If there was a Soul Calibur VI, prequel/sequel/reboot/retcon?

DevilsDisguise said:
Im not talking about the characters themselves having experience. I'm talking about being the first of their kind. The new characters are replacements for the veterans not veterans for anything by themselves.
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That doesn't make them "veterans". Their appearances in the game do, as the term "veteran" is defined in video games.

Take Astaroth and Kilik, of example. Both were replacements when they debuted. Kilik may have some differences from Seong Mina, but yes, he was meant to replace her. Same can be said about Cassandra.

They are labeled as "veterans" now, and the replacements in SCV can't be in the future because, according to you, they aren't the first of their kind? The logic is backwards.
 
To be true, I don't expect Soul Calibur VI story give much canon to Soul Calibur V I don't know why people think will, Astaroth, Voldo, Z.W.E.I, Sophitia Soul Calibur and Soul Edge are destroyed. If I must guess next game will still be about Patroklos searching for his sister (Which I call Cassandra complex) Pyrrha becoming the new "Nightmare".
Basically the new story like a circle and the old will be vicious circle until Hilde children have enough age to fight and Namco renew the female rost because they can't see how old woman can look just fine.
Reinhilde.jpg
I want old ladies, even if they are from another game lol.
 
jtdam09 said:
That doesn't make them "veterans". Their appearances in the game do, as the term "veteran" is defined in video games.
Take Astaroth and Kilik, of example. Both were replacements when they debuted. Kilik may have some differences from Seong Mina, but yes, he was meant to replace her. Same can be said about Cassandra.
They are labeled as "veterans" now, and the replacements in SCV can't be in the future because, according to you, they aren't the first of their kind? The logic is backwards.
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Then it must be the timing into the series that makes the difference bigger. Astaroth and Kilik came in when the series was brnd new and most people came into the series when they were already there. Its not their fault I guess... but there must be something that seperates their inclusion from the other characters that makes it so much more drastic of a change. Maybe its timing and the extention of how long they were there while the series took popularity and making them recognizable.
 
DevilsDisguise said:
Then it must be the timing into the series that makes the difference bigger. Astaroth and Kilik came in when the series was brnd new and most people came into the series when they were already there. Its not their fault I guess... but there must be something that seperates their inclusion from the other characters that makes it so much more drastic of a change. Maybe its timing and the extention of how long they were there while the series took popularity and making them recognizable.
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Soul Edge is still the first Soul game of the series. If it wasn't for legal reasons, the title "Soul Edge" probably would have remained the same.

Namco was smart for creating a second sword to keep the series going, but either way, anyone can be named veterans. Even the replacements of SCV, once SCVI comes along.

Ramus said:
To be true, I don't expect Soul Calibur VI story give much canon to Soul Calibur V I don't know why people think will, Astaroth, Voldo, Z.W.E.I, Sophitia Soul Calibur and Soul Edge are destroyed. If I must guess next game will still be about Patroklos searching for his sister (Which I call Cassandra complex) Pyrrha becoming the new "Nightmare".
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I personally think the next installment could be exploring the backgrounds of the characters, and the states of the removed characters.
 
DevilsDisguise said:
Most balanced in the series? Thats a new one.
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That's the consensus. In this game no character is banned for balance issues (unless you count Viola on France) and most agree every character is viable (myself included). But God forbid if I talk about balance on casual forums...
DevilsDisguise said:
It would take no more time then it would when they did their research before creating their new characters the only contraint is just diversing the moveset, but likely it isnt the who cast they have to redesign. Just 5 at minimal, but if Namco wont let then have the fundimental time then I know where my blame goes.
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Redesigning movesets is not that easy. A lot of things come into play here, balance included. See the new characters Viola and Zwei, they're completely new movesets added to the game but not that well balanced. Same goes for Hilde, Algol and Amy on sc4... the history repeats itself, nearly every time a new style gets put into the game they need some balance tweaks. And it's not like games being rushed is something new to the gaming market or restricted to Namco. It just happens, sometimes unpredictably, and for diverse reasons.
 
jtdam09 said:
That doesn't make them "veterans". Their appearances in the game do, as the term "veteran" is defined in video games.

Take Astaroth and Kilik, of example. Both were replacements when they debuted. Kilik may have some differences from Seong Mina, but yes, he was meant to replace her. Same can be said about Cassandra.

They are labeled as "veterans" now, and the replacements in SCV can't be in the future because, according to you, they aren't the first of their kind? The logic is backwards.
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Also, Xianghua being superior to Hwang in SCI, Yun-seong replacing Hwang in SCII, Maxi replacing Li Long in SCI, Nightmare & Siegfried being similar in SCI. Siegfried was Nightmare's body at the time so it made since before both of their styles were differentiate more in SCIII & up, SCIV Amy superior to Rapheal before evolving into Viola. All of them are veterans as well.

jtdam09 said:
Soul Edge is still the first Soul game of the series. If it wasn't for legal reasons, the title "Soul Edge" probably would have remained the same.

