Soul Calibur VI: General discussion
- Thread starter SSfox
- Start date
RyujiSakamoto
Premium Member
We also need to take into consideration that Season 2 is not going to happen.
genghis_chan
[13] Hero
dont assume its coming, just hope and ask let the devs know we want it.
RyujiSakamoto
Premium Member
if there is no Season Pass 2 then I will see you guys in 2026 for soul calibur 7
LisaK
[14] Master
and next Soul Calibur have only 15 characters + Guest + Boss, 5 stages (Chaos, O. castle, E. Shrine, K. Temple, Ship), 2P remains colors palettes, if you want arcade you need buy separately.
Rusted Blade
[14] Master
Unfortunately, a real possibility: I don't think that sales maintained at the level they were hoping for with regard to the base game after the first six months. You have to think that they would have already put some resources into the second season by this point, but larger corporations are good at using projections to determine when to cut their losses and not throw good money after bad, so even if they were well into early development for the content, it's still possible they would choose drop the effort altogether. Indeed, I think that's exactly the reason that they chose to hint at the second season with the fake data leaks--so that they would not face fanbasese recriminations if they decided not to go ahead with it.
Mind you, I'm still cautiously optimistic, if for no other reason than I think Namco has a vested interest in setting up a sales model where they can sell their fighters in pieces, so as to get around the limitations of the base game price point; I think they probably don't need season 2 to make a huge profit in order for it to be worthwhile for them in the long run. But if season 1 ends up being all we get for this game, then SCVI is going to be a bit of a flop for me as a whole. As Lisa is alluding to immediately above, there's just not enough meat on the bones for this game (not with regard to the kind of content non-casual players expect to be well-developed, anyway) if there's going to be no further post-release development.
RyujiSakamoto
Premium Member
If Cassandra is the final DLC character ever for SCVI, then Soul Calibur V will have had a better roster....
Starringrole
[09] Warrior
In general, I'm actually very optimistic about season 2 or at the very least a planned sequel.
As far as they should concerned, SC6 should have proved the series was salvageable, I think Season 2 is just exactly the way to milk any final profits out of the entry before they move to the next at the very least. If they decide not to I'm fairly confident a sequel is in the mix.
Unlike Amy and Cassandra who have similar weapons Season 2 will have completely different weapons for the fighters and it will also attract people who enjoy CAS back. People who liked those fighting styles will also return with a smile or just to see new characters.
If you asked me, a big problem with Season 1 is it just feels like the base game. It doesn't feel like DLC with the exception of 2B that is who should have probably have been Hwang or Lizardman.
I mean I personally enjoyed Season 1 to be fair purely because of Amy, but its even lacking males, something which I'm sure another part of the fan base would have liked to have seen. The males have received no new hairstyles either.
My point really just is, I think they wouldn't be very oppertunistic if they dropped Season 2. I think Season 3 could more of a "lolno" but Season 2 seems really fine to me.
Daiyan
[09] Warrior
hard disagree
DanteSC3
[14] Master
-Patroklos
-Pyrrha
-Patsuka
-Angry Pyrrha
-Leixia
-Natsu
-Xiba
-Viola
-Z.W.E.I.
-Algol
-Dampierre
-Hilde
-Edge Master
-Boy Edge Master formerly known as Kilik
-Girl Edge Master formerly known as Sophitia
-Kratos
-Ezio
+Cassandra
+Sophitia
+Inferno
+Xianghua
+Taki
+Kilik
+Amy
+Grøh
+Azwel
+Seong Mi-na
+Talim
+Zasalamel
+Geralt
+2B
I really don’t agree with your assessment. It would be nice to have Hwang, Lizardman, Setsuka, Hilde, and Yun-seong back. It would even be nice to have Edge Master back, and I’d even be happy to see Rock and Li Long back. And if we got season two, we’d get all but two of those back. Then it would definitely be better, without a shadow of a doubt. But I would still say it’s already better with just season one.
