artard4321
[12] Conqueror
I've been playing some Monster Hunter lately and I just thought about it but what about having an instrument as a weapon for a new character? Seems pretty effective to me.
Soul Calibur VI: General discussion
- Thread starter SSfox
- Start date
Crash X
[14] Master
For Voldo, it may have been because he stole the Yoshimitsu blade from his predecessor years back. For Cervantes, I can assume it’s out of a confrontation between him and the first Yoshimitsu, which nearly put the latter into a coma. Voldo is still honestly an anomaly considering I don’t think they ever met each other face to face, even when the first Yoshimitsu went to retrieve his sword and never found any sight of Voldo upon entering the money pit and surviving the traps.
DanteSC3
[14] Master
genghis_chan
[13] Hero
if im not wrong one of the changes in the lore is for example that the sword is now called "Yoshimitsu" instead of the head of the manju clan gets to be called "Yoshimitsu" correct me if im wrong guys.
Rusted Blade
[14] Master
LisaK
[14] Master
Isn't this basically the same thing, everyone who take Yoshimitsu (sword) became the new Yoshimitsu (Manji leader)..
genghis_chan
[13] Hero
KALAFINA
[10] Knight
I hate to be “that bitch”, but, speaking up as a fan of the character(s), am I the only one who does not think it weird if Viola were to show up in this game even if Amy is present? Can we please remember the forte of plot armor that this franchise employs? Raphael can halt any visual evidence of aging between IV and V because suddenly vampire, and Ivy will apparently be the same in the YorHa days, not to mention SiegMare situations. Even before Viola=Amy was actually confirmed, fans speculated that time travel might be a part of her whole schtick. Do Viola and Amy even know that they will share the same body, unless it’s written by PS into the story? And regarding gameplay, I believe that she’s another character that could be fairly easily edited if her style was really that negatively received but would that seriously be so necessary? Because in my opinion, she was no SC4 Hilde if you get what I mean. Secondly, Viola and Amy may share a body but not a weapon or moveset style over like 8-10 moves. Siegfried and Nightmare, though? 
Yet Z.W.E.I. gets such positive feedback in comparison. Excuse me but it’s such a common thing to hear from conversations with friends to video DLC speculations now that it’s a bit frustrating, if just to me.
Yet Z.W.E.I. gets such positive feedback in comparison. Excuse me but it’s such a common thing to hear from conversations with friends to video DLC speculations now that it’s a bit frustrating, if just to me.
DanteSC3
[14] Master
Well, Raphael literally didn’t age, because his body was “dead” for 17 years, or thereabouts. Put in stasis by Soul Edge to be used as the host of Nightmare for the future resurrection. Not that he wouldn’t necessarily have done so anyway, if the “vampire” aspect was literal, but that being the case, Amy’s body wouldn’t have aged either, but it clearly did for Viola, so I think it more likely that it was basically Raphael frozen in place than anything else. Though anything is possible, of course. Ivy’s alchemy combined with her immortality explains her being the same in 2B’s time.
I don’t mind Amy and Viola being in the same game, though, not at all. I just wouldn’t expect it to happen in this game, considering the transition won’t happen until the next game at the earliest, perhaps even not until the very end of the next game. Including Viola now would just be tacky and out of place, like it would to include Natsu, Patroklos, Pyrrha, Xiba, or Leixia.
I don’t mind Amy and Viola being in the same game, though, not at all. I just wouldn’t expect it to happen in this game, considering the transition won’t happen until the next game at the earliest, perhaps even not until the very end of the next game. Including Viola now would just be tacky and out of place, like it would to include Natsu, Patroklos, Pyrrha, Xiba, or Leixia.
genghis_chan
[13] Hero
God no pls we already have Amy that fights like a squirrels on coke with spaming attacks like she has only i10 on all her moves .. oh wait SHE DOES HAVE i10 ON ALMOST ALL OF HER MOVES!!! pls just dont trigger my PTSD over Viola i already am struggling with comprehend Amy.
