Do you blame SCV what is going wrong with the franchise?

Party Wolf said:
I blame Namco for what is going on with the franchise. Every game since SC2 gets backlash for not being SC2. If I recall correctly, SC5 didn't even get bad reviews. I remember Angry Joe gave it a 7/10 which is good. It is really just people who liked older characters more that were disappointed with 5, which honestly has no sustain. SC2HDO failed big time because of how much Namco dislikes putting resources into the series. It really isn't any one game's fault.
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It did get hammered in user reviews across various sites due to the limited story mode. That negative feedback is what led to Lost Swords being single player only.
 
I think it started with III, and got dinged with each subsequent entry. III is my favorite of the series, and isn't a bad game at it's foundation, but it suffered from player harming bugs and balance breaking exploits in its initial form, plus it was only on the PS2, shafting rougly two thirds of the previous installment's fanbase.

They did so right by the content, but got messed up in the distribution, losing a lot of steam after II's huge success (the peak of the series).

IV came around and, though it had its draws (really good looking for 2008, Star Wars characters), it ultimately didn't quite resonate as a solid followup to either III or, more importantly, II. It's the point where the series really started to decline in content. No main characters were cut, but bonus characters were reduced to a handful of weirdo waifus designed by guest artists. Story mode was reduced to a very short series of mostly contextless battles and samey endings where the hero defeats al gore on top of his tower in the middle of nowhere (where everyone seems to reside). Honestly, I'm still a little perplexed as to what the story actually was in IV beyond... Siegfried and Nightmare are gonna go at it again, oh and here's this guy Algol. Extra content was smushed into the Tower of Lost Souls, which wasn't terrible, but didn't live up to any of the modes in previous games. Besides that there was online, but the netcode just didn't quite hold up.

And then there was V. If IV is a swing and a miss, then V is a swing before the pitcher has even released the ball, the bat goes flying, smacks the umpire in the head, and sends him into a several years long coma, during which the game is delayed. Great graphics though, and the fighting was pretty good under all the meter junk. Creation was taking a lot of steps in the right direction too. Netcode was the best yet. But the rest. Ohohohohoohhhh the rest...
 
The moment that there were THREE mimic characters revealed was when my hype for SC5 dipped.
Alternate versions of Patroklos + Pyrrha was a surprise for me, and not in a good way. Granted, Alpha Patroklos plays very different than Patroklos, but then again his moveset is a derivative of Setsuka's.

The nail in the coffin was when CAS exclusive Devil Jin's moveset was introduced. That makes any loyal fan question why certain SC4 movesets didn't make the transition over to SC5 when we had these 6 movesets.
 
WuHT said:
The moment that there were THREE mimic characters revealed was when my hype for SC5 dipped.
Alternate versions of Patroklos + Pyrrha was a surprise for me, and not in a good way. Granted, Alpha Patroklos plays very different than Patroklos, but then again his moveset is a derivative of Setsuka's.

The nail in the coffin was when CAS exclusive Devil Jin's moveset was introduced. That makes any loyal fan question why certain SC4 movesets didn't make the transition over to SC5 when we had these 6 movesets.
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Well to fair:

  • SC1 had two mimic characters in Inferno and Edge Master.
  • Pyrrha and Patroklos were not first or the only characters to have more than 1 slot on the roster.
    • Siegfried and Nightmare in SC1.
    • Zasalamel and Abyss in SC3.
    • Raphael and Nightmare in SC5.
 
HydroJamesAqua said:
Well to fair:

  • SC1 had two mimic characters in Inferno and Edge Master.
  • Pyrrha and Patroklos were not first or the only characters to have more than 1 slot on the roster.
    • Siegfried and Nightmare in SC1.
    • Zasalamel and Abyss in SC3.
    • Raphael and Nightmare in SC5.
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Having 3 mimics + devil jin + "super modes" patroklos/ pyrrha in 1 game is tough to take in 1 game.
And ... raphael and nightmare in SC5 have wildly different movesets. I'm not only arguing lore, because at least aPat was different (yet the same as an old character), but at the time of the reveal it didn't look promising.
 
I blame Namco. And while blaming SCV would also work as blaming Namco, it wasn't that game specifically that ruined things. Sure, SCV had a disgraceful story, some terrible characters, super versions of characters which actually were movesets of old characters, 3 characters which only copied random movesets, CAS with some stupid limitations, little to no single player content... but it also brought the best gameplay the series had, new characters with great potential and the best CAS system so far. So I'd say it took some steps back and some forth. However, instead of simply improving the damn game, Namco didn't even try to patch any issues the game had, instead making a stupid new title SCLS, which could be a decent game, but they just made it a cash grab. Then they start making those stupid pachislot machines and acting as if that crap was a big deal. Seriously, it was just Namco fucking up over and over and over, at least SCV did some things right to compensate what was wrong.
 
