Z.W.E.I. General Discussion/Q&A

[neoghaleon]

I'm having trouble with Mitsus that spam 4B (as if there exists mitsu that do not spam 4B).
How do I deal with this move?
it seems to cover all his negative frames by backstepping and punish.
Zwei needs a long range attack to catch it.
:(

 

[taffertier]

I'm having trouble with Mitsus that spam 4B (as if there exists mitsu that do not spam 4B).
How do I deal with this move?
it seems to cover all his negative frames by backstepping and punish.
Zwei needs a long range attack to catch it.
:(

My prefered long rang punish is 66B,A. It isnt exactly LONG range, but it covers a good bit of distance. I dont think it's enough to catch mitsu's 4B though. Seeing as he takes like 5 character steps backwards and then tracks you with laser guided precision. ZWEI's mid-long range punishment feels pretty limited, unless there's a move i dont know about.

 

[AyaImmortal]

I'm having trouble with Mitsus that spam 4B (as if there exists mitsu that do not spam 4B).
How do I deal with this move?
it seems to cover all his negative frames by backstepping and punish.
Zwei needs a long range attack to catch it.
:(

I fight mitsu all the time and 4b isnt the only reason that its a bad matchup for zwei. However, to deal with 4b, You have to pretty much see it coming and SS at the moment that you see it. It does kinda track so you have to be careful. Mitsu 4b is really hard to deal with for zwei because it makes most of zweis offense about getting AROUND 4b instead of punishing the use. So many times i have tried to use 66b to punish it and i almost always barely miss no matter how close i was when i used it. It will be hard but train yourself to react to 4b and you will be ok.

 

[Dustinsworth]

Mitsu's 4B evasions:

88A if timed correctly. You'll spin and as he lunges, you connect.
44A can also do the trick. As Mitsu is lunging in, Zwei backsteps and moves forward. You need proper spacing for this to be effective.
I believe 6B+A works on this move as well.
B+K can even work, though sometimes you'll eat the poke anyway.

Most players are very predictable with 4B, especially once they recognize they can get you with it. I've found the key is to punish them the first couple times they try it to dissuade them from using it. When facing Mitsu, it's important to adjust your common follow ups.

For example, your 4A], EIN hits string, if blocked, should rarely be followed up with 66B. A good Mitsu will take you out every time. You have to be patient with the old samurai; he's effective and quite deadly!

 

[Lasercakes]

Guys just step out of it. You are making it waaaaay more complicated than it needs to me. Don't try to punish it until you see it whiff. Mitsu can smell your start up frames and will retrack only if you try attacking before he's done. You can step this move at -27 with Siegfried (who has the worst step right?), just don't try to beat it.

 

[WuHT]

Is there a particular pad layout for zwei players ? I get the impression that it may help

 

[TwistedAsura]

haven't been on SCV in like half a month because of heavy schoolwork but I still check the forums every day....*Gets on 8way run*Ah sweet a new patch. Hopefully a minor Zwei buff!*Nerfs my favorite move* http://www.terrariaonline.com/attachments/okay-meme-jpg.3008/

 

[Dustinsworth]

Is there a particular pad layout for zwei players ? I get the impression that it may help

I didn't really switch things around too much. All face buttons remain the same. I play on 360, and my layout is this:

Left Trigger: B+K - this allows me to use 4A and hold EIN, then use moves like UB 44B+K, or 66B+K easily.

Left Bumper: A+B - I use this once in awhile. I programmed this to compensate for my inability to properly nail the face buttons simultaneously, every time. It also makes holding EIN from 66A+B easier, and I can still kick with the face button. I'd have to use some funky claw-grasp in order to do it otherwise!

Right Trigger: B+G - It's important to be able to mix up your throws with ZWEI. I can't nail this throw with the face buttons easily.

Right Bumper: A+B+K - Placement makes sense to me, and feels good when playing. My B+K BE is just two clicks, and 1K BE feels natural enough.

I switch characters often, as I'm still learning the game. It's important that my layout is virtually universal as a result. The only issues I've had so far with this layout stems from some Voldo moves and most of Hilde's moveset.

 

[Dustinsworth]

haven't been on SCV in like half a month because of heavy schoolwork but I still check the forums every day....*Gets on 8way run*Ah sweet a new patch. Hopefully a minor Zwei buff!*Nerfs my favorite move* http://www.terrariaonline.com/attachments/okay-meme-jpg.3008/

Shin, it isn't that bad. I believe it was done due to the exploitative nature of the unblockable setup created from this move with the low kicks ZWEI has.

Total speculation, of course.