Rusted Blade
[14] Master
I think it's possible, but of very outside likelihood. Personally, I would have absolutely zero qualms about this. It's a fighter and continuity (such as we can laughably call it with this series' cornball plotlines, and the possible selection of match-ups) ought to take a back seat to most other factors.I hate to be “that bitch”, but, speaking up as a fan of the character(s), am I the only one who does not think it weird if Viola were to show up in this game even if Amy is present? Can we please remember the forte of plot armor that this franchise employs? Raphael can halt any visual evidence of aging between IV and V because suddenly vampire, and Ivy will apparently be the same in the YorHa days, not to mention SiegMare situations. Even before Viola=Amy was actually confirmed, fans speculated that time travel might be a part of her whole schtick. Do Viola and Amy even know that they will share the same body, unless it’s written by PS into the story? And regarding gameplay, I believe that she’s another character that could be fairly easily edited if her style was really that negatively received but would that seriously be so necessary? Because in my opinion, she was no SC4 Hilde if you get what I mean. Secondly, Viola and Amy may share a body but not a weapon or moveset style over like 8-10 moves. Siegfried and Nightmare, though?
Yet Z.W.E.I. gets such positive feedback in comparison. Excuse me but it’s such a common thing to hear from conversations with friends to video DLC speculations now that it’s a bit frustrating, if just to me.
However, there's a lot arguing that this team might opt for more classic characters, as a tonal matter. That said, Hilde being released so early on the remaining continuing support really demonstrates how much of an emphasis they are willing to put on perceived fan favourites among the remaining characters. I'll put it this way: much as I've hoped for a completed classic roster and still think that is the most likely outcome here, I won't gripe if Viola is added: her moveset is truly unique and one of the more positive outcomes of the SCV roster experimentation.
Wait, Raphael was "dormant" during the 17 year hiatus? I thought he spent that time strengthening his assumption Lord Dumas' identity even as he succumbed to Soul Edge's influence and becomes the new Nightmare? Is that not basically the story? I wouldn't call that "stasis" as the term is usually used. It been your head cannon alone that Raphael is in SCV because he gets freed after his defeat (and apparent death) in the single player campaign of that game, well after he has already been twisted into the new Nightmare. But it's at least as likely that he is in the roster because he represents a pre-Nightmare-ified body or (even more likely) because he's part of a multiplayer cast and nobody cares about continuity for those purpose other than obsessive lore nerds. :)
Why? It's all made up magic--in a story where plot points about arcane forces always work in exactly the way they need to in order to make things easy on the writers of a meandering pulp-fantasy tale, no less. Why would it not be the case that the malfestation freezes Raphael's age at the "ideal" time, but also allows Amy to an adult before freezing hers, for the same purpose? For that matter, while Amy was clearly affected by Soul Edge's taint by the beginning of SCIV, same as Raphael, there's no indication that it is affecting her to the same extent / in exactly the same way. Anyway, just because vampires in certain works don't grow up if they are turned as a child doesn't mean the "vampire-like" Raphael and Amy must operate in the same way. For one thing, there is never any real indication that they are undead or anything like it, is there?
Maybe a little out of place in some respects, but nnot enough that we can rule it out with a high degree of certainty. At this point, given Amy's Soul Chronicle, I would say it remains a distinct possibility, although I agree it is not super likely. But Hilde's position in Season Two shakes thigns up a bit in this respect, I have to say. But regardless, I don't see how it could be deemed 'tacky' in either event. Tacked-on, maybe, but not tacky! ;)
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KALAFINA
[10] Knight
“Tacked-on” is certainly a term I wouldn’t be able to deny, as I also fully expect this to be a game of legendaries. Upon finishing Amy’s chronicle upon her release I’ve already accepted the fact that after Hilde, Setsuka and the minute chance of Viola, there won’t be any other characters to re-hype this game up for me XD (forgive me if I’m thirsty for Hwang/Yun-Seong and Rock in . . . other ways, but don’t give two shits if they make it into the game. An abomination of a thought process as a SC fan, yes, I know ^ ^’)
Rusted Blade
[14] Master
On a side note--and I really hate it when I get induced into speculating on this inane story, but here we go--I still think the way it makes most sense for Raphael and Amy's story to proceed from here (as we approach the period covered by the SCIV to SCV narratives in the original telling) is basically as follows:
- Raphael takes Soul Edge from Nightmare, as before, and it begins to corrupt both he and Amy.
