Nationals: What Went Right/Wrong

Status
Not open for further replies.
This is EXACTLY what ChaCha, Kit and Myself are talking about!

Dezzz, you are contributing NOTHING to this conversation. You are NOT providing solutions for any problems, not even asking any questions; you are only making things worse by deflecting the main issues to periphrial issues. What does Kit's skill in Soulcalibur have ANYTHING to do with ANYTHING? You are avoiding the central topic because you have no valid responses for it, and you are instead latching on periphrial issues to try undermind the efforts for TRUTH many of us have been making in this thread.

For that matter? WHO THE FUCK ARE YOU? You get last place in every event you have ever attended; something Kit could EASILY do as well. Not to mention. you are NOT a vocal part of this community, Kit is. If you are NVGA, stop fucking around and get us some answers.

First watch ya mouth boy.... You dont know me.
Second i never question his skills, simply asked if played.
Thirdly if i truly felt like it i could easy rank.

Fourth fool, you guys arent the on only ones who are out money. Im out 1500 dollars alone between hosting a regional and going to help out at Nats. Matter of fact where were you helping out with all this when shit needed to get done that weekend, boy. Im out a bunch of cash because i love gaming Atl regional venue not free, ps3's i bought for the regional not free, copies of games not free, i didnt have enough ps3's so i asked ppl who were entering if could borrow there's and if i did i would pay for the entry fee into my regional. NOT FUCKING FREE ok plane ticket, i paid to get into Nats fool. SO dont question me or us about money, boy. .

You have the flithy nevre to say we're skimming off the out wtf. How dare you judge us.
 
Dezzz... again... what does your regional event have to do with $2k disappearing from the pot?
 
First watch ya mouth boy.... You dont know me.
Second i never question his skills, simply asked if played.
Thirdly if i truly felt like it i could easy rank.

Fourth fool, you guys arent the on only ones who are out money. Im out 1500 dollars alone between hosting a regional and going to help out at Nats. Matter of fact where were helping out with all this , when shit needed to get done that weekend, boy. Im out a bunch of cash because i love gaming Atl regional venue not free, ps3's i had bought for the regional not free, copies of games not free, i didnt have enough ps3's so i asked ppl who were entering if could borrow there's and if i did i would pay for the entry fee into my regional. NOT FUCKING FREE ok plane ticket, i paid to get into Nats fool. SO dont question me or us about money, boy. Cause we are in the negative to, trying to make you guys happy.

You have the flithy nevre to say we're skimming off the out wtf. How dare you judge us.

E-thugging at its best. /ad hominem

1. Please don't act like you're a fighter over a forum.
2. You made your statement in a condescending way to Kit, because you never heard of him.
3. Everyone can say that. Doesn't make it true tho.
4. If you are out of $1,500, then that just sounds like poor planning. Jaxel wasn't wrong for thinking someone was skimming off of the top, especially after reading this entire thread and the responses from the NVGA.

I credit Dhalsim for acting like a grown up, but you guys aren't answering a lot of questions. It'd be better if you just came out and said "We don't want to answer", instead of this PR stuff you guys are responding with. This isn't Fox News. Just lay out some facts and numbers, instead of only attacking people's opinion, questioning their experience and hiding behind nice words.

To some extent I agree with Nori about you Jaxel. I've heard a lot of you complaining about how DFG handles his business for awhile and have seen the mess over at caliburforums. I, also, thought you (or others in the community) should've stepped up and organized this yourselves, instead of relying on a group of people whose way of running things doesn't rub well with you.

And I'll say this for everyone else. No I don't compete in regionals or nationals.
 
Jesus... You're missing the entire point. I don't think people here care as much about respectful language as they do about answers. And you're giving none. Apparently, this is due to the fact that you guys are still trying to investigate what happened before coming to any conclusions? This sounds ok, except for the fact that it's YOUR (NVGA's) event and so it seems like either: A) You guys have no idea what the hell happened with your own event, B) You're just deflecting, spinning, avoiding, etc., or C) Both A and B.

Like I said, EVERYONE knows there were problems. Your usage of "IF" suggests that there might not have been.
 
