Kilik videos

Oathkeeper said:
Genver vs. Oathkeeper



Again, I'm Kilik.

Appearently, Genver was doing a bunch of "random bullshit mix-ups and unsafe crap" and I kept eating most of it in the face. Again, psyching myself out for blocking low and shit like that.

Not to mention Genver's a cuteass fucker. ^_^
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Looks like you Guard Impacted away successfully several times but didn't press your advantage after that. I'd try 4B+K, B, 8B, or BP A after Away GI.
 
That was quite a nice Kilik. I looked at a couple of his other matches and there great even if he doesn't always win. He seems to know which moves to asura vs pretty much any character. I need to train myself to do that.
 
My comments on Hayate vs. Saitoh:

I do realize you play against Saitoh quite a bit, so both of you have a good working knowledge of each other's character and how the matchup flows....

1) Saitoh utilized too much 66(K). There were quite a few times when you could have stepped to his side or back and taken more than half his life (A+B--->3BB--->6AAA is around 100-124 dmg----props to Cano for this combo), thus ending the match faster. Also, the times you DO block 66(K), you can use 2K/1K and negate that second bullrush or throw attempt. The only time you have to suffer the mixup is if Asta spaces the 66(K) correctly and gets frame advantage...

2) I could tell that both of you knew what mixups Kilik could force after he blocks a bullrush; You did a great job in forcing successful mixups after blocking bullrush. I'd like to suggest at least 3 more moves you can use after blocking a bullrush: 4B, 2K, 44A. 4B/44A with 1/3A+B is the mixup of choice after blocking a bullrush: they stop Asta from doing another move (44A is especially potent here with the potential to give upwards of 70+ damage on CH. 4B pushes Asta back out 2K is for irritation and possible advantage on CH).

3) ALWAYS BE ON THE LOOKOUT FOR A wsB/A OPPORTUNITY. It's possible to duck Asta's throws on reaction, so don't duck unless you see him flash white (JF) or flex his arm (normal). There is also a sweet spot where bullrush will NOT beat out wsB/wsA/66B; try to stay in this range at all times if possible...

4) Using high moves that are not throws in this fight is way too risky. You want to go mid/low at all times if possible.

5) Asura is VERY RISKY in this fight. I do applaud you taking the risk to do it (AND hitting it), but it's in my opinion that it's simply not worth it. I feel like you could have been better off going for something else, or even simply blocking. Which brings me to my next point....

6) If you're not sure what to do or how to get in against Asta, it's best to simply block. If you block Asta's moves, you often get the initiative to move/force mixups. The end of part 1 and 2 illustrate my point perfectly; Those situations could have been avoided if you would have blocked and waited instead of getting up with a move.

7) When dealing with 6K, bait it out and take more than half his life with combo listed at comment #1. If not, punish with 6AA and go from there.

8) You can punish 6A,B with 3kB

9) 22B will mysteriously step 4A+B for some reason in strange situations (It happens to me most often when Asta is getting up from the ground). 44A is a great alternative and does massive damage on CH...

10) It seems you've discovered the cheapness of kB, lol. That move is beastly!

11) Your use of 22_88K was excellent too. What are your reasons for using it in this matchup?

12) Make sure to keep track of where you are on the stage at all times; this can help you avoid or even capitialize on certain situations (Asta's back to the edge and he goes for the throw, you KNOW to mash B or duck lol)

Asta is Kilik's hardest matchup, but there's a few things you can do to make this matchup better for Kilik. I hope this helps...

I also have comments on you vs. Keev/Humphrey but that can come later :)

I also have comments for the other players' vids, but that can come later also :)
 
wing_zero said:
My comments on Hayate vs. Saitoh:

I do realize you play against Saitoh quite a bit, so both of you have a good working knowledge of each other's character and how the matchup flows....

1) Saitoh utilized too much 66(K). There were quite a few times when you could have stepped and took more than half his life (A+B--->3BB--->6AAA is around 100-124 dmg----props to Cano for this combo), thus ending the match faster. Also, the times you DO block 66(K), you can use 2K/1K and negate that second bullrush or throw attempt. The only time you have to suffer the mixup is if Asta spaces the 66(K) correctly and gets frame advantage...

2) I could tell that both of you knew what mixups Kilik could force after he blocks a bullrush; You did a great job in forcing mixups after blocking bullrush. I'd like to suggest at least 3 more moves you can use after blocking a bullrush: 4B, 2K, 44A. 4B/44A with 1/3A+B is the mixup of choice after blocking a bullrush: they stop Asta from doing another move (44A is especially potent here with the potential to give upwards of 70+ damage on CH. 4B pushes Asta back out ) 2K is for irritation and possible advantage on CH.

