Ivy Match-ups and Anti-Character strategies

Y

Yurimatsu

[08] Mercenary
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<<<edited by dittO & Ring>>>
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- The following table is an effort to determine Ivy match-ups in SCIV
- Online play or Special VS is NOT a factor to determine ANY match-up
- Anyone can post his/her opinion as long as it is followed by an explanation
- Do not hesitate to state your opinion, even If you have to disagree with someone else
- If you are not 100% certain about a particular match-up, you don't have to state your opinion
- If you have any experience VS certain characters played by advanced/skilled/well-known players, don't hesitate to mention it

10/0 = No chance for the opponent to win.
9/1 = 1 in 10 chance for the opponent to win.
8/2 = Heavily in Ivy's favor.
7/3 = In Ivy's favor.
6/4 = Slightly in Ivy's favor.
5/5 = Even matchup.
4/6 = Slightly in the opponent's favor.
3/7 = In the opponent's favor.
2/8 = Heavily in the opponent's favor.
1/9 = 1 in 10 chance for Ivy to win.
0/10 = No chance for Ivy to win.

(Taken from OOFMATIC's post as a reference)

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IVY VersuS (Ivy SA Match-up Chart) ===>
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- Algol: 5:5(Woahhzz)/5:5(Nofacekill3r)/4:6(mrcfkane)/4:6(Linkrkc)/4:6(Davo87)/4:6(Ring)/4:6(dittO)/4:6(Awestruck)
- Amy: 4:6(Woahhzz)/4:6(Linkrkc)/4:6(Ring)/4:6(Nofacekill3r)/4:6(Awestruck)/4:6(Scud)/4:6(Davo87)
- Astaroth: 6:4(malek)/6:4(Ring)/6:4(Linkrkc)/5:5(Nofacekill3r)/5:5(Woahhzz)/5:5(dittO)/5:5(Davo87)/5:5(Awestruck)/5:5(Sora)/5:5(Scud)
- Cassandra: 7:3(malek)/6:4(Nofacekill3r)5:5(Woahhzz)/5:5(Linkrkc)/5:5(Ring)/5:5(Davo87)/5:5(Awestruck)/5:5(Sora)/5:5(Scud)
- Cervantes: 5:5(Linkrkc)/5:5(malek)/5:5(Woahhzz)/5:5(Davo87)/5:5(Awestruck)/5:5(Scud)/4:6(Nofacekill3r)
- Darth Vader: 6:4(Linkrkc)/6:4(Davo87)/6:4(Woahhzz)/6:4(Awestruck)/5:5(Nofacekill3r)
- Hilde: 4:6(mrcfkane)/3:7(Linkrkc)/3:7(Ring)/3:7(Davo87)/3:7(malek)/3:7(Nofacekill3r)/3:7(Awestruck)/3:7(Sora)/2:8(Woahhzz)/2:8(Scud)
- Kilik: 7:3(IvyFanboy)/5:5(dittO)/5:5(Woahhzz)/5:5(Ring)/5:5(Awestruck)/5:5(Scud)/5:5(Nofacekill3r)/5:5(malek)
- Lizardman: 6:4(Davo87)/6:4(malek)/5:5(Linkrkc)/5:5(Woahhzz)/5:5(Ring)/5:5(Nofacekill3r)/5:5(Scud)/4:6(Awestruck)
- Maxi: 7:3(malek)/7:3(Nofacekill3r)/7:3(Davo87)/7:3(Awestruck)/6:4(Linkrkc)/6:4(Scud)/6:4(Ring)
- Mitsurugi: 6:4(malek)/6:4(Linkrkc)/6:4(Awestruck)/6:4(Scud)/5:5(Ring)/5:5(Woahhzz)/5:5(Davo87)/5:5(Nofacekill3r)
- Nightmare: 6:4(malek)/6:4(Ring)/6:4(Linkrkc)/6:4(Woahhzz)/6:4(Davo87)/6:4(Nofacekill3r)/6:4(Awestruck)/6:4(Scud)/6:4(dittO)
- Raphael: 6:4(malek)/6:4(Linkrkc)/6:4(Woahhzz)/6:4(Davo87)/6:4(Nofacekill3r)/6:4(Awestruck)/6:4(Scud)/6:4(Ring)
- Rock: 9:1(malek)/7:3(Awestruck)/7:3(Scud)/6:4(Ring)/6:4(Linkrkc)/6:4(Woahhzz)/6:4(Davo87)/6:4(Nofacekill3r)
- Seong Mi-na: 7:3(malek)/7:3(Davo87)/7:3(Ring)/7:3(Awestruck)/7:3(Scud)/7:3(Nofacekill3r)
- Setsuka: 5:5(Davo87)/5:5(mrcfkane)/5:5(Awestruck)/4:6(Scud)/4:6(Ring)/4:6(Nofacekill3r)/4:6(Woahhzz)/4:6(malek)
- Siegfried: 7:3(Awestruck)/6:4(malek)/6:4(Linkrkc)/6:4(Ring)/6:4(Scud)/6:4(Woahhzz)/5:5(Davo87)/5:5(Nofacekill3r)
- Sophitia: 4:6(Ring)/4:6(Linkrkc)/4:6(Woahhzz)/4:6(Nofacekill3r)/4:6(Awestruck)/4:6(Scud)/4:6(malek)
- Taki: 7:3(dittO)/7:3(Awestruck)/6:4(Linkrkc)/6:4(Woahhzz)/6:4(Nofacekill3r)/6:4(Scud)/5:5(malek)
- Talim: 7:3(malek)/7:3(dittO)/7:3(Awestruck)/7:3(Nofacekill3r)/6:4(Davo87)
- The Apprentice: 7:3(Davo87)/7:3(Awestruck)/6:4(Linkrkc)/6:4(Nofacekill3r/5:5(Woahhzz)
- Tira: 6:4(dittO)/6:4(mikosu)/6:4(malek)/6:4(Ring)/6:4(Nofacekill3r)/6:4(Davo87)/6:4(Awestruck)/6:4(Scud)
- Voldo: 5:5(mrcfkane)/4:6(malek)/4:6(dittO)/4:6(Linkrkc)/4:6(Ring)/4:6(Woahhzz)/4:6(Nofacekill3r)/4:6(Sora)/4:6(Scud)/3:7(Awestruck)
- Xianghua: 7:3(malek)/6:4(Scud)/6:4(Ring)/5:5(mrcfkane)/5:5(Linkrkc)/5:5(Woahhzz)/5:5(Davo87)/5:5(Awestruck)/5:5(Nofacekill3r)
- Yoda: 8:2(T_T)/8:2(Nofacekill3r)
- Yoshimitsu: 7:3(malek)/6:4(Ring)/6:4(Woahhzz)/5:5(Linkrkc)/5:5(Davo87)/5:5(Awestruck)/5:5(Scud)/5:5(Nofacekill3r)/4:6(Sora)
- Yun-Seong: 7:3(malek)/6:4(Davo87)/6:4(Nofacekill3r)/6:4(Awestruck)/6:4(Scud)/6:4(Ring)
- Zasalamel: 7:3(Davo87)/6:4(Nofacekill3r)/6:4(Woahhzz)/6:4(malek)/6:4(Awestruck)/6:4(Scud)