- By the period of time that extends between the events of SCIV and SCV (or perhaps sped up in this iteration of the story) Raphael realizes he is losing his battle of wills with the sword and it is corrupting him through his own ambitions / desire to protect Amy, and she is suffering the consequences as well.
- One of Raphael's final acts of desperate independent will is to attempt to purify Amy and get her as far away from him as possible, possibly involving some sort of Faustian bargain with Azwel, and almost certainly the crystal ball that Viola is so inextricably bound too.
- This purification is successful: by all indications, Viola seems to be free of malfestation in SCV, or perhaps just had it suppressed to some extent: she does retain red eyes, afterall.
- But by consequence of the process, Amy loses her memory, and possibly becomes ever more the pawn in Azwel's machinations.
- Raphael, having done what he could, succumbs to Soul Edge completely and becomes a fully realized Nightmare, different from the previous one only in the slight twist that this version is willing to utilize some small bit of Raphael's Machiavellian intrigue to its ends, in addition the normal onslaught of violence and terror.
KALAFINA
[10] Knight
artard4321
[12] Conqueror
I was half serious about this post though lol. Have you ever played Monster Hunter? The Hunting Horn can seriously break the skulls of many large monsters out there. It ain't a joke weapon but it certainly could look pretty comical when you beat the living hell out of your opponent with an instrument.
I think the series could use a bard like character.
DanteSC3
[14] Master
Right. Raphael was “killed” during SoulCalibur IV and his body was put into storage for some time before Soul Edge took control of him some time later. This was confirmed by New Legends of Project Soul, in Nightmare’s profile. There is no doubt, knowing now what we do with SoulCalibur VI, combined with the information from back then, that Raphael used his influence as Graf Dumas to gain political power to manipulate others to serve his needs to gather souls for the sword, but that’s also not really news.
But no, it is not simply my head canon that Raphael in SoulCalibur V is the Raphael after he regained control of his body. That’s just the natural conclusion drawn from the few knowns we do have. New Legends of Project Soul, again, provides this information, in Raphael’s profile. He woke up, not knowing the past 17 years of his lifetime, only really knowing of Amy, and he begins his search for her. This is a combination of his being in stasis and then later manipulated by the sword, his true self not knowing of any of this. His in-game dialogue also reflects all of this.
There is no hard evidence of Raphael and Amy being true vampires, no, other than the fact that they were portrayed as such, and they would be relying on our (the audience’s) knowledge of how vampires generally work in order to draw natural conclusions as to their abilities and powers. Included in this is Raphael’s ability to convert thralls (Auguste, Jacqueline, and Marienbard), though we don’t exactly see how he does it, their appearances (well, the girls anyway, can’t really tell for Auguste due to his mask) adopt a ghoulish nature with sickly yellow eyes and more pronounced facial features with paler skin (and ridiculous breast jiggling augmentation, for some reason), so there’s something to be said about their nature. Unless they’re just really dedicated cosplayers, there is some kind of supernatural power at work here.
I would also argue that they are already affected in SoulCalibur III, with Raphael already exhibiting slight vampiric tendencies, this being the point where he first gets the “blood suck” command throw as well, and Amy’s inability to speak as the curse begins to take hold before she is “healed” or her body otherwise adapted to the toxin, whichever actually occurs.