3) ALWAYS BE ON THE LOOKOUT FOR A wsB/A OPPORTUNITY. It's possible to duck Asta's throws on reaction, so don't duck unless you see him flash white (JF) or flex his arm (normal). There is also a sweet spot where bullrush will NOT beat out wsB/wsA/66B; try to stay in this range at all times if possible...

4) Using high moves that are not throws in this fight is way too risky. You want to go mid/low at all times if possible.

5) Asura is VERY RISKY in this fight. I do applaud you taking the risk to do it (AND hitting it), but it's in my opinion that it's simply not worth it. I feel like you could have been better off going for something else, or even simply blocking. Which brings me to my next point....

6) If you're not sure what to do or how to get in against Asta, it's best to simply block. If you block Asta's moves, you often get the initiative to move/force mixups. The end of part 1 and 2 illustrate my point perfectly; Those situations could have been avoided if you would have blocked and waited instead of getting up with a move.

7) When dealing with 6K, bait it out and take more than half his life with combo listed at comment #1. If not, punish with 6AA and go from there.

8) You can punish 6A,B with 3kB

9) 22B will mysteriously step 4A+B for some reason in strange situations (It happens to me most often when Asta is getting up from the ground). 44A is a great alternative and does massive damage on CH...

10) It seems you've discovered the cheapness of kB, lol. That move is beastly!

11) Your use of 22_88K was excellent too. What are your reasons for using it in this matchup?

12) Make sure to keep track of where you are on the stage at all times; this can help you avoid or even capitialize on certain situations (Asta's back to the edge and he goes for the throw, you KNOW to mash B or duck lol)

Asta is Kilik's hardest matchup, but there's a few things you can do to make this matchup better for Kilik. I hope this helps...

I also have comments on you vs. Keev/Humphrey but that can come later :)

I also have comments for the other players' vids, but that can come later also :)
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thks wing_zero this helps me out as well cuz i have also some problems dealing with asta.
@ hayate nice games overall, liked your use or 22K and 66K :)
 
In response....

1) It is possible to step 66(K) consistently and easily. Also, be aware that the TC window on bullrush is only active for the beginning of the move; this is why that A+B combo works so well (please test it out; like I said I counted at least 4-5 times you coulda walked around that and destroyed Saitoh). To be honest, using A+B as a whiff punish in general is way too beastly, as you get anywhere from 60-125 points of damage. Go to practice mode and test it out!

2) Both 4B and 44A are viable after blocking a bullrush; Asta can't respond with 6K at all. Again, you have to test this stuff out to see for yourself...

3) 44A is hitconfirmable, so you don't have to put yourself out there unless you see it hit.

Practice and confirm what I'm saying; A+B is way too good as a whiff/step punisher. Actually, test it out on all the characters. It's one of the reasons why i think Kilik is so good...
 
I really appreciated the effort to give me advice, and it's help me a lot to think back on what i'am doing. I will try to respond with my comments.

wing_zero said:
1) Saitoh utilized too much 66(K). There were quite a few times when you could have stepped to his side or back and taken more than half his life (A+B--->3BB--->6AAA is around 100-124 dmg----props to Cano for this combo), thus ending the match faster. Also, the times you DO block 66(K), you can use 2K/1K and negate that second bullrush or throw attempt. The only time you have to suffer the mixup is if Asta spaces the 66(K) correctly and gets frame advantage...
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First i noticed taht Kilik is not a good steper, and when i was doing 88_22 step i got hit 70% of time. Instead when i was doing stepguarding i can manage to escape 50% of time and also stay safe. After watching the vidéo, i know that i have to test now the punishement post stepguarding. A+B is i20 high, Bullrush is TC, so i will have to test if it works after a succesuful stepguard. Otherwise i'am planning to test 3kB, or go directly for better mixup.

I tried on the last match to GI the 66[K], i fail but i will continue to train this, i think it's important, especially when he spaces correctly, Kilik have no tool to escape when he blocks a max ranged 66[K], but he can GI it i assume.

