SC6: Issues with Stickers and other things.

FreeMeal

[13] Hero
Okay, so, this is more of an article to be posted on the soulcalibur and producer's twitter so they know these issues and hopefully address them in a future patch. Feel free to add issues that aren't here, or talk about your feelings on the matter, though. While there are some 'nice to have' suggestions here, I'm mainly focusing on issues with what we have 'now'. Namely, the new methods of filtering, transparency, and wrapping of the stickers are really hurting things in terms of usefulness.

Hello. I got this game yesterday after reading impressions. I thought the biggest issues were a chunk of parts missing, and one or two issues with stickers ('washed out' when placed on some areas, and place by view being worse). After tinkering a bit, however, I found a good chunk of problems that make it VERY hard to work with.

STICKERS:

1) The square sticker no longer wraps around the body anymore. You can see there are problems with mapping it on the UV's, leaving weird seams everywhere. Stickers in general can't be as big as they used to be in SC5.
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 16-48-40.png
You can see other examples here, compared to SC 5:
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 20-08-21.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 21-47-17.png
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 20-09-08.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 21-48-06.png
Here's a practical example: Using the dragon crest sticker on a cape to make long hair, which is impossible in SC6.
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 22-03-54.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 21-23-18.png
2) If you use a dark color on a sticker, it makes the sticker transparent.
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 21-15-01.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 21-15-13.png
Another example, with the face. You can see more UV mapping problems too. (With SC 5 Comparison)
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 21-14-00.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 21-17-02.png
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 22-05-44.png
3) Transparency's and filtering of stickers has changed (removed), leaving thick white edges on everything.
Here we have two pockets. It's clear that they both have a white border around them in SC5, but the transparency on it allows them to be layered on top of each other. It's impossible in SC6.
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 21-49-49.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 19-27-01.png
A practical example, using a pocket sticker to create a vest on this equipment. As you can see, the illusion is completely ruined. (Also, impossible, due to missing this belt).
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 21-58-59.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 22-28-48.png
Furthermore. putting a sticker on top of a bump map sticker will erase the bump map.
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 21-52-40.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 19-25-46.png
Here we have a sticker with a white outline. Changing the white fur also changes the white outline. This is in SC5, but the transparency on the outline was way less apparent.
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 20-11-33.png
When we rotate the sticker, you can see strange artifacts appear.
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 20-10-45.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 20-34-02.png
Another strange UV/mapping problem:
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-08 20-12-45.png
Other examples of this can be found on the following motifs: 23, 24, 26, 27, 28, 31, 34, 39, 53, 63, 64, 65, 76, 80, 85

4)You can no longer use 'reset' to change how a sticker is laid on object, to make them long and thin.
The best example is the zipper. Here you can see if become a long, thin line when placed by axis. In SC6 this is impossible. Of course, if we had the ability to scale the stickers on X and Y separately, there would be no need for this function.
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-09 13-39-20.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-09 13-16-28.png

5)Many stickers seem to have a blur filter applied to them, which becomes very apparent when they are scaled down.
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-09 14-25-06.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-09 14-36-56.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-09 14-37-48.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-09 14-38-02.png

6)Stickers with bump maps aren't as noticeable/strong as they were in SC5. (In the future, a slider for 'bump intensity' would be nice).

Please, bring back the old 'Place by View' and 'Place by Axis' methods. It's clear that the equipment and stickers are the exact same as they were in 5, but the new placement methods are creating a lot of issues. I feel that most, if not all of these issues can be be fixed.

7)Patterns cannot be scaled down as far they could in SC5, which makes some effects impossible.
Here we can see in SC5 a pattern used to make chain mail, but the effect can't be achieved in 6.
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-09 13-40-21.pngMy Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-09 13-18-02.png

8)Many basic, vital equipment are missing. The leather and marquee belts mentioned, the wide-opening gloves, feathers of strength, the ball... I can understand holding back the cast's 2P equipment, but many of these basic equipment are essential building blocks to transform creations into something unique. Please at some point bring back the missing SC5 equipment not currently in the game (capes, glasses, masks, footwear, gloves, etc), even if it means a straight port of the models.

9)Please bring back the old color chooser, as it's very hard to make colors in SC6. In SC5, you could make darker blacks as well, both with (0:0,0) and (0:45,31).

10)There are many parts with section of color you cannot change. Examples include the Warlock's Tricorne, and Savanna Neckless. This reduces they're usefulness greatly. Stickers such as the new dirt motifs have this problem as well. Please, if you can, upgrade these to allow all the colors to be modified in the future.