Ok, to NVGA-

You keep posting about keeping negativity out, without addressing any of the issues generating it. (need to tell parts of the story though)

Dhalsim, Chingaook, Dezzz, I recognize your names from being mentioned to me by DFG, but do you even remember who I am? (I'm not being sarcastic)

Yea, I'm the guy who got SC4 nats planned, laid the ground work, rules and started all the information/hype for it. I was the guy running it, until some unfortunate forum related drama that removed me from the (at one time) main calibur fourms, which impeded my ability to effectively organize and plan nats (since this website did not exist yet). At first NVGA was involved to help with equipment and match recording for finals, in TULSA, OK. After more issues that splintered planning further, I offered NVGA the chance to run it, as DFG seemed anxious to get nationals under NVGA's banner. At the time, I thought this could do no harm. He made promises of keeping the plans I had intact and also promised he had many sponsors lined up to help promote and fund the event, as well as NVGA's vast resources he claimed to have to make the event outstanding. Looking back, none of this took place.

Why did I ask if you remembered me? Because I don't recall any of you being involved to any extent in the planning emails that took place between me and DFG, where he supposedly included key NVGA members for input (via CC emails) (maybe chingagook occasionally?). Rarely did anyone provide input aside from "sounds great, go for it!" on whatever was being discussed. Up until the plan to move Nats finals to supercon (which killed it all for me), I was heavily involved in the plan making discussion, though there were already a lot of changes made that I didn't like. NVGA promised a high amount of hype for each regional, and it produced none. Communication was pretty abysmal with most of the regional coordinators as well. Over time, I saw this go from a valid community effort, to an NVGA agenda that served their needs, not ours.

It seems like the NVGA'ers posting are only here for some sort of damage control, with no real idea of why people have issues or what went wrong.
....

Well controlling damage is not necessarily bad thing, however this is about more than that. We are reviewing what happened both good and bad for the purposes of resolutions going forward. The truth is the easiest thing for us to do would be to stop responding and just leave it alone, something that's been done many times in the past by many other organizations.

This is not just controlling damage, it could actually increase it by drawing more attention to it but it's more than that.

You're right, we did not closely follow all those emails. I know I skimmed them, and to my brief review it looked like the primary planners were working through issues and changes throughout the event. Clearly for some people it was not ever worked thru.

Please go back and read my description of the NVGA structure. Each chapter is an independent organization. NVGA as a whole provides support. We do not run the show. We provide support for each other.

You are correct in that to the extent that the event ran poorly in any areas (and we know for a fact it was not all poor, many things ran well) we failed in providing support. We accept that blame. We were not ALL involved in many of the details which you yourself also state so clearly we cannot answer for all of the past discussions at the detailed level.

What we can do and ARE doing is addressing the issues in terms what should occur going forward.


So again, siding with your pleas of 'solutions' rather than mass negativity... I will not post every single plan or idea that was changed for the worse and why, because the list would be long and negative. However, regardless of DFG not being the 'founder' of NVGA, he still made a lot of questionable changes to favor NVGA and profitability, under your banner and none of you questioned it, and assumed it was status quo (from our perspective). So there is some shared accountability for your whole organization.

So I think I already agreed on shared accountability. That's why we are here.

Regarding the repeated mantra of our failure to address the issues directly apparently DFG's post HERE was missed where he took time to DETAIL his response issue by issue along with his own plans for solutions.

If you read that post, you may not agree with his issue by issue response or even his plans for solutions, fair enough, but please can we stop saying he hasn't responded to the actual issues?

If you are looking for an issue by issue detailed response from NVGA as a group, that is also fair but again as we acknowledged already, we provided support. We invested our own money, whether you think it was as much as "promised" or not. We will need time to investigate that and reach agreement as an association.

Finally, personally, I cannot speak for all the NVGA leaders but I appreciate your idea for running the event better under a reorganized community structure. I would certainly support it. In doing so perhaps we could provide some amends for shortfalls from the last event. For now I will present it to our founders and chapter leaders and ask for feedback.

Thanks.
 
