1.03 Tier List Discussion (aka Argument)

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IS this a TIER discussion thread or a talk about all the other dumbass fighters out there thread?? Seriously someone post up a new tier list.... So we can get back on topic
 
this is my humble opinion on the list ^^

Siegfried is in a higher tier than kilik >_>;;? thats a joke right?

and i cant believe that maxi and zasalamel are with the same tier as astaroth, its either u never seen a good maxi/zasalamel or errr no other option.

i agree on cervantes being high on the list, his JFs are crazy i've met some1 who literally flashes white 3 times per seconds ( joke but u get the idea xd)

about Ivy, who would dare and use the infinite glitch in a match? they will rip him to shreds. i agree though on her being the strongest.

about rock 100% agree xD ive played him for a while even wasted my time getting the 214 : B : B timing right, he pretty much sux.

apprentice idk he seems annoying O.- never had the pleasure to face some1 who actually play him seriously though.

nightmare T.T .. yeah he belongs there.

Yoshimitsu!! that crazy dude belongs to the top tier!

thx goodbye m(_ _)m
 
to the people saying SC4 is balanced or something like that, its not even nearly, no one in his right mind would say rock is better than kilik for example or has more potential or is a better matchup against certain other characters, this fact alone nullify the argument of SC4 being nearly as balanced as VF5 or T5DR, but the way i see it thats the fun part of the game. (Mugen any1?)

example:
this is a quote from a producer of a previous installment (SC2) Hiroki Yotoriyama when asked about the most improved SC2 character:
"from the beginning of SC2's developement, i put my efforts into making Ivy more uniquely lethal.as a result, i think ivy stands out more.." end of quote.

so ivy improvement was based on the sick mind of an ecchi japanese midle aged man :P good thing he wasnt a woman or we wouldve seen Rock hax.
 
arstal said:
I stick to simple stuff like AAB, 1B series, B series, kicks. I only take risks on okizeme. I also try to turtle read and react a lot a lot, see what they like to do. My goal is usually to land blows to get them red in guard, to open up the rest of my game.

It's not overly complex, but it requires good yomi. I like using a mix of throws, lows, 44A+B and 4KB on wakeup as well.

If they start GI'ing it gets more complicated, but then I'll do things like not finish strings, throw 6B+K in, 44AB/66AB to mess up timing.

Other moves I use situationally, such as 8A+B, B+K. I don't use 2A+B much unlike some people, that's mostly an oki anti-roll move to get them to block 44AB. I'm not a top player, but I'd say I do decently (I've entered a few tournies with Mina and done decently)

As for Sisters, yeah it's a bad matchup, but not unwinnable. You just gotta space perfectly and play defensively. I use a lot of unfinished strings to make them reluctant to throw out that 236 crap.
Click to expand...

Thanks. What lows do you use? Aren't they all really slow? Guess you just really gotta play her different. There was a Canada player that played her in 3, Oof?

On topic, I'd say copy and paste Cha Cha's list
 
hellbottom said:
to the people saying SC4 is balanced or something like that, its not even nearly, no one in his right mind would say rock is better than kilik for example or has more potential or is a better matchup against certain other characters, this fact alone nullify the argument of SC4 being nearly as balanced as VF5 or T5DR, but the way i see it thats the fun part of the game. (Mugen any1?)

example:
this is a quote from a producer of a previous installment (SC2) Hiroki Yotoriyama when asked about the most improved SC2 character:
"from the beginning of SC2's developement, i put my efforts into making Ivy more uniquely lethal.as a result, i think ivy stands out more.." end of quote.

so ivy improvement was based on the sick mind of an ecchi japanese midle aged man :P good thing he wasnt a woman or we wouldve seen Rock hax.
Click to expand...

"ivy stands out more" does not equal "is better than everyone else", it just means that Ivy's moves are more unique than other fighters. Notice how he also says "uniquely lethal"...I think all we can pull from that quote is that Hiroki Yotoriyama thinks Ivy is more unique than the other fighters...a point that is, IMO, hard to argue against.

Rock is extremely underrated. IMO, Kilik is better than Rock, but I don't see how anyone can say that thinking Rock might be better is somehow a ridiculous assertion.
 
AM64 said:
"ivy stands out more" does not equal "is better than everyone else", it just means that Ivy's moves are more unique than other fighters. Notice how he also says "uniquely lethal"...I think all we can pull from that quote is that Hiroki Yotoriyama thinks Ivy is more unique than the other fighters...a point that is, IMO, hard to argue against.