Also i noticed in the 3rd match that 1B will sucessfully step and punish 66K at very close range, it's an important statement. I was surprised in the match and did'nt go for anything due to stress. Btw Saitoh rarely do a close bullrush, but it still can happen.

wing_zero said:
2) I'd like to suggest at least 3 more moves you can use after blocking a bullrush: 4B, 2K, 44A. 4B/44A with 1/3A+B is the mixup of choice after blocking a bullrush: they stop Asta from doing another move (44A is especially potent here with the potential to give upwards of 70+ damage on CH. 4B pushes Asta back out 2K is for irritation and possible advantage on CH).
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I think 44A is a bad idea cause it's i27!! Astaroth will be at -10 or better! So his 6K will stop my 44A! I better have to go for more 88_22A or 88_22K or A+K which are all anti-step punisher and fast enough, 88_22K will KND on CH so steping will be punished, it also open the standing guard cause it's a fast low, and TC ... that's why i use it a lot in this match up. Also it's nearly safe versus Astaroth. A+K is for speed reacting and keeping a good defensive option (-5), also cover step and mid and TC. 88_22A is probably the most dangerous, but still a great option after this.

Actually i'am using 44A on offensive, were i have time to do a i27 move, the second A is not safe cause it jumpable on reaction, but still you can stop at first on and Asura the 8B Attempt.

Still the only situation that i can prefer using 44A than other anti-stepping is at tip range, where 88A and A+K will miss. At this range, 44A is the best option. But still AAB CH and aB CH has great potential too, but duckable that the moment i use 44A.

For the 4B it's a great instant TC, but also slow enough to get countered by 6K attempt. Then going for a classical iWS B seems a better option, it's also TC, it's nearly faster (i21 + Instant Crouching frame), cause nearly similar damage, very safe, pushback.

I think 4B usage is better at long range, or versus long anti-rushing opponent. Or whiff punish.

2K is what i used a lot.

3) ALWAYS BE ON THE LOOKOUT FOR A wsB/A OPPORTUNITY. It's possible to duck Asta's throws on reaction, so don't duck unless you see him flash white (JF) or flex his arm (normal). There is also a sweet spot where bullrush will NOT beat out wsB/wsA/66B; try to stay in this range at all times if possible...
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For the reacting on Bullrush, i have to test it, maybe on Flashing JF, but not on the normal, you will be confused by other mid move i think. Still your advice about the range with wsB/wsA/66B is important, i will try to improve this, at least with doing backstepguarding!

4) Using high moves that are not throws in this fight is way too risky. You want to go mid/low at all times if possible.
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Well i remember only goind for AAB / aB attempt for CH just one time think. Also 46B was here to CH on advantage, i don't remember used a lot of high moves.

5) Asura is VERY RISKY in this fight. I do applaud you taking the risk to do it (AND hitting it), but it's in my opinion that it's simply not worth it. I feel like you could have been better off going for something else, or even simply blocking. Which brings me to my next point....
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You are right, and i wanted to create a surprising Asura, espacially at tip range, were his grab will be TCed or will miss on the Asura. But i agree with your statement, and will do near 0 defending asura.

8) You can punish 6A,B with 3kB
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I confused the 4A+B punishement with 6A B, that a was a panic mistake lol But yeah i know that i can punish. Also 6AB after the block of first one, you can go for a easy 6AAA CH it will interrupt before the second arrive.

9) 22B will mysteriously step 4A+B for some reason in strange situations (It happens to me most often when Asta is getting up from the ground). 44A is a great alternative and does massive damage on CH...
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Yeah i think it's the better of usage of 44A. On wakeuping you have enough advantage to forceblock 4A+B (i28) and 44A(i27), so it will clearly punish the steping opponent.

10) It seems you've discovered the cheapness of kB, lol. That move is beastly!
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Hell yeah, great move.

11) Your use of 22_88K was excellent too. What are your reasons for using it in this matchup?
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Like i said earlier on the post, TC, i24 so nearly invisible, semi safe, also not very risky verus Astaroth with 22KB, cover anti-steping, CH KND on stepping, it's a better version of 2A, more riskly but Astaroth is not a good punisher. It also hit grounded opponent so it's top tier on wakeuping.

12) Make sure to keep track of where you are on the stage at all times; this can help you avoid or even capitialize on certain situations (Asta's back to the edge and he goes for the throw, you KNOW to mash B or duck lol)
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Yeah, that was hard, especially versus Saitoh and the stress of the tournament... but i will keep improving my relfexion on the stage.

Asta is Kilik's hardest matchup, but there's a few things you can do to make this matchup better for Kilik. I hope this helps...
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Yeah, here my personnal comment, it can help also other player on this matchup.

1- After succesfull WS B, always go for tech trap more damaging option!! Astaroth is a rare character that can not roll and evade 44aB, that mean force tech, then you can mixup 88B (delayed) for left tech, 44aB for right tech. It's really important after WS B, especially that you will hit a lot with this move, cause you have to anticipate some throw. An important note is that after 11B the techtrap option is less good, but still Astaroth can't roll (depend on your good timing of 44aB), so goind for 88B (delayed) and 44aB still works.

