Soul Calibur VI: General discussion

Nyte said:
It's really annoying, tiresome to see all the time, and gets on my nerves the way she presents it as fact. She also ruined my topic on the story thread right off the bat and refused to ever let it go, which is why I'm angry about it.
Click to expand...
The topic of your story thread was "How will the new timeline diverge from the old?" -- so addressing the question of divergence itself was on topic. Besides, despite you refusing to continue participating in it, the rest of us got a lot of discussion out of that thread (and we still are), so I don't know how you can call it ruined.
 
DanteSC3 said:
I purposely avoided your "STONE is not Rock" topic, because I didn't want to be accused of "ruining" that either, figured it wouldn't be worth the trouble of arguing with you, as it is a frustrating venture, to say the least. I've got a few chuckles out of that topic, though, watching you prove yourself by doing to other people what you'd have done to me if they don't agree with your perfect world.
Click to expand...

You should really join in on the fun. I'm having a blast in the stone is not rock topic
 
Well, considering that the "six veteran DLC pack" didn't happen, I would say I was on the money.

But besides that, you really need to accept that SCV isn't happening again. Zasalamel's ending does flip the fucking script; it causes him to abandon his plans and change them, before ever enacting them, completely altering the course of the plot. I don't see why you argue against this being a new timeline, when it is.

Are you going to try to argue that Cassandra meeting her alternate self in Astral Chaos, who told her the future and to prevent it, was something that originally happened?

You say "the changes don't matter, the end result is the same!"

1) They're still changes in the lore.
2) We haven't seen the full end result because SCVI is based on the golden era.

You really have some kind of myopia to say what you do, about SCV being worth returning to and that everyone else (and there are many) are in the wrong. I don't even understand it, but whatever. Some elements might get rebooted in, such as Viola, but no way we're jumping 17 years again.
 
20190808_232113.png
20190808_232149.png
EBPcbZtW4AA2qUO.jpeg.jpg

I said I would do it.
 
If we are to ever revisit content in SoulCalibur V at this point, I would say it's gonna be with Viola and Z.W.E.I. travelling back in time similar to the original Cassandra but possibly not malfested. Too many characters with bad futures in SoulCalibur V that I would like to see fixed lol.
 
artard4321 said:
They weren't "real" characters in the console edition, they were bonus characters with a pruned moveset. I don't count that. The real deal was when they were added in the Arcade Edition but it was sadly a one shot thing.
Click to expand...
Well, if what we're talking about is how long it has been since they appeared in a game and could thus qualify as "resurrected" if they were brought back today (which seemed to be the thing you were focused on there), I don't think it really much matters whether they had a few less moves than the standard roster characters. The issue you guys are debating is not strictly a narrative one, but it is about how long its been since the characters were last "seen" in the series (from the perspective of the devs) and arguing that they weren't present in a game because of lackluster movesets seems like a bit of a non-sequitor to me; they were present, nevertheless. For that matter, even if we do focus on the moveset as the defining feature of whether a character is "present" for a given entry, Hwang was in SCII, insofar as "Assassin" is just Hwang's moveset with a generic character skin.
 
Last edited:
artard4321 said:
If we are to ever revisit content in SoulCalibur V at this point, I would say it's gonna be with Viola and Z.W.E.I. travelling back in time similar to the original Cassandra but possibly not malfested. Too many characters with bad futures in SoulCalibur V that I would like to see fixed lol.
Click to expand...
I really don't see Viola or Z.W.E.I. as the time traveling type, personally. Viola was pushed in Amy's story as being her future, and Z.W.E.I., well... Grøh's future is murky, and he's already got that edgelord vibe going. If he ends up being Amy's traveling partner / bodyguard to Ostrheinsburg, I've got a feeling...

--------------------------------

Rusted Blade said:
Hwang was in SCII, insofar as "Assassin" is just Hwang's moveset with a generic character skin.
Click to expand...
Plus, SoulCalibur VI has confirmed that Hwang was one of those Assassins.