T.Rex
[14] Master
Hilde >>>> SC6 Roster
Rusted Blade
[14] Master
I think he may have meant in terms of numbers and variety, more than anything. If we exclude the mimics, SCV had 27 characters/movesets. SCVI had 22 characters at launch (if we include Inferno), plus four in season 1, for 26 total if there is no season 2.
Well, for a certainty, I hope their figures do support a season 2. But I gotta be realistic about one point: if season 2 gets cancelled, that's extremely bad news for the timing of SCVII, not good news. DLC content actually turns them a much higher profit, relative to production costs, than a new game does. So the only possible explanation if they cancel season 2 is that they are shelving the IP again for a while, not that they are leaping into SCVII right away. For one thing, SC games alternate with their other big name 3D fighter, Tekken, and there's no sign the next game in that (much more profitable) series is even headed into production any time soon; they are still working on post release content for the last Tekken game.
Furthermore, for the entire 25 year history of the Soucalibur franchise, every single game has taken a little longer than the previous one to be released. With production costs and timelines up across the industry these days, and the fact that PS's staff are put together on an ad-hoc basis from members of other in-house teams, don't expect that to change this time around. Best case scenario, SCVII comes out five years after SCVI dropped. Best case. And if it turns out that SCVI wasn't pulling figures that were worth them trying to cash in on a second season pass, that's not going to be indication that they are leaping to spend more money on a game that is 1/5th as profitable as Tekken--it's a sign that Soulcalibur is likely to be put into deep freeze again for a few years.
Now personally, I think they will go forward with season 2--or at least I am hopeful they will. As I said before, it makes a lot of sense for Namco to push hard on serialized content right now: its a way out of the profitability box they have been stuck in with their fighters for ages, and I don't think SC needs to pull huge figures in order for it to make sense for them to invest in a second season pass, if it gets their consumers just that much more accepting of the serialized sales model. But bluntly, if season 2 gets cancelled, that means that the sales for SCVI took a real nosedive in the last six months and in no universe is that a good sign for the franchise. It would be really, really bad news not just for SCVI but also for the timing of SCVII.
lol @ "Angry Pyrrha" and "Patsuka". Kratos=Aeon?
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Starringrole
[09] Warrior
I'm not expecting it to be quick but I think its a safe bet that the next one would be in planning. Season 2 being cancelled doesn't worry me at all for the future at least.
Soulcalibur 6 has its own inherent problems which the fans have made apparent that they despise.
-Guard impact
-Reversal Edge
-Soul Charge
-Stages
-CAS
-Missing modes
-Netcode
-Hitbox problems
-2P's
These are all pretty core to the game and its no surprise if they thought something along the lines of "If we're going to fix this they're going to pay us again". They're definitely not going to make SC6 a whole new game again and fixing some of these things would really much better be put towards the next games. SC6 hit fans in a lot of ways they didn't like even if I do like it myself though I am pretty much a traditionalist with this series.
Why add stages when they can just sell us off a new game full price and just make pretty new 1P's and 2P's for the main characters and fix the stages problem in the progress? Allocating more budget to SC6's base game will not be profitable, working on a new game with a better budget and showing the fans everything's been sorted will. Out of goodwill they might try and touch up SC6 that's the truth, but I highly doubt beyond balance and hitboxes they'll do much other than the DLC and perhaps one or two stages. (Which why I'm insistent on them just porting stages)
Yet again, SC6 is really only proof of salvaging the series, if they considered it anything more then they're aren't being very bright.
That's why I think SC7 is very much a possibility if Season 2 was cancelled, I think it can act as a very good indicator. I will however say, I don't know what it means for the time it will take. That very much could be a while.
But I think Season 2's cancellation is honestly fairly hopeful for the future of the series regardless. SC7 I imagine would get destroyed by being shafted to finish other projects or some other development hell, but if those were not to occur I remain confident.