2- Do not let Astaroth take advantage after his different Bullrush, try to confirm a good spaced full charged bull rush and the other one. If you block a close ranged non charged bullrush, you can force i22-i23 mix up. If you block a spaced non charged bullrush, you can still force i20 mixup, espacially with the range advantage. If you block a fullcharged bullrush at max range, you have to GI it, not to block... if you block the same version at different range, 1K/2K like wing_zero said. Btw at mid and close range, you can easly go for 66B wich will hit on CH.

3- Abuse of spacing move, Astaroth is not a good punisher, espacially 2A+K. At close range use a maximum of of instant TC, and fast enough, A+K, 1A, 88_22K, 2A, iWS B/A, do not use any Asura unless you are auto-Ging something on visual confirmation.

4- Other Tips :
=> 2B+K (blocked) Stand Throw/Crouch Throw, can be interuppted with 46B, it will double impact but the stunning effect on CH of the 46B will give you a free 6AA on Astaroth!
=> The non full charged version of 4A+B is punishable by A+B 6B+K!
=> 66AB is interuptable by 3BB CH or more, but doing 3BB or 3kB will also punish him if stop at 66A.
=> Always step to his right. When wakeuping do a step guard right to evoid the 3[B.] / 3B attempt.
=> Also don't hesitate to counter him with WS K when he is attempting to 3[B.] after some situation where he don't have the advantage.

I also have comments on you vs. Keev/Humphrey but that can come later :)
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Don't hesitates, it's important to talk about specific situation to improve both our games.

Berny> Thx, 66K is my favourite move since soulcalibur III! Too bad that the soulcharge cancel has gone.
 
wing_zero said:
1) It is possible to step 66(K) consistently and easily.
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Do use 8wayruning or StepGuarding ? And is there a best side or range to start your step or it's just the timing ?

Also, be aware that the TC window on bullrush is only active for the beginning of the move; this is why that A+B combo works so well (please test it out; like I said I counted at least 4-5 times you coulda walked around that and destroyed Saitoh). To be honest, using A+B as a whiff punish in general is way too beastly, as you get anywhere from 60-125 points of damage. Go to practice mode and test it out!
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I will practise more this one, and report back.

2) Both 4B and 44A are viable after blocking a bullrush; Asta can't respond with 6K at all. Again, you have to test this stuff out to see for yourself...
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Will test it too.

3) 44A is hitconfirmable, so you don't have to put yourself out there unless you see it hit.
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If it is, then it comes better. But i feel like it is more like the confirm of 3B B, hard to confirm.

Thx Again.
 
wing_zero said:
Asta is Kilik's hardest matchup
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I just wanted to comment on this. Astaroth is not Kilik's worst matchup Ivy is. There is almost virtually nothing Kilik can do vs. her.

It's something like this.

55/45 - Astaroth's favor or 50/50 - Even

80/20 - Ivy's favor or 70/30 - Ivy's favor.
 
Something-Unique said:
I just wanted to comment on this. Astaroth is not Kilik's worst matchup Ivy is. There is almost virtually nothing Kilik can do vs. her.

It's something like this.

55/45 - Astaroth's favor or 50/50 - Even

80/20 - Ivy's favor or 70/30 - Ivy's favor.
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Explain please :)

Ivy doesn't negate Kilik's movelist quite like Asta does.

While there are things Ivy has that give Kilik problems, it's not a insta-win imo...
 
wing_zero said:
Explain please :)

Ivy doesn't negate Kilik's movelist quite like Asta does.

While there are things Ivy has that give Kilik problems, it's not a insta-win imo...
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It would be difficult to explain for me thouroughly because I don't know what move is what by command so it will take time for me to thouroughly explain.

What I can broadly say is her SW stance is golden against Kilik, she is either even with him or beats him out at mid-far range which Kilik is best at. On the inside without question is suicide because of his shitty stepping ability and her safety. By itself it doesn't give Ivy a free win but her jumping Sword stab from SW is a bitch for Kilik. It catches him in his backstep and sidestep to left or right and beats out everything on the inside and that's just by itself not even factoring anything else.
 
comment by wing_zero: "Practice and confirm what I'm saying; A+B is way too good as a whiff/step punisher. Actually, test it out on all the characters. It's one of the reasons why i think Kilik is so good... "



how do u step and your opponent whiff so much that u are able to use A+B so often?
is there a vid of showing some stuff?
do u prefer short step (8/2) or walking ([8[/[2]) ?
u see iam needing some advice for steping :) to use A+B cause youve already said that this one is too good...
 
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