--------------------------------

Nyte said:
They just say you have a right to your opinion, even if it's not the right one.
Click to expand...
There is no such thing as a "right" or "wrong" opinion. And it's all theory anyway, on either side, yours included, or anyone else.

Nyte said:
There comes a point where you just have to give up and accept it.
Click to expand...
That point would be if SoulCalibur VII unfolds in the way that you're proposing, or if season 2 Soul Chronicles provide evidence that will be the case. Hwang, Setsuka, or Aeon/Rock don't really seem the type to divulge that kind of information, though. So SoulCalibur VII will be the test of theories.

Nyte said:
SCVI is a reboot, it's been called a reboot by Okubo, it changes storytelling elements, and of course you have the timelime being diverged. The fact that it's a different timeline plays into the narrative itself.
Click to expand...
It was called a reboot and then retracted, didn't double back on the retraction. It changes fairly minor elements in the story so far. Timeline divergence is a subjective matter. There is no "fact" that a different timeline exists, yet, that is your opinion. They haven't explained fully how SoulCalibur handles time travel.

Nyte said:
You refuse to accept that. You still want to go back to SCV, for some godforsaken reason.
Click to expand...
It's not about what I want, it's what I've seen SoulCalibur VI offer, with respects to everything else, a foreshadowing that we will be repeating SoulCalibur V events, whether or not we do the timeskip and the events take place in 1607 or if those events instead take place in 1590, they still seem to be happening.

Nyte said:
It doesn't matter how much you spin "oh, the SCV era wasn't bad, it was just the execution that was horrible!" because it doesn't change the fact that it still sucked. It doesn't change the fact that it drove away fans and nearly convinced Namco the series wasn't worth investing in.
Click to expand...
There was far more that caused SoulCalibur V to flop than the cut characters and the shoddy and incomplete story/game. The natural disaster that caused production issues and yet they didn't get an extension to complete the game was a problem, as was Namco taking away the support when Tekken Tag 2 came out, which also flopped, by the way. It was just a bad year for Namco all-around.

Nyte said:
I'd rather the series prosper instead of retreading that era.
Click to expand...
And I'm saying we can have both. With proper support, the era can exist and yet be prosperous, should they not make the same mistakes. Okubo leading the charge instead of Daishi is a scenario where I can see it working, as Okubo has shown so far he has a lot of heart and isn't going to run the franchise into the dirt. I trust him to be able to handle the events in a way that will please most if not everyone.

Nyte said:
The moment he left, the moment Daishi was no longer on the team, they dropped all of the direction he wanted to take the series in.
Click to expand...
Oh yeah, they dropped Raphael becoming Nightmare, Amy becoming Viola, and the Astral Chaos intervening in the world. Absolutely.

Nyte said:
Well, considering that the "six veteran DLC pack" didn't happen, I would say I was on the money.
Click to expand...
You can't claim to be right in circumstantial situations outside of your control. If we had gotten a six-character season 2, then Rock could have been in. It's reasonable that only getting three characters instead, it's likely that Rock doesn't make the cut. The same thing goes for Li Long and one of Hwang or Yun-seong, just as a pure numbers game. It's common sense.

Nyte said:
Zasalamel's ending does flip the fucking script; it causes him to abandon his plans and change them, before ever enacting them, completely altering the course of the plot. I don't see why you argue against this being a new timeline, when it is.
Click to expand...
His motivations are changed, but his goals still ultimately align with the very real possibility that he will seek to unite the swords and inadvertently bring back Night Terror, and thus Algol, as happened originally. If that still happens, then no, not really, for the act of results, nothing changed.