Definitely tacky. Hilde exists and can interact in the pre-SoulCalibur II timeline. Viola cannot. She exists just as much as the kids do, which isn’t at all, aside from the premonition by Azwel’s crystal ball.
Just two, right. Three, counting the one from Tekken. But the First was the one from the start through SoulCalibur IV, and between it and SoulCalibur V, the Second assumed the blade and thus the name. Now we’re back to the First in SoulCalibur VI, though he’s already got the Fu-Ma Blade that originally only the Second had. It can be justified that the First is using it for the same purposes, to help seal the evil of the Yoshimitsu blade, a “retcon” if you must, but it’s really a budget/convenience gameplay element more than anything else, as we all know.
Rusted Blade
[14] Master
If to be likened to a food, more likely a pork chop with blue cheese left out three days in the sun..
Not to my taste. We are frankly full-up on goofy anime characters. Virtually every character added in the last 15 years 1) some ridiculous emo holding an even more absurd weapon in a still more nonsense fashion, 2) a wizard summoning weapons, spells, and familiars out of mid-air, 3) some purposefully comedic goofball, or 4) a needless remake of an already serviceable character. Hilde is the only truly new character since SCII who utilizes actual historical weapons, and even she uses them improbably / not really consistent to how either would have been historically wielded (I still adore her though). Anyway, back to the roots, I say, harvesting styles from actual historical weapons and characters from actual historical cultures rather than some anime-fantasy silliness--at least for a while. Of course, I don't think we get a new original SC character any time soon in any event.
Well, it would seem that most other people have interpreted his dazed and confused state to take place after being awakened but before being completely transformed into Nightmare, but I can't say as either makes a huge amount of sense to me. Bizarre that they didn't just have him slowly corrupted over that 17 year period: his showing up after 17 years asleep and re-assuming an identity that was stolen in the first place (one of significant political influence, apparently) all just seems a little unlikely to go off without a hitch. I guess the idea is that the malfested and then eventually "Graf" himself used intimidation and mass murder to keep the truth from escaping his sphere of influence, but still seems like a much more tortured way of arriving at the same plot point, if you ask me.
So the question instead becomes, where did Amy go after Raphael "dies"? Also, does Raphael die right at the climax of SCIV's events or the period before IV and V, do you know?
But...that's not what 'tacky' means: tacky is something done in poor taste, or suggesting uncouthness, if not outright bad character. It might be a peculiar choice, but I don't see how it would suggest poor taste or character. Anyway, there's no particularly strong reason why Amy can't transform sooner in this continuity: so we end up with an initially shorter Viola: no biggie. I still think it's not terribly likely, but...It's in the ballpark of things that could reasonably happen given recent outcomes in DLC content.
Actually, the implication is that there have been multiple Yoshis in Tekken as well, if memory serves--although Tekken's Yoshimitsu is a little more of an enigma in the finer details, I think.
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DanteSC3
[14] Master
This is an unknown thanks to Amy having lost her memories making the transition to Viola. Amy was told to stay home, as is always the case with Raphael’s stories, but it’s likely she still followed him anyway, as we see she’s doing for SoulCalibur II events as shown in SoulCalibur VI. The implication was that Raphael never came back, so if she did stay home, she would have left to go searching for him, and something would have happened to her in that timeframe to make her become Viola. That was the old interpretation of events. Now, what seems more likely to me is that she will be keeping an eye out, she will see Raphael be defeated, and make an attempt to burst in to save him, but will be thwarted by Azwel, who isn’t about to see his guinea pig test subject go to waste.
It isn’t clear how long he was “dead”, either, it was simply said his body was kept for use as a future vessel. It could have been less than a year, then sixteen years of Dumas acting in the shadows for all we know, because he wasn’t out ravaging the countryside in SoulCalibur V. Before Patroklos, he likely had several other pawns doing his dirty work.
