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- #2,241
Reptile
Soul Calibur V
They better not forget to bring back Kasumi's school uniform.
I >3 Seifuku's.
I >3 Seifuku's.
Dead or Alive 5 Ultimate
- Thread starter UNDERX
- Start date
taffertier
[10] Knight
I dont believe tiers in DOA are much of a factor compared to other fighters. Cause all the characters can get good damage from their juggles and grabs and counters. As such there are fewer things to create that disparity between tiers. If what DrDogg says is true that guaranteed damage is mostly what separates characters in this game, i believe the balance will be good overall due to the new critical burst mechanic.
jtdam09
[13] Hero
Probably a clone. The real Kasumi is probably wearing the black costume.
They've been doing that for a while. I know DOA4 had it. I think DOA: Ultimate had a few. Not sure.
Reave
[13] Hero
This was doable in DOA4 I believe. I do know you needed to complete every characters command training to unlock the Tatami Mat for Vs play in DOA4
d3v
[10] Knight
You can't study your matchups without taking into consideration tiers since the quality of the matchup determines tiers.
Depends on how you define balance and balancing, this is because an effort to balance can often times lead to a watered down game with a generic playstyle. Throughout the history of competitive fighting games, we've had examples of games that were balanced in terms of character viability but did so at the cost of playstyle viability. For example, Vampire Savior is considered to be one of the most balanced fighting games ever made, but most players will admit that this was at the cost of certain playstyles (in favor of all out rushdown). Happily, the system in VS was deep enough for it to be played for years. Then there's Marvel vs. SF which went against form and was actually a Marvel game that was free from almost all forms of bullshit and infinites, but this was at the cost of making it so that almost every character played exactly alike (and had one basic gameplan). Unlike VS, MsH was never considered deep (due in part to how neutered everyone was) and was shunned competitively.
Compare the above to games like MvC2 or 3rd Strike. In the formers case, despite having only 14-16 out of 56 characters considered viable, the fact that multiple playstyles can succeed in tournaments means that, once you get past any character loyalty, you can find a viable team that fits how you play. Either that, or you can build a team around your favorite character and still win (i.e. Megaman/Blackheart/Cable for those MM fans). For 3rd Strike, despite the seeming dominance of a few characters (Yun, Chun), the upper and middle tiers have a decent mix of playstyles and interesting characters (Makoto, Urien, Dudley, Oro, etc.), and the system itself (parries) eases the difficulty of the matchups somewhat.
On a related note, an informal study done by Maj of SonicHurricane.com shows that the tournament classics, as far as EVO is concerned have more often than not been more about having a small number of interesting matchups than overall balance (at the cost of interesting matchups).
Except CB has been nerfed thanks to the complaints of a few idiots who didn't like guaranteed damage.
taffertier
[10] Knight
How has it been nerfed? From the latest videos i've seen it functions pretty much the same as i've come to know it.
d3v
[10] Knight
It now takes more hits for certain characters to get CB.
TheCursedImage
[12] Conqueror
What are the criteria for these characters?
taffertier
[10] Knight
It varies per character, but i think there is no requirements other than getting in a certain amount of hits first before you can attempt the Critical Burst. Like some characters take 3 hits before you can try it, and others have more and even less. I think Brad Wong was like any 2 hits would be enough for him to do it. I'm not sure how many and which characters were changed though.
Before being able to successfully do a critical burst you must extend the damage stun threshold (critical stun state) until they are at high threshold. This is depicted by a red flashing "Critical Stun" under the opponent's life bar. It is purely damage that determines when you can do a critical burst.
In that regard, it wasn't a nerf in damage levels, but a nerf to the critical stun threshold levels. I forget the exact numbers but basically they added around 15 dmg to the threshold, which generally means another 1 or 2 atttacks depending on character. This provided a larger "middle" threshold for which it now took longer to get to Critical Burst. When you're hit in stun you take 50% of the base damage of the attack. So a Jab that does 10 damage does 5 damage when in stun.