Nyte said:
Are you going to try to argue that Cassandra meeting her alternate self in Astral Chaos, who told her the future and to prevent it, was something that originally happened?
Click to expand...
No, I'm not saying that at all. What I am saying is that the new information she obtained is still going to cause her to have the same goal that is protecting her sister. She's going to do what she did before, except this time, likely not allow Sophitia out of her sight, to save her from ruin. Or at least try. She may act to attempt to protect Pyrrha from Tira as well. It's hard to say. It was mentioned that Cassandra didn't tell anyone about her interaction with her future self, so as far as anyone else is concerned, they're none the wiser, unless Cassandra tells them. If she does tell them, will they believe her?

Nyte said:
You say "the changes don't matter, the end result is the same!"

1) They're still changes in the lore.
2) We haven't seen the full end result because SCVI is based on the golden era.
Click to expand...
You're right, but I'm also agreeing with that. SoulCalibur VII will answer our theories, one way or the other. And two characters receiving lore changes compared to the whole roster is but a drop in the bucket, that's the biggest appeal to reason I can make that this isn't going to have wide-reaching effects that change the narrative. Zasalamel, maybe, but Cassandra lacks the influence to affect the world at large. We'll see when the time comes.

Nyte said:
You really have some kind of myopia to say what you do, about SCV being worth returning to and that everyone else (and there are many) are in the wrong. I don't even understand it, but whatever. Some elements might get rebooted in, such as Viola, but no way we're jumping 17 years again.
Click to expand...
I'm not saying for sure that anyone else is wrong, that's your spin on my words. I'm just offering my theory, nothing more and nothing less. I've presented the evidence that supports my theory, as anyone with a theory should. The timeskip, I agree, likely will not happen, not like it did before. We will either live out those 17 years Soul Chronicle style, or they will move the events from SoulCalibur V into 1590. That's the logical end result, one of those two possibilities. There are others, of course, but with the evidence we have right now, those are the top two.
 
DanteSC3 said:
I really don't see Viola or Z.W.E.I. as the time traveling type, personally. Viola was pushed in Amy's story as being her future, and Z.W.E.I., well... Grøh's future is murky, and he's already got that edgelord vibe going. If he ends up being Amy's traveling partner / bodyguard to Ostrheinsburg, I've got a feeling...

--------------------------------


Plus, SoulCalibur VI has confirmed that Hwang was one of those Assassins.

--------------------------------


There is no such thing as a "right" or "wrong" opinion. And it's all theory anyway, on either side, yours included, or anyone else.


That point would be if SoulCalibur VII unfolds in the way that you're proposing, or if season 2 Soul Chronicles provide evidence that will be the case. Hwang, Setsuka, or Aeon/Rock don't really seem the type to divulge that kind of information, though. So SoulCalibur VII will be the test of theories.


It was called a reboot and then retracted, didn't double back on the retraction. It changes fairly minor elements in the story so far. Timeline divergence is a subjective matter. There is no "fact" that a different timeline exists, yet, that is your opinion. They haven't explained fully how SoulCalibur handles time travel.


It's not about what I want, it's what I've seen SoulCalibur VI offer, with respects to everything else, a foreshadowing that we will be repeating SoulCalibur V events, whether or not we do the timeskip and the events take place in 1607 or if those events instead take place in 1590, they still seem to be happening.


There was far more that caused SoulCalibur V to flop than the cut characters and the shoddy and incomplete story/game. The natural disaster that caused production issues and yet they didn't get an extension to complete the game was a problem, as was Namco taking away the support when Tekken Tag 2 came out, which also flopped, by the way. It was just a bad year for Namco all-around.


And I'm saying we can have both. With proper support, the era can exist and yet be prosperous, should they not make the same mistakes. Okubo leading the charge instead of Daishi is a scenario where I can see it working, as Okubo has shown so far he has a lot of heart and isn't going to run the franchise into the dirt. I trust him to be able to handle the events in a way that will please most if not everyone.


Oh yeah, they dropped Raphael becoming Nightmare, Amy becoming Viola, and the Astral Chaos intervening in the world. Absolutely.