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IVY VersuS (Ivy SA current Match-up Chart) ===>
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- Algol: 4:6
- Amy: 4:6
- Astaroth: 5:5
- Cassandra: 5:5
- Cervantes: 5:5
- Darth Vader: 6:4
- Hilde: 3:7
- Kilik: 5:5
- Lizardman: 5:5
- Maxi: 7:3
- Mitsurugi: 6:4
- Nightmare: 6:4
- Raphael: 6:4
- Rock: 6:4
- Seong Mina: 7:3
- Setsuka: 4:6
- Siegfried: 6:4
- Sophitia: 4:6
- Taki: 6:4
- Talim: 7:3
- The Apprentice:6:4
- Tira: 6:4
- Voldo: 4:6
- Xianghua: 5:5
- Yoda: 8:2
- Yoshimitsu: 5:5
- Yun Seong: 6:4
- Zasalamel: 6:4

* Indicates up to which players' opinions have been included to the 2nd (current) Match-up Chart.
 
Ivy Vs. Mistu

There are two way (as usual) to play against Mitsu. My "arch-nemesis" is an avid Mitsu player. You can block and counter which in many cases is Ivy's strong point. Or you can surprise him and take the offensive, stepping his verts and impacting anything he tries to interrupt with. When he gets scared, CS. When he gets scared of CS and ducks SW 3A. Get one match with him on the run and he will be afraid to do anything. And if you want to show off, start jumping his lows, leaves you at advantage since you didn't block, AND he's fliping out because you're jumping his "best" moves. HA!