Well Hustleman, ChaCha and I were the original people running Nationals, we DID step up and organize it ourselves; mostly ChaCha. However this was when caliburforum was still the home for Soulcalibur. When I brought up the IDEA of having a new website for Soulcalibur, I was ousted by the Caliburforum administration (even though I was an admin and had been maintaining the website for a year, they went behind my back and voted to kick me out; so I pre-empted them and de-admined myself). The next day, for no reason at all, they ousted ChaCha and de-admined him. As NVGA took over, ChaCha and I quickly lost our power for the planning of nationals.
 
Like I said, EVERYONE knows there were problems. Your usage of "IF" suggests that there might not have been.

Please see my post above. It's "IF" there were promises not delivered on. As I said, it looks like a lot of things changed during the planning of this event. That's not an excuse, just a observation from reading the posts and emails.

There is no "IF" there were problems, we do all acknowledge that. We simply need to accurately assess it and also keep it in perspective, pros and cons.
 
Look, we all understand that there were problems and yes, you have addressed a few of the issues. But everyone wants to know what happened to the money and you keep on giving us a runaround response. Telling the community that "Yes, there were problems but don't worry, we will fix it for next year." CMON MAN!

If you just break down the financial aspect of the regionals and nationals and show where all the money went, then we can move on from there. See if the issue is peeps skimming money off the top or just poor planning. It really is as simple as that.
 
Jaxel: Here is what it boils down to. We are all adults. Most people here are older than 20. Therefore, are old enough to make competent decisions. If the people that WERE THERE and GOT PAID, are not smart enough to talk to DFG/NVGA about THEIR money, to be honest, I can care less what happened to it. I know exactly where MY money went in denver, cause it says so my on my very nifty bank of america statement. As far as the things that affected ME at Nats, DFG addressed them here and on the phone w/me. If I have a serious problem, I go after that person. I certainly don't need to score points online and call them out publicly. You are NOT like us. What I mean by that is, you are the leader and are supposed to be handling this differently. We, as a community, should be the ones calling people out, etc. And even that only gets you so far. It's up to leaders to get to the bottom of things, no matter what. And you decline to talk to the guy on the phone because it's "smoke and mirrors". Come on dude. Any issues you have as a leader, address the guy or don't complain about it. Like I said, this shit is getting really old, really fast.

Now you're talking about "NVGA taking over"? Again, conspiracy theories. This is YOUR website. You took the time to create it, build it, and bring everybody over. For that reason alone, people followed you. So take advantage of it. You could have made a poll asking the community who they thought should run Nats. I can guarantee you people would have backed you up, since again, you have a pretty good track record w/tourneys. Yet, you didn't. You sat on the sidelines and have now returned to dissect and play the blame game. And say what you will, it is NOT productive. You think people are upset about Nats? I was there my man, I kept in touch w/everybody. If you think I'm the only one questioning how you are handling this, you are deeply mistaken. To me, everything that has to be said has been said, why is it still open? Your main focus right now should be:

-Being a leader
-Or if you can't/won't, having the community elect somebody who can
-Or, having "regional leaders"

But do SOMETHING productive vs going after NVGA/DFG is all I'm trying to get through to you
 
Well Hustleman, ChaCha and I were the original people running Nationals, we DID step up and organize it ourselves; mostly ChaCha. However this was when caliburforum was still the home for Soulcalibur. When I brought up the IDEA of having a new website for Soulcalibur, I was ousted by the Caliburforum administration (even though I was an admin and had been maintaining the website for a year, they went behind my back and voted to kick me out; so I pre-empted them and de-admined myself). The next day, for no reason at all, they ousted ChaCha and de-admined him. As NVGA took over, ChaCha and I quickly lost our power for the planning of nationals.

Gotcha. Hopefully next nationals will be a better experience for all of the players then
 
E-thugging at its best. /ad hominem

1. Please don't act like you're a fighter over a forum.
2. You made your statement in a condescending way to Kit, because you never heard of him.
3. Everyone can say that. Doesn't make it true tho.
4. If you are out of $1,500, then that just sounds like poor planning. Jaxel wasn't wrong for thinking someone was skimming off of the top, especially after reading this entire thread and the responses from the NVGA.