You can't claim to be right in circumstantial situations outside of your control. If we had gotten a six-character season 2, then Rock could have been in. It's reasonable that only getting three characters instead, it's likely that Rock doesn't make the cut. The same thing goes for Li Long and one of Hwang or Yun-seong, just as a pure numbers game. It's common sense.


His motivations are changed, but his goals still ultimately align with the very real possibility that he will seek to unite the swords and inadvertently bring back Night Terror, and thus Algol, as happened originally. If that still happens, then no, not really, for the act of results, nothing changed.


No, I'm not saying that at all. What I am saying is that the new information she obtained is still going to cause her to have the same goal that is protecting her sister. She's going to do what she did before, except this time, likely not allow Sophitia out of her sight, to save her from ruin. Or at least try. She may act to attempt to protect Pyrrha from Tira as well. It's hard to say. It was mentioned that Cassandra didn't tell anyone about her interaction with her future self, so as far as anyone else is concerned, they're none the wiser, unless Cassandra tells them. If she does tell them, will they believe her?


You're right, but I'm also agreeing with that. SoulCalibur VII will answer our theories, one way or the other. And two characters receiving lore changes compared to the whole roster is but a drop in the bucket, that's the biggest appeal to reason I can make that this isn't going to have wide-reaching effects that change the narrative. Zasalamel, maybe, but Cassandra lacks the influence to affect the world at large. We'll see when the time comes.


I'm not saying for sure that anyone else is wrong, that's your spin on my words. I'm just offering my theory, nothing more and nothing less. I've presented the evidence that supports my theory, as anyone with a theory should. The timeskip, I agree, likely will not happen, not like it did before. We will either live out those 17 years Soul Chronicle style, or they will move the events from SoulCalibur V into 1590. That's the logical end result, one of those two possibilities. There are others, of course, but with the evidence we have right now, those are the top two.
Click to expand...
My god, you are hopeless. I don't even get it with you. He called it a reboot, and he didn't say "it wasn't a reboot", he said he wasn't sure how to describe it. Considering that the OT events are established as a different timeline, that's most likely what he meant.

By the way, ANY change is a good indication of a different timeline. You keep missing the minor details, which is important. But the fact that two people have knowledge of a different timeline is major and will change the story as we know. They didn't change much of the SCI era because very little needed change. It was the golden era, and anyone smart doesn't fuck up the best part. It's that the further we get from it, the more things change, and change they do.

I think I'm done here. There's really no point in this. I don't see why you're still fighting this fight, but whatever.
 
Nyte said:
different timeline
Click to expand...
This is the core issue I have with the discussion. The definition of this phrasing. I made this post in your thread that you abandoned. It's a semantical matter, perhaps, but it's one that matters. It seems like you're more on the side of TresDias's argument, where if literally anything is different, then it establishes a new continuity, where for me, it's not that simple. There have to be changes that affect the end results at large in order for it to be truly different. Mixing up the details to make a more cohesive narrative is not, in and of itself, enough to quantify a "new timeline". Particularly because we haven't defined the parameters of how time travel works in SoulCalibur, if there is only one timeline (which I believe), or if there are split paths and branching, or multiverse theory (which you clearly believe). Until they make it clear, there is no black and white answer, not yet. SoulCalibur VII can't come soon enough.

Nyte said:
I think I'm done here. There's really no point in this. I don't see why you're still fighting this fight, but whatever.
Click to expand...
I could say the same to you. You're the one who has the grudge, who initiated this "fight", while all I'm doing is defending my position.
 
Alexandra said:
I wonder if we’re gonna get a “SoulCalibur VI: Circular Arguments” thread to go with the general and shitposting boards we already have.
Click to expand...
I don't think it would do any good. The shitposting thread is mostly just @LisaK's home away from home, with light banter, and I don't really believe that circular arguments participators would willingly post in that thread, as it would entail admitting that their argument is pointless.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back