoidable, but I mean "if you were there, it'd be appropriate" is kinda what I was thinking. I mean, hell, I haven't tossed that move but two or three times in SC4 and that was because of online lag I think. I guess your logic is that you can avoid the circumstance where you would employ SRSH A and I have to agree I avoid that circumstance rather effectively as well. It's a bad place to be, but it takes that sort of situation to find use for horribly ineffective moves. Maybe a good suggestion would be "avoid the situation where you'd ever want to use SRSH A because it's totally NOT the move you want to set up, does minimal damage with no good follow up and really fills the niche to save you from having no options". I think you've seen through my wiles of trying to justify SRSH A pretty effectively...it's not that I like the move in fact it's bloody awful, but I can see when I'd get tangled up in a bad stance and bust it out. I'd never PLAN for that to happen, though.
Sacharja
[12] Conqueror
No, the point I was trying to make is the following:
Even if it were for that extremely rare and extremely unfavorable situation to happen, you still got better options... or rather even there its not an option, effectively rendering SRSH A useless even in that special scenario.
There. Is. No. Niche.
Even if it were for that extremely rare and extremely unfavorable situation to happen, you still got better options... or rather even there its not an option, effectively rendering SRSH A useless even in that special scenario.
There. Is. No. Niche.
It's just semantics, your play wouldn't give you the opportunity to execute that move so it's "not a move" to you. That's fine, but it is a move. Just not one that you use or teach. Fine, agreed, playstyles differ.
I recommend you learn all moves. Sacharja doesn't. I think that's pretty much it.
I recommend you learn all moves. Sacharja doesn't. I think that's pretty much it.
Stryker
[10] Knight
All the playstyles are created with the same objective: Get an advantage that could guide you to victory... that's why most players group the best moves (best damage, best range, best speed, best for evade, best as combo starter, and fast soul crusher) then you have to do an analysis over that move for example:
SRSH A
Speed = 40i (that means its a very slow move)
damage = (?) insignificant
evade = none
combo starter = none
fast soul crusher = none
range = less than mid
I try and try to find something good to do with this move but it doesn't have any property to be a valid add to my winning playstyle... if these move could be the same as in SC3 I will put it in my poke game for sure...
And I gonna agree with you SRSH A its a move, but nothing more than that just a place in the command list...
-Stryker-
Cupui
[09] Warrior
ah I just realized there's someone comment my sieg LOL
THX for the comment
I aprreciate it even it's a harsh one LOL
this is another sieg player from jakarta
me from surabaya :p
comment evaluation will be aprreciated
THX for the comment
I aprreciate it even it's a harsh one LOL
this is another sieg player from jakarta
me from surabaya :p
comment evaluation will be aprreciated
Stryker
[10] Knight
I already watched the first video... that Siegfried what he is trying to do? trying stuff in the middle of a match? after SRSH B he always did 3B... wrong. After CH WR B he did SCH B... wrong too. Excuse me but I didn't find anything good to say about this player, gomen.
Maybe I'll watch the others videos later...
-Stryker-
Maybe I'll watch the others videos later...
-Stryker-
Cupui
[09] Warrior
That's okay stryker :)
That's why he'll need more advice to be a better player
don't worry about it :D
THX for evaluate him :)
I'll extend your advice to dhani
That's why he'll need more advice to be a better player
don't worry about it :D
THX for evaluate him :)
I'll extend your advice to dhani