Edit: haha didn't really tell you anything did I? SW 1A+B will help you get on the offensive. SW FC 3B is a great move for mix up with SW WS A and CS. WP 1B will set up a nice little combo leaving you in CL or SW whichever you chose. CL WS AA is a nice mix up also CL A+B A (or A+K). Lots of options, don't limit yourself to what "seems safe" most of Ivy's best options aren't safe, but that's the fun of her. Also SW A+B, (A+B) is a wonderful UB with range both vert and Horiz, that you can't see flames charging on. And, SW 4K needs to be utilized in the right situations, as well as 214K I've gotten so many attack counters with 214K on a rushing opponent. It's not quite as deadly as when it was K2, but effective, non-the-less.

Other good moves... SW 44B_(B), SW 66A, CL 4(A), CL 214(B), WP 11A, CL A A+K,
CL 1B B+K, CL 236 B B, WP 44A_(A).
 
Ivy Vs. Mistu

Sadly for some reason i can't get SS/CS down in SC2/3 i could buffer either one in right after any attack even A,B, or K. in this one im about 2% exc. My biggest problem with mistu it for somereason i cant avoid his verts. His A+K tracks like noone's business and my roommate loves that move. If he does Kb close enough I cant step it. Not to mention 2K,B Is so hard to see coming.
 
Ivy Vs. Mistu

Yurimatsu said:
Sadly for some reason i can't get SS/CS down in SC2/3 i could buffer either one in right after any attack even A,B, or K. in this one im about 2% exc. My biggest problem with mistu it for somereason i cant avoid his verts. His A+K tracks like noone's business and my roommate loves that move. If he does Kb close enough I cant step it. Not to mention 2K,B Is so hard to see coming.
Click to expand...

Mistu is becoming my biggest problem next to Sophia. Any more general tips? I noticed low attacks seem to be the most effective weapon I've got. But his speed is crazy.
 
Ivy Vs. Mistu

I think the keyword here is patience...

IMO SC4 Ivy is never really meant to be a full rush down character. And no matter how rush down a character can get, Ivy WILL have tools to punish
 
Character matchup question: Hilde

So in trying to prepare for all possible opponents, I've really struggled in thinking on how to fight against a good Hilde. The thing is, Ivy as is does not have decent frame data and almost every good move she has leaves her at a disadvantage on block. Normally this can be worked around with, but given Hilde's charges and surprisingly good close range game, I would think this would leave Ivy that much more prone to getting hit.

Is this really just a natural disadvantage, or is this something that can be worked around with?
 
Character matchup question: Hilde

From my experience, SW 6 is safe enough to keep Hilde working for her damage. Hilde's Close game keepsher close enough for you to use it well enough. Add in 22_88B for a good Step move, and you should be able to dance around her. Just remember to step to her left... A LOT!
 
Character matchup question: Hilde

Thing is, a good Hilde player will not try to go for close combat. Rather to whiff punish with her combo of doom. Her C 2 A and C 3 B give good frames and pushback. Making sword in this matchup only ideal on wakeup rather than closing in.

From my experience, so far I fought 2 kinds of Hilde:
a) Turtle and step a LOT and whiff punish with charge combo of doom. Largely RO game based.
- WP pokes generally throws them off balance. Altho do becareful, most WP moves with the furthest reach are highs or slow lows. 4A, 6B, 66A, FC 3B, 1AA. Be wary that her charge attacks can reach better than most of Ivy's WP pokes. WP 3A is decent against Hilde, knowing she couldnt punish Ivy at such range.
b) Balanced mindset. Will occasionally charge in for throw mixup and pokes. Abuses her advantage off charge attacks in attempt to fish for charge combo.
- This is where a better focus of sword can be used to anti-pressure on Hilde who tries to come in for a poke. Do watchout for her C horizontals. Step left if u are really close. Jump back to WP whenever she tries to zone. Will post more.

note: A pad player with button macros like to throw more while charging. Where as the stick player who doesnt, throws less. Hilde have issues with CF bcos they need to release a charge button to execute CF. :)
 
Character matchup question: Hilde

Hmm, I wonder... how can we get around wiffing at range with Ivy? Hilde can basically skewer you if she steps back or to the side from one of our longest range attacks. I would recommend at the most, Mid range. MAKE SURE she WILL block you before you toss out an attack, or else you are about to eat a chunk of damage. AND BE AS SAFE AS YOU CAN! Thats the biggest thing. If you are Unsafe, she can and WILL punish you. (The main reason I recommend Sword Pressure. Whip is far below on frame advantage.)
 