I have no doubt that Season 2 being cancelled would piss people off though and ruin hopes for SC6 getting better.
Hell it makes even more sense to me since Soulcalibur 2 (the next game technically speaking) could an attempt at being even more promotional since its a remake in some capacity with deviations. Just seems like they intentionally set themselves up to take advantage of something like this.
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DanteSC3
[14] Master
Guard Impact? That's one of the things that they got right! It's still not as it once was, as it should be, with both forward and backwards as well as high and low variants, but it doesn't cost meter, and after breaking it, they fixed it again, and now it rewards guard gauge when performed successfully and punishes you for failing to perform. Regardless, it's still infinitely better than SoulCalibur V's system, costing your meter.
Starringrole
[09] Warrior
I meant as in some people hate the lack of high/low etc for them. Everyone is happy it left the terrible SC5 system behind though, not debating that.
On a personal note with how convoluted things are in SC6 I'm actually glad with GI's being simplified if only for this entry. I'm not averse to sticking to it either, but other people didn't like the lack of high and low variants which I'm fine to see coming back.
I doubt they'd implement that in SC6 I mean!
RyujiSakamoto
Premium Member
I will happily be proven wrong If Okubo announces cas July 21 or whenever the japanese thing is. Please pray that I am wrong.
But Cassandra being the last character is beyond terrible. These DLC characters should have been in the base game. This whole year has felt like a beta test. Nothing feels concrete or final.
If they announce Season 2 they can massage the problems and show confidence in the direction of the game. As of now it seems like they don't know how to address issues with the game or how to balance things.
But Cassandra being the last character is beyond terrible. These DLC characters should have been in the base game. This whole year has felt like a beta test. Nothing feels concrete or final.
If they announce Season 2 they can massage the problems and show confidence in the direction of the game. As of now it seems like they don't know how to address issues with the game or how to balance things.
Crash X
[14] Master
The same can’t be said for the input buffering unfortunately. It’s gotten worse compared to how it was in the previous games.
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Rusted Blade
[14] Master
Actually that's precisely the opposite of what they are trying to do. I know that sounds counter-intuitve, but let me explain. For years now, the game development industry has been facing a problem: production costs have sky-rocketed, but the most they can charge for a base game has been frozen at roughly sixty dollars USD (with some regional variation) for more than two decades. In fact, its actually much less than that in most cases, because in order to stay ahead of a saturated market, publishers have to begin selling their games at cut sales prices very early in their sales life, unless they are blockbuster AAA game; they actually compete to be allowed to participate in the major sales events on the digital marketplaces. That has made turning a profit more and more conditional on large numbers of sales, to overcome the price-point to production cost mix-match. For games in genres that have been in decline for a long while (and there's few genres that have declined more in relative popularity than the fighter genre) that has been incredibly difficult to do, and the profit margin for some games has become paper thin.
Serialized content offers companies like Namco a work-around for this problem with regard to their fighters. They want to be able to sell a base game at the standard $60 pricepoint, cut to sales prices when necessary, and then be able to sell a series of season passes that are MUCH, MUCH more profitable, relative to their costs. Look at the math here: for the base SCVI game, they have produce 22 movesets, models, animations, and all of the many other assets necessary to create each character. 22 of them. That's after they created the base engine, created a dozen stages, scored the game, developed the menus, the multiplayer, including the netcode and matchmaking, and two massive story modes with dozens of hours of art assets, plus the CaS editor and hundreds and hundreds of base assets for it. And I've only barely scratched the surface--I could write seven paragraphs here and we'd still only be doing an overview of production costs. Now, look at what they have to create for a season pass: 4 characters, 1 stage, and a couple hundred CaS pieces. And they can easily get away with charging $20 for it. 1/3 the price of the base game for 1/25 (at most) of the work/production costs of the base game. That represents a much better profit margin--they would definitely, definitely, prefer to sell as many season passes as is feasible before making another base game, which is where they're barely making any money.