Looking back, I enjoyed SCV because it was SCV. It quickly wore off, between the lack of tournament support and the end game meta which was this weird push to make the game more offensive and big, despite run counter hit and okizeme being much too strong. I hated how I felt like I couldnt choose how to play because the system mechanics punished you for being defensive. I really resented that. SCV in hindsight felt like a polished shell of a game with no real meat or substance. Add on top of that meter management and no real incentive to play strategic...it was just poorly planned.

Namco has always prioritized Tekken over SC, but thats because Tekken scene holds on to their game. I think SCV like SCIV and SCIII were abandoned by the community very early.

I know I'm not the only person that just started playing Tekken during SC's downfall and ultimate hiatus the last 10 years. I think between a collaborative effort of Namco and the community, we can turn this era around. I'll do whatever I can to support SCVI and the scene.
 
After looking back, I could see SC3 becoming the start of when the series was beginning to dwindle. Even with how great the single player content was at the time, I could understand that it wasn't catering to the multiplayer and tournament scenes, as well as other platforms. SC4's issue was the opposite, and SCV's was the same condition as SCIV's, but even worse.

However, it is much greater than that. It is Namco's lack of support and not giving Project Soul the opportunity to put the series at its fullest potential like the executives had planned that are the main issues with the series downfall.

But after playing Tekken 7, I believe that the company may not be in their absolute best as of late, especially with competition doing greater and more innovative things with their fighting games, as well as long lost fighting games making their grand returns.
 
SC4 was wonderful. I actually partly blame myself, and us, for being involved with SC5 from the start and potentially steering it the wrong way.
 
Sc4 is only wonderful because SCV was so dismal.
I actually still play SC4, if only it was a littttttle bit faster.


Also what's with the Tekken 7 hate? Namcos unwillingness to change something that's not broken has contributed in part to the success.
 
Artilust said:
Sc4 is only wonderful because SCV was so dismal.
I actually still play SC4, if only it was a littttttle bit faster.


Also what's with the Tekken 7 hate? Namcos unwillingness to change something that's not broken has contributed in part to the success.
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No CGI cinematic endings for characters in Tekken 7 ??? Fu ck dat, that's just lazy
 
Macaulyn said:
I blame Namco. And while blaming SCV would also work as blaming Namco, it wasn't that game specifically that ruined things. Sure, SCV had a disgraceful story, some terrible characters, super versions of characters which actually were movesets of old characters, 3 characters which only copied random movesets, CAS with some stupid limitations, little to no single player content... but it also brought the best gameplay the series had, new characters with great potential and the best CAS system so far. So I'd say it took some steps back and some forth. However, instead of simply improving the damn game, Namco didn't even try to patch any issues the game had, instead making a stupid new title SCLS, which could be a decent game, but they just made it a cash grab. Then they start making those stupid pachislot machines and acting as if that crap was a big deal. Seriously, it was just Namco fucking up over and over and over, at least SCV did some things right to compensate what was wrong.
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Yeah as someone playing all of the soul games as of late I agree with your opinion. It definitely Namcos fault. Namco neglected the franchise starting with 3 and treated the soul series like it was the rotten step child. Rushed a lot of the games out and then they spend 3+ years on tekken.
 
I don't blame anyone, Namco did the same to Tekken, the spin offs were cash grabs that used the series popularity to make revenue, at least they kept the series alive unlike what Konami does.

On that point, Namco for some reason hates investing in Calibur, because Tekken is supposed to be the creme de la creme in regards of their FG. SC 4 outsold Tekken 6 and SC V outsold TTT2. (EDIT: Counting their first month in the market)

V was a point of contingency to both casuals and hardcore fans due to deep changes in both aspects.

All said and done, V still was a game I enjoyed playing, but it was definitely a messy game that Namco couldn't give less of a flying fuck for, but that is all SCs
 
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i blame the earthquake and tsunami that hit japan when SCV was in the middle of development. then i blame namco for making Team Soul push out the game despite it being unfinished so they could work on that shitfest called SFxTekken.
 
Not really, SCV was a very good game, just with a wack and incomplete roster.

I don't think there is an SC game to blame, SC just like many other franchises had some bad times lol (remember all those Sh1tty MK games after 3 and before 9), but if i'll have to pick one, i'll say SC4, the Art direction went wrong with this game imo, and the guest characters were non fitting tbh, and even overshadowed the Soul of the game.

It doesn't really matter right now. What matters is that let's just hope they'll use those mistakes from past games to make SC6 even better.
 
SCV wasn't and never will be the issue for me. I got into the game for an entirely superficial reason. At the time SC1 came out, it had cool trails behind the weapons on all of the attacks. The more I got into it on the Dreamcast version, the more I realized how deep the game was, and loved it for what it was. So when I look at the games over the years. I'd say it's a lack of confidence on Namco's part. It's never been perfect, but they deviated from their innovation to cater to what's new. I think if there's any real flaw in the franchise it was not sticking to their own guns and going their own way.

*edit for punctuation
 
I blame the fact that we had to wait a fucking decade for another game. All the people that made it their job to just talk shit on the series because it evolves and they can't evolve with it aren't exactly kosher kush, either. Y'all hear me? Just because you're trash at the new game, doesn't mean the new game is trash.
 
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