Namco was smart for creating a second sword to keep the series going, but either way, anyone can be named veterans. Even the replacements of SCV, once SCVI comes along.

I personally think the next installment could be exploring the backgrounds of the characters, and the states of the removed characters.
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Agreed, give the replacements time to develop and the acknowledgement past characters. Leixia is starting to grow on me. I've never had this much fun since learning Setsuka for the first time in SCIII. Speaking of Setsuka, even if she doesn't come back in SCVI, I would be happy if a character like her took her place and had the great things I remember such as umbrella & 4A stunning on CH. That doesn't mean I'm going to accept A. Pat.
 
Delloso said:
That's the consensus. In this game no character is banned for balance issues (unless you count Viola on France) and most agree every character is viable (myself included). But God forbid if I talk about balance on casual forums...

Redesigning movesets is not that easy. A lot of things come into play here, balance included. See the new characters Viola and Zwei, they're completely new movesets added to the game but not that well balanced. Same goes for Hilde, Algol and Amy on sc4... the history repeats itself, nearly every time a new style gets put into the game they need some balance tweaks. And it's not like games being rushed is something new to the gaming market or restricted to Namco. It just happens, sometimes unpredictably, and for diverse reasons.
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The balancing of the franchise is interesting.

SCII - Great balance, but anti - stun & anti - wall combo. That was done to keep the balance in check.

SCIII - Stun combos & wall combo allowed, but the damage scaling was poor and it made characters who were we already really good OPed. Example - Xianghua was so OPed.

SCIV - Damage scaling was reduced too much. The breakable points on characters costumes was a gimmick to lower it.

SCV - The best balanced SC game since SCII.

I hope that SCVI continues to improve on the balance aspect.
 
Just curious idle, but what is your stance n why it was not balanced? I saw people do work with just about every character in the game. And the battles against the top tiers were manageable and not out of reach by any means. I have a hard time picking a top 5 from that game because so many characters were up there.
 
kAb said:
Just curious idle, but what is your stance n why it was not balanced? I saw people do work with just about every character in the game. And the battles against the top tiers were manageable and not out of reach by any means. I have a hard time picking a top 5 from that game because so many characters were up there.
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I measure a game into what it shakes down into. What most people remember about SC2, is nats and cannes, but the game kept evolving and people kept playing after that, too. So when people are like OH MAN THIS GUY BEAT PEOPLE WITH YUN ONE TIME, I roll my eyes, because the end of SC2 was X, Cass and the occasional Talim or Yoshi (who usually lost).

Once people figured out how to optimize the broken R/R structure of that game, it was a terrible fucking mess of boring. You do remember Rob and Mick steamrolling the shit out of everyone right? Because I do. People are like ARIS WON CANNES, and then what happened? The game evolved after that when people figured out Voldo was gimmicks.

If we are allowed to measure the games balance at anything but what it shakes down into at the end, it's a dishonest standard. I personally have a lot of love for pre-nats pre-stepg pre-2g SC2. The problem is, that isn't what the game shakes down into. Neither is the exploratory phase of the game rife with character ignorance.
 
IdleMind said:
I measure a game into what it shakes down into. What most people remember about SC2, is nats and cannes, but the game kept evolving and people kept playing after that, too. So when people are like OH MAN THIS GUY BEAT PEOPLE WITH YUN ONE TIME, I roll my eyes, because the end of SC2 was X, Cass and the occasional Talim or Yoshi (who usually lost).

Once people figured out how to optimize the broken R/R structure of that game, it was a terrible fucking mess of boring. You do remember Rob and Mick steamrolling the shit out of everyone right? Because I do. People are like ARIS WON CANNES, and then what happened? The game evolved after that when people figured out Voldo was gimmicks.

If we are allowed to measure the games balance at anything but what it shakes down into at the end, it's a dishonest standard. I personally have a lot of love for pre-nats pre-stepg pre-2g SC2. The problem is, that isn't what the game shakes down into. Neither is the exploratory phase of the game rife with character ignorance.
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While x and cass were certainly strong characters, I attribute rtd and mick beasting everyone to just sheer player dominance. I was around for the life of sc2 from arcade release all the way up to Evo 2k4 so i did see the change in meta you were talking about. I still see the list of viable characters and how they interacted as one of the better balanced versions of our beloved calibur.
 
Anybody want to discuss possible mechanics ? I know its the casual subforum, but i'll do it anyways. I feel they hit paydirt by applying the ol' super-meter system, which just means designing CEs, BEs, and meter gaining data for every single move. Has anyone ever complained about certain moves giving you (or the opponent) an unreasonable amount of edge meter? Seems project soul fixed the bug where Raphael gives the opponent 0.5 meter everytime he 66A+G's them, and so there were only a few more.