Guys,
I'm having a lot of trouble with Siegfried lately
especially his WR AA
a lot of Siegfried players constantly spam that
and I always get hit because it comes out so fast online
To make matters worse, WR AA is cancelable and can chain to another WR AA
the first hit is a mid, the second is a low
if the first hits you, the second is gauranteed
My question is:
From Ivy's arsenal in each stance
How do I interrupt this move WRAA, or WRA[G] WRAA
How do I counter it?

So far I've only found WP 3A to be effective in stopping it
is the world so hopeless?
=(
 
Either don't play laggy matches online, or don't play online to avoid that problem.

WR AA is something like -20+ on block, so blocking and punishing works fine. The idea that if the first hit connects, the second is guaranteed is incorrect, as it only connects on CH or step counter. Take the character into training to figure out exactly what you can and cannot punish with.
 
ok, now I'm having trouble with astaroths
lol
I eat a ton of damage from...
1A,B and 1AA spamming
66K spamming,
I don't know why 66K spam is so fast online, even sword 6B and sword 1K wont stop it
I think it may have to do with the minus frames on block of a charged 66K
I'll have to check
you guys got any ideas how to avoid eating astaroth damage?
 
Not trying to sound like a prick, but either 1[A]B needs to be GI'd 95% of the time, or you need to jump it (it's definitely slow enough) and avoid the "mixup" altogether.

66[K] is usually positive by a few frames, so you're simply falling into a frame trap most of the time. 66K is also fairly negative (frame data lists it up as -10~-3, you can check these things yourself :P). SW 6B or 1KB can stop them from trying to repeatedly attack at a disadvantage, you just have to pay attention and interrupt appropriately. Remember, bullrush (66K) TC's, so careful with grab attempts and other highs.

Asta 6K is -14+ (I think it's more after the patch) so AA, or better yet SW 1A can punish. All the same spacing based on your current weapon style obviously applies here.

I still stand by my "don't play laggy online matches" to fix those shenanigans.
 
I will try jumping attacks more
and yea I just checked the frame stats of 66K vs. 66[K]
apparently the charged version gives astaroth a positive frame advantage on block! as you said I'll just guard the second hit.....unless I get grabbed. haha.
thanks felix, your comments are always welcome.

Oh!
have any of you guys played Saigoshinobi ..I think?
he has a very interesting Amy setup against ivy.
Basically amy's lilith parry stance is god against all mid...and all of ivy's punishes are mid
that and he breaks a ton of my CS/SS, up to 50%. That's pretty good.
 
Saigo is where I get most of my good matches, and we've played somewhere around 250 games together. Since I use Ivy in every single one of those, his anti-Ivy has gotten really solid. He'll often use the parry after fairly disadvantageous moves on block, such as 8WR A+B, 236BBBBBBB, and other moves with a lot of blockstun.

Countering it with a buffered CS/SS is really useful after you figure out where the buffer lock begins and ends. Either that or you can start 2K'ing him a lot and see if how he responds on CH (which you'll net often while he's using B+K). 2K is also an awesome buffer into a command throw as well, so you just need to stop him from WANTING to use that parry every time he gets.

He posts here, you can probably shoot him a PM.
 
Or you can just start talking about me lol. I'm apparently the driving force in Ivy vs. Amy research lol.

That pretty much sums it up though: Amy B+K B_K from disadvantage, and A+K lows sparingly after they have been conditioned away from mids...all while tapping A at super high speed; Felix has it right wrt how my Amy works. Feel free to PM me about stuff if you like.

p.s...iCS is evil. =P
 
From what it sounds like you dont have problems with characters perssay but the its the fact that you eat lows, lows which can be easily jumped or parried.

as for amy i found people who love her b+k parries i start using her 66B, i love that move, i play started playing a CF ivy where i spam all her heavy guage damage moves.
 
Shinobi said:
Or you can just start talking about me lol. I'm apparently the driving force in Ivy vs. Amy research lol.

That pretty much sums it up though: Amy B+K B_K from disadvantage, and A+K lows sparingly after they have been conditioned away from mids...all while tapping A at super high speed; Felix has it right wrt how my Amy works. Feel free to PM me about stuff if you like.

p.s...iCS is evil. =P
Click to expand...

iCS loves you.
 
Anyone having any issues vs lizardman?

His low stance mixups always give me trouble, and even in sw it doesn't seem like i have a fast enough move to get him to stand up. 2A doesn't cut it. 4K maybe?
 
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