Finally, I feel that many equipment items, like the Cataclysm Cuirass, Samsara Vestment, and Sword Demon Leg Guards could be broken up into their respective item categories, to make them more useful (leg, pants, cape, belt, etc). I know this is a tall order, the sticker issues are the most important to me.

Most characters I made in SC5 are now impossible to make in this game. I implore the devs to brink back basic equipment missing, and fix the sticker issues. I was expecting SC5's creation mode with some differences, but I was dismayed to find these issues. I know you are open to suggestions, and I feel that they can be addressed. Thank you.

For reference, here's what was possible to make in SC5, which I currently can't recreate or surpass with SC6's current system.
 
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Well... you're not wrong. I too am frustrated with some of the sticker issues - moreso the bad artifacts & scaling, since I have some background in texturing and 3D graphics, and the level of "quality" (or lack of the same) would be absolutely unacceptable from even a small indie studio, let alone a multi-million AAA group like this.

I have to disagree with #6 though. They may have changed some limits to Place by Axis, but it's essentially the same as before, and I am very glad they've ditched Place by View in favor of "Projection" - once you understand how the sliders and projection camera works, it's far more precise than SCV's guesswork with viewing angle. Hated using that system. This way you can mirror stickers exactly, using projection methods.
 
The one thing I liked from place by view was that if a sticker got cut off, it would blur the cut off part. I say, just add it so we have 3 methods, so everyone's happy. Add the TTT2 style of projection too. That one allowed you to 'push through' the decal through the entire character, and allowed for unique effects.
 
They really messed this feature up this time. All they had to do was keep it the same as in SCV and just upgrade the texture qualities. What we have instead is the vast majority of the stickers looking like a garbled mess once applied (barely able to distinguish what they are) and probably even lower quality rendering than scv. And limitations on placement with invisible seams down the middle of the character's body cutting off the design often making it impossible to achieve the desired effect.
 
You can get around the seems thing by using the 2nd option, which is like 'place by axis' in sc5. (unless that's what you've been doing, then sorry) But yeah, this feels like a total downgrade. It could just be the new projection system they're using, though. I can tell that the parts all have the same exact geometry when I compare them side-by-side. It's the way stickers are being applied (or have been ported over) that's a big problem.
 
Yeah CaS is a completely different game this time around. Sticker projection is where its at. We can go much larger here than in SCV, and stickers seem less blurry in this mode. The new slider system also makes it much easier to stretch or compress stickers during projection. So I rarely use Axis nowadays. Also certain stickers like the lion crest can go blacker than the square. For other problems like the white border on pocket stickers, we can actually use them to create new clothing layers or find other ways to incorporate them in the design. And although ExEq options are fewer, we can go much bigger than before to create new combinations. Recreations will be tougher now, but the flaws in the system will actually guide us to taking more creative liberties to express ourselves. Artifacts, blurriness, and all.
 
I noticed most of this problems, you did a good job recollecting all them. That being said, I don't think devs are interested enough in fixing current problems of the CAS system, and the best proof of it is that they didn't even bother into fixing the old problems of the CAS system that this game inherited.

Lets be realistic here, they just needed a CAS system for a game wich Budget and development time was...limited (this is not an opinión, Project Soul itself said the franchise was almost dead and them allowed to do a new game was basically a miracle) so they basically cloned the old system and call it a day. Probably they realized this troubles themselves when they imported the old system but was either too hard to solve or too much time consuming to fix it so they gone with it anyway. So I at least don't have any hopes of any of that being fixed...at all. Not because it can't be fixed, but because they won't make the effort of fixing it.

The only part where I have hopes of improvement is in the quantity of ítems. We know there Will be two packs of DLC with CAS ítems, worth 100 ítems in total (that's at least what they said). I think (or at least that's what I hope) is that we Will have free updates too with some of the "missing" ítems from old CAS and that they Will make a big fuss about it "we are giving you CAS ítems for free!". Because honestly it would be a dick move if those two DLC were old ítems instead of Brand new ítems.

Don't get me wrong, is not that I'm fine with these problems, and of course is not that I would want it fixed if possible. I only say that I wouldn't get my hopes up because probably won't be fixed. SCV problems were fewer and there was pretty much room for improvement and wasn't fixed, so I don't think they Will put more effort now.
 
@NeclordX I get that these games gave low budget. It's just super frustrating. I still had this tweeted to the producer and soulcalibur guys. If it's just the projection system that could be tweaked, then it shouldn't be too hard. I only did this because they openly stated they wanted feedback, and that they seem to respond quick-ish to people's problems with a patch that's coming soon.