I'm not a fan of the jG system and the work they put into it (seemed like they put a lot of effort into it), with unique jG frames for everymove, and then the whole red/blue colour system we saw in the trailers.
 
WuHT said:
Anybody want to discuss possible mechanics ? I know its the casual subforum, but i'll do it anyways. I feel they hit paydirt by applying the ol' super-meter system, which just means designing CEs, BEs, and meter gaining data for every single move. Has anyone ever complained about certain moves giving you (or the opponent) an unreasonable amount of edge meter? Seems project soul fixed the bug where Raphael gives the opponent 0.5 meter everytime he 66A+G's them, and so there were only a few more.
I'm not a fan of the jG system and the work they put into it (seemed like they put a lot of effort into it), with unique jG frames for everymove, and then the whole red/blue colour system we saw in the trailers.
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Never liked the idea of SC using a meter system, it too me just throws away the very thing that made itself seperate from the rest of the typical fighting games out there. The idea of SC that it was trying to bring a realistic perspective with 3D visuals and 3D mobility giving the players less of a need to have a Super flashy finishing move while having more options to analize and map out their strategies like the older games were. Some of the new gameplay in Soulcalibur V smacks of “make it more like a Capcom game” and just seemed so unlike PS. I never took them as conformists until now. There was no magical comeback mechanic or desperation attacks, now the old games did have combos of course, but if you got swept up in them it was usually your own damn fault for not moving out of the way or parrying, which again has been amputated. I can think of no better example for out of hand this has gotten by it.
 
jtdam09 said:
Soul Edge is still the first Soul game of the series. If it wasn't for legal reasons, the title "Soul Edge" probably would have remained the same. Namco was smart for creating a second sword to keep the series going, but either way, anyone can be named veterans. Even the replacements of SCV, once SCVI comes along. I personally think the next installment could be exploring the backgrounds of the characters, and the states of the removed characters. Only in non-canon games they do. Canon games they don't, and I bet they STILL won't in Tekken 7. Being an "original addition" doesn't automatically make them a "veteran". Experience in an occupation, skill, and in this case, appearance does, as the term "veteran" is defined as. Even Hwang is a veteran and he borrowed moves from Mitsurugi. Ironically, not even an original design when he debuted. And once SCVI is released, Patroklos, Pyrrha, Leixia, Natsu, Xiba, ZWEI, Viola, Yoshimitsu II, and one of those Astaroth models will all be defined as "veterans". Less experienced than the older characters, but yes, veterans.
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Namco/Project Soul never really makes it even remotely clear which ending was the canon one, or if there even WAS one. So it's like "Teehee RESET!" each time a new game is released. Xiba is a sorry excuse of a character. They have Kilik in why did they have to add another one? Though the moveset diversity would be a debate at most the uused characters are more important to reconsider rather then continue to saturate the series with the the replacement of established characters Talim, Taki and Kilik for younger stand-ins who share the same move-set. They're clearly designed to appeal to a younger audience, but all come across as squeakily annoying junior versions of the originals changing the atmosphere of the story into a mess.
 
Ramus said:
Namco renew the female rost because they can't see how old woman can look just fine.
Reinhilde.jpg
I want old ladies, even if they are from another game lol.
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Yes! Give me back the following, regardless how old they are, Project Soul: Taki (46), Seong Mi-Na (40), Xianghua (37), Cassandra (38), Setsuka (41)and Talim (32). Women in their 30s and 40s look just as fine as their younger counterparts. I want them back in the game!
 
DevilsDisguise said:
Namco/Project Soul never really makes it even remotely clear which ending was the canon one, or if there even WAS one. So it's like "Teehee RESET!" each time a new game is released. Xiba is a sorry excuse of a character. They have Kilik in why did they have to add another one? Though the moveset diversity would be a debate at most the uused characters are more important to reconsider rather then continue to saturate the series with the the replacement of established characters Talim, Taki and Kilik for younger stand-ins who share the same move-set. They're clearly designed to appeal to a younger audience, but all come across as squeakily annoying junior versions of the originals changing the atmosphere of the story into a mess.
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It's called marketing.
I guess pointy boobs Taki, Bigger Boobs Ivy, No Pants/Meant to be a replacement Cassandra, and Korean Patroklos Yunseong weren't meant to appeal to audiences either.
 
I'm actually going to throw this out here because I've seen it drifting around the site for awhile...
Why not some kind of Tekken-Tagesque title? Like a game that involves all of the characters without a real need to have a story at all? Like Super Soul Calibur or something... I doubt they'd get the rights for the majority of guest characters again, but as far as original characters, it would prosper.
I've put a lot of thought into it. In my opinion, I think it would be great...
I'm not putting down the story by the way, I love it too...
 
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