The main problem they have is that game industry consumers are really picky and kinda entitled these days. More than that, they have their backs up because of the shady sales strategies some publishers were trying to force on us collectively in recent years. But people are finally starting to accept that if we want fuller and more polished experiences with our fighters, we are going to have to pay a little more. So season passes are starting to gain acceptance. And if Namco can get people on board with that new sales model for all of their fighters, its probably worth them developing an extra season pass for SCVI even if its sales have fallen off precipitously in the second half of its first year on the market (and I suspect that may very well be what has happened). But if sales are not good enough to make selling season 2 worthwhile, even with the collateral advantage of conditioning their consumers towards a purchase model they want to advance, then those sales were really, really bad. And if it would be too painful a pill to swallow to make another season pass, it would probably be completely unfeasible to consider another sequel any time soon. Especially given all indications are that, in the company culture at Namco, Soulcalibur is kind of the red headed stepchild of their fighters.
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DanteSC3
[14] Master
This isn't necessarily indicative of anything. They did that same trailer focus two-point gag on every character, even Hilde and Siegfried... even Amy. It just gets accentuated with Cassandra because of her natural bouncy stance and her outfit, so if it's getting any extra effect, that would be why.
(I guess I missed this originally because it was the last one on the last page, just now seeing this if you're wondering why the late reply.)
I don't think anyone really disagrees that they should have been in the base game. Hwang and Lizardman should also have been in the base game, and even 2B, since they had secured her rights back in January after the game was announced in December. The season pass being Rock, Li Long, Yun-seong, and Setsuka would have been far better, in a "fair" situation for the game to be in, but that's just not the reality that we're in. If we do get there with season two, however, what would your thoughts be?
Starringrole
[09] Warrior
To be clear, I'm not disagreeing with anything you have said here, with the exception of one thing.
Development costs being massive don't matter entirely at least if we take the assumption SC6 will be used as a base literally speaking (UE4 included), they can practically forward directly this game as the next in a technical sense. Season 2 could be put in the "sequel".
Production costs for SC6 were already WAY smaller than they should have been, they'd be more free to put more into the next since it would practically be an edit in some capacity. They have the freedom of selling a whole game and DLC at a yet again enhanced base. Though it may be more problematic if we consider members of the team to be fair.
My long term point being they aren't going to gain a profit or even satisfy consumers if stages for example were put in as DLC, because people would have to pay for stages which is kind of moot, 2B gained exception as a guest and if stages were pay for they would probably be in rotation far less often thus also coming back to being pointless, if they really approached it openly then it'd be fine, but I doubt they would.
Then we just continue with the inherent problems that people have with this game too.
I'm not denying Season 2 being profitable, that was far from my point, I was saying it was perfect to milk actually. But I mean considering the rest of the problems and circumstances, it being cut wouldn't be a terrible sign either, it was sort of linked to my point regarding Season 3 being a big "lolno" because they would have less to provide at that point and the game already has its own things people despise thus making less popular.
A sequel milking these aspects could milk even further with a Season pass because it has an even better base. I mean take a look, Tekken 7 hasn't added stages (to my knowledge) since home release besides reskins?
Not that Tekken 7 is a bad base, but my point is they've stuck to the same entry and it doesn't suffer from as many strong problems as SC6 that the fan base take issue with. With SC6 having a worse base, I just imagine the chances of milking too far could also fail in their eyes thus yet again profit off of a sequel that they can milk better. Season 2's cancellation can be them planning into this or they can do both.
Assuming they left UE4, then yeah sticking with SC6 is infinitely the better choice when it comes to costs and my point is well... Pointless. A cancellation under that knowledge would mean SC7 and the future is bleak, I suppose I'm being rather presumptuous assuming the UE4 base would be kept?
But regardless, I'm not really disagreeing (Unless I've been a potential moron and missed a different point entirely).