docvizzo
[14] Master
Hey no problem at all. Its good you kept testing so we figured out whats wrong....we need more people like you who actually keep testing, just make sure you always test on different chars when in doubt :)
Alpha Patroklos Combo Discussion
- Thread starter BrewtusBibulus
- Start date
Hey no problem at all. Its good you kept testing so we figured out whats wrong....we need more people like you who actually keep testing, just make sure you always test on different chars when in doubt :)
CheeseOfTheDay
[10] Knight
About that 8A+BA:
I wrote about this mechanics time ago on sc.com. Doc probably didn't played Sets back then so he cant remember:P.
Basically there is no bug, or longer spin stun, or shakable stun. All of 8A+BA combos are based on hit boxes.
8A+B,A is a high move with high hitbox, with means it can miss even on standing opponent, it have also many active frames (at least 5 maybe 7) where first active frame is when Alpha have his sword on about 3 o'clock and last frame is when he have his sword on about 8 o'clock.
No most characters 8A+B,A will hit on first active frame (it's dependent on their hitbox) and it will be -3 on block and +13 on hit. This way nothing is guaranteed because fastest is btA 14i.
On Xiba first active frames of 8A+B,A in 90%* of time are too high for him. And the moment on hit occurs when Alpha sword is on 6 o'clock. If we count the frames we will see that active frame on this moment is a 3'rd active frame so now we should be at -1 on block and +15 on hit with gives BT B+K.
That combo works on everybody but everybody except Xiba and maybe someone else need to be hit with 8A+B,A during SS left.
The same mechanics are with 8A+B,A crossup that hits on 5'th frame and gives +17 so wsB is guaranteed.
In SC4 it was pretty much the same, A+K,A BTA was a combo on some characters, and was a combo on all, with some conditions. BT B+K wasn't guaranteed because it was 2 frames slower, but crossup wsB worked like charm.
*On 90% probably because characters even if they stay still, they are moving cause of animation of breathing, probably their hitboxes are moving a little with them.
I wrote about this mechanics time ago on sc.com. Doc probably didn't played Sets back then so he cant remember:P.
Basically there is no bug, or longer spin stun, or shakable stun. All of 8A+BA combos are based on hit boxes.
8A+B,A is a high move with high hitbox, with means it can miss even on standing opponent, it have also many active frames (at least 5 maybe 7) where first active frame is when Alpha have his sword on about 3 o'clock and last frame is when he have his sword on about 8 o'clock.
No most characters 8A+B,A will hit on first active frame (it's dependent on their hitbox) and it will be -3 on block and +13 on hit. This way nothing is guaranteed because fastest is btA 14i.
On Xiba first active frames of 8A+B,A in 90%* of time are too high for him. And the moment on hit occurs when Alpha sword is on 6 o'clock. If we count the frames we will see that active frame on this moment is a 3'rd active frame so now we should be at -1 on block and +15 on hit with gives BT B+K.
That combo works on everybody but everybody except Xiba and maybe someone else need to be hit with 8A+B,A during SS left.
The same mechanics are with 8A+B,A crossup that hits on 5'th frame and gives +17 so wsB is guaranteed.
In SC4 it was pretty much the same, A+K,A BTA was a combo on some characters, and was a combo on all, with some conditions. BT B+K wasn't guaranteed because it was 2 frames slower, but crossup wsB worked like charm.
*On 90% probably because characters even if they stay still, they are moving cause of animation of breathing, probably their hitboxes are moving a little with them.
docvizzo
[14] Master
Cheese spittin the knowledge! Thanks for clarification!
PSN-iiDRiiS
[10] Knight
can i use dis
CheeseOfTheDay
[10] Knight
like in battle or what xD?
Ring
Lay still now
So breathing is game breaking. Namco should patch this asap.
I see lobo is doing a great job moderating this section...
I see lobo is doing a great job moderating this section...
PSN-iiDRiiS
[10] Knight
Nah, was just gonna add it to the general strategy thread xD
PSN-iiDRiiS
[10] Knight
CheeseOfTheDay
[10] Knight
Sure, don't have to ask.