Rock is extremely underrated. IMO, Kilik is better than Rock, but I don't see how anyone can say that thinking Rock might be better is somehow a ridiculous assertion.
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i said this as an example of how the process of improving a character really works, it was based on an effort by one individual who may or may not be right on how strong this character is or how much improvement or tweaks does she need and how much is too much.

i'm not quoting the guy to prove ivy's superioriy just simply stating a point.
i know hes the producer and all but unless he mastered every character and won every local champion at his region (for a busy man like that i even doubt he is better with ivy than the avarage SC fanboy) so you might wanna consider the possibility that his point of views on his half-naked bondage babe's true strength are less than perfect, or at least arguable.
 
and yeah, saying Rock is better than kilik is really a stupid and a (ridiculous assertion). there's no way around it :/
 
I was hoping this thread would not degrade down into a "OMG, Rock is t3h sux0rz!" thread, but lo and behold, it has. Is Rock top tier? Hell no. But he certainly isn't garbage. I swear, half of the people who post on these forums just see people saying that Rock sucks so many times that they blindly agree with it. How many of these people have actually tried to become good with him? For that matter, how many have actually played with him at all?

Rock may not be top tier, but he certainly is competitive. He has some decent long range moves and a few good short range moves. Are they great? No. But his throws are better than just about any character. He has so many CH stuns off of his regular moves that he's bound to find many opportunities to start his chain throws. As long as Rock is competitive, there will be some players who think he's better than Kilik. Do I personally agree? No. But they have the right to feel that way and not be ridiculed.

Besides, as WareEaglesDare pointed out, he has a Rhino Hat. If this alone doesn't make him top tier, I don't know what will. :)
 
My point exactly! Rhino hat = CWNAGE! (I guess I would have to explain my Dead Rising Picture for that...maybe I'll try to take a screen shot.)
 
Rock is low tier, but a lot of people do underestimate him. On the other hand, those people also seem to think that Kilik is top tier.
 
Kilik = poop attached to stick .... IMO

Ha reminds me of the SC2 arcade back when. The lead guy with the saved character thing was this real loser-ish smelly fat guy that came in once a day and pumped $5 into the machine and proceeded to mash like crazy. He would be sweating profusely afterwards.... he was the man!

Kind of like the "get fit with DDR" crowd: Go to mall... eat plate full of fat in food court... spend $3 on DDR... completely disgust anyone who mistakenly glances in your direction... have heart attack... proceed to food court for second helping of fat with extra grease.... BE FIT! Come to think of it... I think he may have been on that program for a while.
 
kilik is strong very strong, having power is one thing but knowing how to use it is another.
 
LoL you twos pointless comments should get a room together...

Reasons why Kilik is better than Rock..... Now care to point out why rock is stronger?

- Asura : its does a lots, lots of things, save him, TJ, Auto-Gi Mid, RO, Tech Trap, Combo, Track, Dmg, Semi-Safe (guess last hit or not + JF)
- FOTD into Asura : the best RO throw in the game, if not RO it will wall combo with 66B (non AT))
- Critical Finish : Kilik is a Zoning Character, you can expect him to spam some move that will be bloked by the enemy taht wil be hard to whiff or punish (especially 2A+K, 11A, 66A, 6B and 4[B.] on wakes which will hurt the soul gauge, when soul gauge will flash, Kilik will rush you with 44K (-1 BS!!), 9B, 2B+K, then finish you with an Soul Crushing Asura! And do not forgot that 214B also is damaging, and all the Auto-Gi taht HE HAVE TO DO to order to escape the close range (Asura/ MO/BP) will damage you Soul Gauge, especially if it's a perfect GI. Played well, i think he is some of the most dangerous characters for critical finish, it's not he will flash you fast, he just do not risk much doing this move, and expect a finish at round 3 at least.

This was said by someone else.... but either way its still valid for why hes better than rock ;)

Tier discussions are so much better on caliburforum...
 
Rock used his power to kill a Rhino, and he lives in another continent. I'd say he knows how to use his power.

Edit: We're not saying Rock is better than Kilik when it comes to his moveset. We (At least, some of us) are saying the Rock is better than most people assume, and that Kilik is not as good as many people claim.
 
Heh, I know Kilik is easily an all around better character than Rock, I just don't like him. That's why a Rhino hat could sway me to vote against him.
 
Dullyanna said:
Rock used his power to kill a Rhino, and he lives in another continent. I'd say he knows how to use his power.

Edit: We're not saying Rock is better than Kilik when it comes to his moveset. We (At least, some of us) are saying the Rock is better than most people assume, and that Kilik is not as good as many people claim.
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this case is covered no one is arguing about that, i was just quoting King Raoh from FOTNS "ken's aura is strong very strong, come little brother, having power is one thing but knowing how to use is another"

because there was nothing more to say :P

btw yeah, i'm a rock player, and i hate the rhino hat, TripleH's custome is better.
 
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