@brucege If the new projection system was like TTT2's, and let you 'push through' the sticker so it envelops the entire model, this thread probably wouldn't be half as long, as that would allow for a crazy amount of new ways to put stickers on. As of now without that and scale x and y separate it's super limited and takes 2 stickers to do the job of 1 in SC5. I appreciate that extra parts not only can be made much bigger, but the degree of control is bigger, too. I no longer have to worry about whether an item appears on the front or back when I set it to 'Chest'. which is nice. If they did something like let you place 6-10 of them, it would offset the lack of options a great deal, as it would be a 'build your own parts' affair. It's not like people aren't already abusing what's there to make un-seeable fighters, anyway.
 
Totally agree with all that's been said here, just add a thing or two :
try using Azwel's tolas when you have ExEq in play, doesn't work, invisible tolas...
about the stickers, depends on the surface, some Eqs surface make the stickers blurry, others not, not sticker dependent, surface dependent i think.
about the missing gear, this is a disgrace, period, no excuse, and if it is given later as part of the paid DLC, an insult to all those (like me) who bought all items in SC5. But let's not jump to conclusions and wait. Until then, as brucege said, let's have fun thinking outside the box and exploiting the new possibilities and bugs...
 
I was thinking about making a thread about this too, but it would be a mess, yours is well done. I don't understand how they fucked up the stickers to such a degree without giving a shit. By the way, if you want to add another problem to the list, try placing stickers on the long skirt. The bottom is completely messed up. This + the stickers not wrapping all around and being transparent makes me unable to make to me very pleasing looking dresses using stickers as borders on the patterns.
 
Yeah there's some issues with how some items receive stickers. Now, I'm noticing some old pieces got upgraded to allow stickers, which makes the wait on older pieces a bit more tolerable.

However:
My Great Capture Screenshot 2018-11-13 14-41-22.png

Huh? I assumed 'Left Leg' meant put it on the actual leg. Was hoping for thigh-highs, grieves, and shorts or something. Kind of Baffling. Why they built in high heels is beyond me, when there is already high heel foot wear that for some reason cuts off the tights. Makes item conflicts with a good number of footwear, too. Kind of throws the usefulness of this item out the window a bit.
 
It’s the bow tie that ruins that outfit. I just wanted pantyhose....

Regardless, on the face, you can use stickers and face paint with Voldo’s or Ivy’s outfits and get something like what Cervantes wears under his armored alts. I did that for an alt, even cutting out a sleeve...
 
I just found another rather weird Issue. When you use Azwel neckwear, if you use three accessories it misteriously dissapear. It doesn't matter where do you put the accessories, 2 accessories is fine, it doesn't cause any issue but if you put a third one Azwel neckwear (sorry don't know the name in the english version) dissapears
 
I just found another rather weird Issue. When you use Azwel neckwear, if you use three accessories it misteriously dissapear. It doesn't matter where do you put the accessories, 2 accessories is fine, it doesn't cause any issue but if you put a third one Azwel neckwear (sorry don't know the name in the english version) dissapears
Yes, I noticed this with a Yoshimitsu costume I made. The neckwear would have been perfect but alas, the accessories were too important. Very weird.
 
three accessories?! in as three Equipments Slots? not again

anyways, that sucks one of them would disappears.. don't remember it happens in SCV *shrugs*

for Azwel's neckwear, it's called Truth-Seeker Stola
 
Wow, it just disappears? So strange...

Yeah for what they offer more than 3 extra equipment would have gone a looooong way.
 
three accessories?! in as three Equipments Slots? not again

anyways, that sucks one of them would disappears.. don't remember it happens in SCV *shrugs*

for Azwel's neckwear, it's called Truth-Seeker Stola

Is not that one of them dissapear. Its that if you put a third accessory in the carácter the Truth-Seeker Stola (thanks for the name) dissappears magically. It doesn't advertise you anything it just turns invisible but you can see its still equipped but doesn't show.

So you can only use two accessories if you are using that stola, since if you put a third accessory the stola dissappears
 
speak of SCV, some of the helmets would make your characters go bald

yes it counts. anyways, what about conflict fest in SC6? i know SCV have it. impossible to put both headband and mask on the face at the same time?
 
Headband can be used with all the face parts in 6 it seems. There's some other SC5 parts that have less conflict now, but there's still definately some weird conflicts. Some parts that clip like crazy but are allowed, and some parts that conflict with a bunch of stuff.
 
I tried to create an Auron yesterday since Kilik’s robe was perfect for the way the former wears his coat in battles, but I can’t make it long., even with Mitsurugi’s waist cloth...
 
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