I credit Dhalsim for acting like a grown up, but you guys aren't answering a lot of questions. It'd be better if you just came out and said "We don't want to answer", instead of this PR stuff you guys are responding with. This isn't Fox News. Just lay out some facts and numbers, instead of only attacking people's opinion, questioning their experience and hiding behind nice words.

To some extent I agree with Nori about you Jaxel. I've heard a lot of you complaining about how DFG handles his business for awhile and have seen the mess over at caliburforums. I, also, thought you (or others in the community) should've stepped up and organized this yourselves, instead of relying on a group of people whose way of running things doesn't rub well with you.

And I'll say this for everyone else. No I don't compete in regionals or nationals.

obviously you dont know me either, sooo, thus this is my last post in this thread lol. You girls seem a lil to sensative for me (no grass in the infield) so i cant play with you ladies. Cause if you keep tempting the devil he will burn you. SO MUCH love to you gamers, lol. hope you guys can come to conclusion in here. Feel free to hit me up. it was fun. btw im

Desmond
 
Nori have you even been reading this thread? I have said countless times that Nationals was planned on CALIBURFORUM!

What does me running 8WR have to do with my decisions over nats? Up until the end of 2008, Caliburforum was still the home for Soulcalibur, we were just a small competing forum with 1/3 of the userbase. I was not yet the "leader" of the Soulcalibur community. By the time 8WR became the home for Soulcalibur, NVGA was in control for many months, regionals were just about to start, and the train had already left the tracks... There was nothing I could do to stop this trainwreck.
 
obviously you dont know me either, sooo, thus this is my last post in this thread lol. You girls seem a lil to sensative for me (no grass in the infield) so i cant play with you ladies. Cause if you keep tempting the devil he will burn you. SO MUCH love to you gamers, lol. hope you guys can come to conclusion in here. Feel free to hit me up. it was fun. btw im

Desmond

And you don't know me. Care to meet at a tourney and say things like that in person? I'm not frail-built like most of the guys here

Dezzz, a six pack and a bird chest doesn't make you look intimidating, homie

Sorry for the off topic, guys.
 
Nori have you even been reading this thread? I have said countless times that Nationals was planned on CALIBURFORUM!

What does me running 8WR have to do with my decisions over nats? Up until the end of 2008, Caliburforum was still the home for Soulcalibur, we were just a small competing forum with 1/3 of the userbase. I was not yet the "leader" of the Soulcalibur community. By the time 8WR became the home for Soulcalibur, NVGA was in control for many months, regionals were just about to start, and the train had already left the tracks... There was nothing I could do to stop this trainwreck.
You keep asking me if I've read the thread, I'm not going to respond because that's clearly a silly question, so let's move on.

So if you felt SO STRONGLY about all this bad shit at nats, why didn't you say so out in the open? Hidden emails, who cares? 8wayrun.com was established WAY before the first regionals happened. Why didn't you put up a poll asking if this is what people want? I do remember the drama from caliburforum, yes. Obviously, people sided w/you and came here (including me). You could have influenced people to not show up at regionals and it would have instantly been cancelled, and you could have done your own thing. Think outside the box dude. What's done is done, but I'll ask you a 3rd and final time, what are your plans from here besides being super negative, to MOVE FORWARD? You are defending yourself like you are on trial when I think I'm asking very simple, non threatening questions.
 
Actually Nori, people DIDN'T side with me. The majority of the community stayed on Caliburforum. But then CF went down for 3 days straight and everyone came to 8WR simply because CF wasn't available. Once CF came back up, people had already realised how much better of a site this was and decided to stick around; it had NOTHING to do with how people felt on the politics of 8WR VS CF.

Why didn't I publicly denounce Nationals? Because I promised DFG I wouldn't. I don't know about him, but I could tell very early on that people were unhappy with the way things were going. I knew that turnout would be very low to the national event at Supercon. So I didn't make any posts about my concerns because I was afraid if I did, the turnout for Nationals would be even LOWER than the 25 that it actually got. I actually like SC4 and I had no interest in SABATAGING the efforts of MANY individuals simply because of the failures of NVGA... which it sounds like you think I should have?