But back to Amy, probably Azwel will capture her and force the crystal ball upon her, capturing her memories completely, and over the course of the inbetween of Raphael being “dead” and his becoming Nightmare, she will fully become Viola and cease to be Amy, and when that project is complete, so to speak, Azwel may be the one who sets her up with Z.W.E.I., who may be another of his puppets. But then attention goes back to Nightmare, as Dumas, who will, at some point, have Z.W.E.I. executed, which may actually free him from Azwel’s clutches, with the power of E I.N. awakening inside him, and then he may rescue Viola from Azwel and then make it his life goal to protect her, much as Raphael did for Amy in the past.
(I guess my overlong answer here indirectly addressed the rest of your post, helping address why I feel it would be in poor taste to prematurely bring Viola, among other things.)
Admittedly, I don’t follow the Tekken lore hardly at all, just bits and pieces. But our Yoshimitsu the First made several radical changes in appearance, so I wasn’t led to believe that there were more than one in Tekken, though it is possible, I don’t really know for sure.
artard4321
[12] Conqueror
But the series is technically "historical fantasy" not historical. It's why there is magic involved, albeit supposedly not over the top. Characters like Nightmare and Ivy wield weapons that aren't "historically accurate" and characters like Aeon and Astaroth are completely fictional beings. We even have an undead pirate in the mix too. I also don't even want to begin with Voldo's case.
Also, I find that Setsuka, who is a SoulCalibur III character, has a more "historically accurate" moveset than Mitsurugi; granted it feels more like something you would see in the Edo period rather than the Sengoku period. Zasalamel, who is using a Scythe which does exist, also makes more sense than Ivy who is using a weapon that can only be wielded through imagination. A lot of the character movesets aren't wielded historically accurate either since it is set in a historical fantasy setting. If you want something a lot more "historically accurate" then For Honor might be a more fitting game for you but even that one can get over the top here and there.
I do agree that I would rather want a more grounded character than something that's too over the top like Grøh, Azwel, Viola, Z.W.E.I., and Algol. I still want twin daggers, flail and shield, three-section staff, and chakram but even if they are added, I'm pretty sure they would disregard the historical accuracy of how the characters would wield it. In the end it also boils down to the character design too,
Like I also said, an instrument as a weapon can be no joke. If you actually see how a Hunting Horn is used in Monster Hunter then you might see where I'm coming from. Though it seems comical, it would be up what kind of character they make that wields it. A hidden blade is no joke but Dampierre is a very comical character.
FluffyQuack
[14] Master
I'm judging solely because on input lag. As far as I know, there's little to no difference between the native input latency in SC4 and SC5, which makes sense as they're both using the same engine on the same hardware. When playing online, just the simple act of pressing any button in SC4 feels sluggish compared to SC5. Any action feels extremely delayed.
It's a common belief that SC4 has a much worse netcode, so I don't think I'm making a crazy statement here. I've never done a proper comparison by filming button presses and the game at the same time, but I think anyone would have the ability to feel the difference of an input delay difference of 5+ frames.
You don't need an especially good connection for it to work well with fighting games. Most fighting games only send input between clients and that is an extremely low amount of data. I'm sure if someone were to test how much bandwidth SC4, 5, or 6 is sending it wouldn't even come close to using 0.1% of someone's bandwidth.
So there really are only 2 variables left connection-wise:
- Packet loss. It's possible someone is playing on a bad wi-fi connection or something else which would generate excessive packet loss, and this could result in a bad experience. But it results in a distinct type of bad experience. It would make the game pause or stutter intermittently, or make the input lag vary like crazy.
- Ping. This is the big one. But it's also something which is pretty much out of someone's control. This is all based on the physical distance between you and the opponent, and the ISP's ability to route your connection sensibly. The latter is pretty much out of your control, and I have no idea how much that's improved or worsened over the years.
If you ever get the chance to play SC4 online against the same person, and then SC5 or SC6 afterwards against the same person, I'll be very surprised if you don't notice a big difference.