 

[AyaImmortal]

Shin, it isn't that bad. I believe it was done due to the exploitative nature of the unblockable setup created from this move with the low kicks ZWEI has.

Total speculation, of course.

actually it is pretty bad.I still play zwei after the nerf and 66A+B is not what it once was(it wasnt that good to begin with)

 

[Dustinsworth]

actually it is pretty bad.I still play zwei after the nerf and 66A+B is not what it once was(it wasnt that good to begin with)

Bus, c'mon now. It hasn't changed my game all that much. It still works as a ground punisher, and on the rare chance I use it standing, I make sure EIN comes rushing in to protect me. I'll acknowledge the sweet 66A+B, 4A+B combo is rather difficult to pull off now, but ZWEI isn't broken from this change.

We'll fight this weekend; maybe I'll win a few now. :)

 

[TwistedAsura]

Shin, it isn't that bad. I believe it was done due to the exploitative nature of the unblockable setup created from this move with the low kicks ZWEI has.

Total speculation, of course.

Well The 11k Unblockable set up was really good but it was really all he had. Theres no doubt hes a bottom tier character now. It was speculated before and I thought so myself but after that nerf....one of his only truly good moves...he dosent have much now.

 

[Dustinsworth]

Meh. He's a fun tier character. I don't need him to win tournaments to make him worth playing.

You can still 2K for the setup, and if foe ducks and blocks, smack him with a mid!

 

[AyaImmortal]

Bus, c'mon now. It hasn't changed my game all that much. It still works as a ground punisher, and on the rare chance I use it standing, I make sure EIN comes rushing in to protect me. I'll acknowledge the sweet 66A+B, 4A+B combo is rather difficult to pull off now, but ZWEI isn't broken from this change.

We'll fight this weekend; maybe I'll win a few now. :)

your game no. My game has changed quite a bit from the lack of frame adv of 66a+b. I didnt use it much as a ground punisher. Most people learned to just stand up and block vs zwei lol

 

[Requiem]

Just tested it,
4A] 2B, EIN, WR B, BT B+K, G, 1K*, CE, B+K, 4A+B, 2K hits for 186 damage. 204 if the opponent teches.
215-224 if you double the 1K*.

 

[GoldDragon]

What should I use as punishers? And can I get something better than 66A+B after CH 6A?

Well with half a bar you can get 4B BE.

With their back to the wall you can get.....

BB into grab/launcher mixups

1B
3k into grab/launcher mixups
4B into wakeup shenanigans (which Zwei isn't that great at but I digress)

 

[ka_kui]

Well with half a bar you can get 3B BE.

3B BE????

 

[GoldDragon]

Yeah that's that a new move since the latest patch.

Naw I'm BSing. Obviously that was a typo. I meant 4B BE. I changed it.

 

[Duragon]

I didn't really switch things around too much. All face buttons remain the same. I play on 360, and my layout is this:

Left Trigger: B+K - this allows me to use 4A and hold EIN, then use moves like UB 44B+K, or 66B+K easily.

Left Bumper: A+B - I use this once in awhile. I programmed this to compensate for my inability to properly nail the face buttons simultaneously, every time. It also makes holding EIN from 66A+B easier, and I can still kick with the face button. I'd have to use some funky claw-grasp in order to do it otherwise!

Right Trigger: B+G - It's important to be able to mix up your throws with ZWEI. I can't nail this throw with the face buttons easily.

Right Bumper: A+B+K - Placement makes sense to me, and feels good when playing. My B+K BE is just two clicks, and 1K BE feels natural enough.

I switch characters often, as I'm still learning the game. It's important that my layout is virtually universal as a result. The only issues I've had so far with this layout stems from some Voldo moves and most of Hilde's moveset.

If you're A button is occupied just use your BE button it'll use whatever you have left. 4[A] and do 44 BE will be 44B+K. Your 66[A+B] will allow you to do a 11k by hitting 11BE etc.

 

[Lasercakes]

Well with half a bar you can get 3B BE.

3A BE?

Uh also, if CH 6A connects and 4B connects due to a wall why not entertain 4B BE into a wall combo?

Looks like this was already addressed. Alt-tabbed to do some stuff at work and came back to finish my post and missed a bunch of posts lol.

On CH with 6A I like to do the roll trap 1B K Ein. I believe there's a specific timing where if they stand up to block that the kick jails them into blocking Ein giving you guaranteed damage/advantage with this setup, except I'm also pretty sure the glitch is still in there where if you block at the right time your kick completely whiffs. I haven't see anyone, but myself in training mode pull it off though.