This larger damage threshold allows for more opportunities for an opponent to escape the stun, and due to the other restrictions of the stun threshold it makes it difficult for some characters over others. Some only have one or two stun types that can put an opponent into an unholdable state, some have them but can't combo them together, and some still have them and are able to combo them together. (Talk about tiers...).
So because of the favorability of Stun > Launch due to the middle threshold, you'll rarely see players risk it to get to CB! levels. The CB! is rarely played because you can't guarantee combos into it (for most of the cast), and those that still succeed in doing Stun > Launch > Juggle it's more opportunistic then risking their CB! being held and instead just guessing the launcher. CB!s also aren't guaranteed on sit-down stuns as the opponent can stagger escape to guard them since they're generally 19-20 startup frames. So in the end you have a new feature of the game that its really only primary purposes is to "launch" for a Power Blow.
Only, the PB has been nerfed as well. Not only is it required for you to have 50% life or less in order to perform the PB, but you only get one if you do connect with it. So in general, you see people go for a launch after CB! even if they have a PB available because they're just so accustomed to "Launch and juggle". Honestly, it should be one of the two restrictions, not both (50% life or once per round).
In that regard, it wasn't a nerf in damage levels, but a nerf to the critical stun threshold levels. I forget the exact numbers but basically they added around 15 dmg to the threshold, which generally means another 1 or 2 atttacks depending on character. This provided a larger "middle" threshold for which it now took longer to get to Critical Burst. When you're hit in stun you take 50% of the base damage of the attack. So a Jab that does 10 damage does 5 damage when in stun.
This larger damage threshold allows for more opportunities for an opponent to escape the stun, and due to the other restrictions of the stun threshold it makes it difficult for some characters over others. Some only have one or two stun types that can put an opponent into an unholdable state, some have them but can't combo them together, and some still have them and are able to combo them together. (Talk about tiers...).
So because of the favorability of Stun > Launch due to the middle threshold, you'll rarely see players risk it to get to CB! levels. The CB! is rarely played because you can't guarantee combos into it (for most of the cast), and those that still succeed in doing Stun > Launch > Juggle it's more opportunistic then risking their CB! being held and instead just guessing the launcher. CB!s also aren't guaranteed on sit-down stuns as the opponent can stagger escape to guard them since they're generally 19-20 startup frames. So in the end you have a new feature of the game that its really only primary purposes is to "launch" for a Power Blow.
Only, the PB has been nerfed as well. Not only is it required for you to have 50% life or less in order to perform the PB, but you only get one if you do connect with it. So in general, you see people go for a launch after CB! even if they have a PB available because they're just so accustomed to "Launch and juggle". Honestly, it should be one of the two restrictions, not both (50% life or once per round).
SolidSonic
[09] Warrior
You guys hear this game made the cut for CEO 2012?
...
Even though SC5 didn't...
...
Even though SC5 didn't...
Yamagishi
█████] 99%
That's hilarious, actually.
But SC5 is for 2013?
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- #2,253
UnseenWombat
[14] Master
Holy cow. I never thought I'd say this, but I hope this game has a good tutorial mode, because I'm gonna need it.
I feel like such a scrub. :(
I feel like such a scrub. :(
The Story mode is considered a tutorial mode and the Training mode has a slew of options to find out attributes of different parts of the game.
Reave
[13] Hero
I hope they give new player knowledge of beating out wake-up kicks. That took me forever to figure out.
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- #2,256
Reptile
Soul Calibur V
Please enlighten me. It seems whenever I get a KND I lose all advantage and have to backoff /guess how to parry their wake-up kick. I can't seem to hit them grounded most of the time and they seem to have invincibility frames on their wake-up kicks.
Noct22
[09] Warrior
Hey what with all the philosophy...The game will be out soon.Try to find out everythingby yourself..
- Moderator
- #2,258
Reptile
Soul Calibur V
No.
- Thread starter
- #2,259
Reave
[13] Hero
I haven't played the game in ages so I can't give you any specific moves that can beat out wake-up kicks. I think a few 9Ks did. Jann Lee comes to mind.
If you stop a juggle combo a bit early and do two low hits on your opponents body as it hits the ground you can force them to stand eliminating the wake-up kick altogether.
I just want to hear about the netcode.