As for our plans, ChaCha and I have been discussing protocols and regulations for Nationals 2010 for a while now; we are not simply criticising the 2009 nationals without considering the implications of a National Series for 2010. However, we are waiting for our ideas to be worked out, and the answers for Nationals 2009 before we start a public discussion on Nationals 2010... I have already said this several times, even directly to YOU in the chatroom.
 
Actually Nori, people DIDN'T side with me. The majority of the community stayed on Caliburforum. But then CF went down for 3 days straight and everyone came to 8WR simply because CF wasn't available. Once CF came back up, people had already realised how much better of a site this was and decided to stick around; it had NOTHING to do with how people felt on the politics of 8WR VS CF.

Why didn't I publicly denounce Nationals? Because I promised DFG I wouldn't. I don't know about him, but I could tell very early on that people were unhappy with the way things were going. I knew that turnout would be very low to the national event at Supercon. So I didn't make any posts about my concerns because I was afraid if I did, the turnout for Nationals would be even LOWER than the 25 that it actually got. I actually like SC4 and I had no interest in SABATAGING the efforts of MANY individuals simply because of the failures of NVGA... which it sounds like you think I should have?

As for our plans, ChaCha and I have been discussing protocols and regulations for Nationals 2010 for a while now; we are not simply criticising the 2009 nationals without considering the implications of a National Series for 2010. However, we are waiting for our ideas to be worked out, and the answers for Nationals 2009 before we start a public discussion on Nationals 2010... I have already said this several times, even directly to YOU in the chatroom.
-For your first point, for whatever reason people came, they did come. That's the point I'm trying to make. Take the ball and run w/it

-Absolutely you should have done that. If you knew Nats would have turned out how it did, or had an inkling the community would respond like this, it's your job to try and protect the community. There are people in this thread who have kids, and trust me, you are not always going to be liked for doing what's right. If everybody knew what you knew, it could have been canceled and started from scratch. It's better than complaining months later and telling us all "told you so". That won't win you over any crowds, please believe me on this.

-IMO, why are we waiting for answers which might not come? Again, it's not YOUR money that was lost. It's money that top 4 earned and it's up to them to track it down. It shouldn't have to be done for them. Let's start the discussion now. I PROMISE that thread will be more productive towards the community and steer people from quitting vs being constantly reminded of 2009 Nationals. What are your ideas? I'm sure they are good, so let's get cracking on it. I see zero reason to wait honestly. Even if you don't have something set in stone, your positive ideas are for sure more productive than your negative rants
 
Nori... ChaCha has asked you several times in public and private if you would be willing to work with us on the planning for next year's nationals; and thus far you have been ignoring him. We're giving you the oppurtunity to instead of just complaining, to actually put the work in helping to make sure it runs as smoothly as both you and I want it to. Please stop ignoring him.
 
Nori... ChaCha has asked you several times in public and private if you would be willing to work with us on the planning for next year's nationals; and thus far you have been ignoring him. We're giving you the oppurtunity to instead of just complaining, to actually put the work in helping to make sure it runs as smoothly as both you and I want it to. Please stop ignoring him.
I have never, ever, received a single PM from ChaCha. You can log into my account and check if you have to. Look at my history. I have never ignored a single PM from anybody. And please show me publicly where he asked me? I'm not complaining by any means about not being on the Nats committee in the past, but I never ever was asked by him at all. As far as moving forward, whatever help you guys need, I'll absolutely help.
 
Sorry, my mistake then... he told me he tried several times to get in contact you; maybe he meant through AIMs or PMs in the chatroom. Anyway, get back to him when you can.
 
Sorry, my mistake then... he told me he tried several times to get in contact you; maybe he meant through AIMs or PMs in the chatroom. Anyway, get back to him when you can.
We have never talked through PM, IM, chatroom, or person in SC4. I will PM him, and IMO again, the top 4 should worry about their money. You are correct in that the money doesn't add up, it's sad, but there is only so much we as a community can do. Our best bet is moving forward IMO
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top Bottom