Interesting input trick that someone smarter than me may find a use for(although i think it's already somewhat known)-
Even though 2A BE doesn't lead to as much damage as we though, I still like ending my A+G throw's in it because, well, it's simple damage that i'm less likely to screw up. That said i've discovered something niffty-
The combo: A+G . 8A+B,B 2A BE
I used to just hit the 2ABE when the 8A+BB ended. This resulted in the occasional dropped combo through either input error or timing.
Then I realized that if you hold your commands in a certain order you can get it to come out on the first frame. This is tricky to explain through text so stick with me-
All of the following happens during the 8A+BB
Hold 2
Hold A
Hold whatever your BE button is(i'm on pad, not sure how this works on stick).
You'll get an instant 2A BE.
Now what's odd is that the order matters. If you do for example-
Hold A
Hold 2
Hold BE
You'll get an instant 2B+K(and it won't combo of course).
Or you can simplify it-
Hold 2
Hold A
Instant 2A that will combo
vs
Hold A
Hold 2
No attack, you'll just sidestep.
I'm not sure how useful this will be, especially for alpha pat since the bastard's got nothing but justframes, but someone might want to look into this for simplifying combos if it's not already common knowledge. If not maybe i should put this in general tactics as well since i have a feeling other characters are going to benefit a lot more.
Even though 2A BE doesn't lead to as much damage as we though, I still like ending my A+G throw's in it because, well, it's simple damage that i'm less likely to screw up. That said i've discovered something niffty-
The combo: A+G . 8A+B,B 2A BE
I used to just hit the 2ABE when the 8A+BB ended. This resulted in the occasional dropped combo through either input error or timing.
Then I realized that if you hold your commands in a certain order you can get it to come out on the first frame. This is tricky to explain through text so stick with me-
All of the following happens during the 8A+BB
Hold 2
Hold A
Hold whatever your BE button is(i'm on pad, not sure how this works on stick).
You'll get an instant 2A BE.
Now what's odd is that the order matters. If you do for example-
Hold A
Hold 2
Hold BE
You'll get an instant 2B+K(and it won't combo of course).
Or you can simplify it-
Hold 2
Hold A
Instant 2A that will combo
vs
Hold A
Hold 2
No attack, you'll just sidestep.
I'm not sure how useful this will be, especially for alpha pat since the bastard's got nothing but justframes, but someone might want to look into this for simplifying combos if it's not already common knowledge. If not maybe i should put this in general tactics as well since i have a feeling other characters are going to benefit a lot more.
1b:b, 1b:b, 2143b:b be, 8a+b,b, 2a be, 2143:aB - 121 dmg, 1 meter
i believe the 2nd 1b:b is shakeable. also, haven't tested to see if ce will connect at end of combo after jf twister.
not being a smart ass, just wondering if what is meant is a+g, 8a+b,b, jf umbrella
i believe the 2nd 1b:b is shakeable. also, haven't tested to see if ce will connect at end of combo after jf twister.
not being a smart ass, just wondering if what is meant is a+g, 8a+b,b, jf umbrella
PSN-iiDRiiS
[10] Knight
2nd 1b:B IF it hit it's shakeable
PSN-iiDRiiS
[10] Knight
When I do the second 1b:B the first one hits them and puts this in a neutral position and they are free to guard the second hit? Maybe I was doing it from a further distance let me check real quick.
Edit: Ok, so the second 1b:B does hit, but it doesn't stun the opponent. =/ I'm testing it on Algol.
Edit 2: Try this 1b:B, 3b:B, 8a+bb, 2a(be), if they tech foward 66b catches(and it's counted as a combo) for 147 damage, but the 66b doesn't lead to a knd, but back to a neutral stance...
PSN-iiDRiiS
[10] Knight
Yep, 1b:Bx2 doesn't work on Algol. I'm guessing it's character specific. Btw, look at that edit 2 in my above post and try it out, it seems like 66k catches forward techs.
Algol also seems to have weird properties because after I hit him with 8a+bb I'm BT like 90% of the time, but when I use it on Alpha I don't go into BT...
P.s. the 66b has to be delayed...