- Moderator
- #181
Maxi Post Patch Discussion
- Thread starter Hot Rod Dave
- Start date
- Thread starter
- #182
Hot Rod Dave
"Saucy saucy minx"
LOL....yeah that bitch is broken.
I found it interesting cause NCR WAS running the patch as to where MLG WAS NOT!! hmmmmmm
Granted I dont think there were any maxi players there aside from KDZ and I dont think he even used maxi at all!! Might be wrong cause I couldnt really watch the stream from my iphone. But I searched a little and I dont think he did!!
Uber1337
[10] Knight
Who placed top 3 with Maxi?
KDZ did play Maxi at MLG, but was eliminated by S-U in a Maxi mirror match. To be fair, at NCR, Krayzie and I were pretty much the only Maxi players. Krayzie was eliminated by some new viola technology in pools, but If he had made it to final 8, i'm sure he would have made some noise. I was sitting right outside final 8, tied for 9th. Maxi still has some stuff left.
KDZ did play Maxi at MLG, but was eliminated by S-U in a Maxi mirror match. To be fair, at NCR, Krayzie and I were pretty much the only Maxi players. Krayzie was eliminated by some new viola technology in pools, but If he had made it to final 8, i'm sure he would have made some noise. I was sitting right outside final 8, tied for 9th. Maxi still has some stuff left.
spyder
[08] Mercenary
We've just gotta play a ill bit harder or i would say longer to win. The nerfs just lengthen the play time, technically we should just understand the nerfs that would result in whiffs. That should help with survival.
The mixups are still there though limited. Zoning should still work, though I suck at attacking when I get the chance to post opponent whiff. Anti-character strat is a must. Hopefully someone can start something.
Overall I'm still having fun with maxi, post patch.
Btw, 11_77A rings out on clean hit (forgot if its to the left or right of maxi). Not sure if this is mentioned before.
The mixups are still there though limited. Zoning should still work, though I suck at attacking when I get the chance to post opponent whiff. Anti-character strat is a must. Hopefully someone can start something.
Overall I'm still having fun with maxi, post patch.
Btw, 11_77A rings out on clean hit (forgot if its to the left or right of maxi). Not sure if this is mentioned before.
Are there any vids anywhere? I saw some of Soakrates. He was not on top of his game that day, though.
Speaking of Viola, I really don't know why they buffed her. She was already placing in top 8 in most tournaments pre-patch.
Uber1337
[10] Knight
oh right, forgot about Soakrates. Im not sure if any vids were recorded. The stream was set up on Capcom games when me and Krayzie were playing.
TerribleGhost
[09] Warrior
That may be so, but they sure shortened it for Viola. Just because the game takes longer to beat doesn't mean Maxi's more fun because of it. To me that just smells of justification for what they did to Maxi. I think he was hit too hard, other characters were mostly let off the hook or made way too good, and the game is less balanced after the patch than it was before.
If I played this game for the sake of playing this game, and not for the sake of playing as Maxi, I'd have stopped using him. At this point, unless they patch the game and fix the mistake, I'm not sure how much longer I'll keep playing; I feel like they've almost killed the game for me.
KrayzieCD
[11] Champion
With this patch I feel like it's almost useless to use LI A brave edge at the end of combos anymore, does like no damage. Only use is for ring outs. Need to start figuring out some CE setups now, since Maxi's former best BE does shit for damage now. It's like they took Maxi's damage away and gave it to Viola. I might end up being like everyone else and just start playing Mitsu lol. The only good thing about the patch is that with the backdash nerf it's a lot easier to chase someone down with 66B, just too bad the move is still unsafe as all shit.
Fhwoarang
[09] Warrior
Are you sure about this?
hotnikkelz
johNNy blaZe
Heh, I've been using 6A+B BE to LO B into wakes. LO B gives a shitload of ground adv. Stuff like RC B and RC K have to be blocked. From there i mix my options accordingly. LI A combos got hit really hard indeed :)
Saitoh
[10] Knight
It might be the best option right now, that's true but it's still sad. I still think Maxi needed the damage 'cause that's the only way to make them respect the stance game. Backdash~G nerf is his only true buff, and a rather big one, that's true !
But I think in the end it wont be enough to make him REALLY competitive. The top tier will prevail if this was the last (and first) balance patch.
I mean, do you really think Maxi can best an Alpha player who got his combos down ? And not the ridiculously hard one, just the "basic" stuff. The same with Viola and I could go on.
And that's just the beginning. 95% of the people I played against with Maxi before couldnt figure the stances haha. But if the others top players actually start to really learn him and his holes, that's pretty much it.
I dunno, 1B RO A is kind of a staple poke and Alpha can do shit like 2143A+B to kill it badly with a combo from 90 up to 120 depending on his skill. That's just one example but you Maxi players know what I'm talking about. Sure there's always a solution that can prevent it but it generally sucks, especially since the WL nerf.
From there, you'll be forced to play a 6A+B based game and frankly, that's not enough. Especially now with the damage nerf.
Neo_Remirez
[09] Warrior
My Maxi strat still works, but honestly non of this would be an issue if they allowed you to insta switch stances with 4/6/2/8 commands. Like if I was in LO I could press like 6A and instantly do LI A, would make Maxi have mind games and actually increase his combo pool and fix this rape that has happened to him. That was just one example, its not over powered but it would fix his HUGE holes and give people a reason to be scared of him instead of being like Sidestep and Maxi can't touch me! Canceling stance is like "HERE PUNCH MY FACE!" Although I will probably hear people bitch about being able to quick stance change would be over powered, but if no one is gonna play maxi, obviously he needs something... I loved SCIV WL BTW
Rekano
:O
When the patch notes were released, I was furious about the damage nerfs. For that underlined reason. In fact. I'm still displeased with them. I really hope this isn't the last balance patch and that things don't get any worse for this character.
- Moderator
- #194
Belial
King of Hundred Swords
Backdash~G seem to be a buff for nearly everyone, Maxi didnt have spacing troubles in the first place, why its a huge buff?
Why would anyone use 1BROA anyway?
1B RO B to stop attacks, 1B psl6 to mixup.
Anyway, aPat is probably impossible to master into appropriate execution level, and JGing is pretty easy so dont get hit by A-grab too much and react to 66B if ducking - you should be fine.
All this PATHETIC whine is so annoying. "Nooo move A no longer does X damage I quit/switch char/game" wtf. This patch havent even changed much. Some move damage got worse ok, but your main game plan remain mostly unchanged, your loops still work, your damage is STILL GOOD (not ridiculous as before: "Maxi damage")
Saitoh
[10] Knight
You obviously didnt played Maxi against good backdashing characters.
Why would you use 1B RO A ? You're serious ?
1) RO B trade with i14 after 1B, and is beat by i13 and faster. It's also easy to step it, then do a fast mid like Maxi's 6A+B to interrupt any BL mixups. Step then attack kills that great gameplan you're offering to us. You need RO A to deals with those options.
2) RO AK is a nice NC and can !w for good damage. Can also lead to good mindgame with BL / semi-charged K etc.
3) RO B is unsafe as hell anyway, that's very risky for a STFU-move. Hence the need for DAMAGE. The whole risk/reward pattern you know.
aPat is possible to master to a certain degree. 2143A+B, 2363B, JFO JFO is very doable. I'll let you check the damage for this "impossible to master" combo. Also, are you telling us to react to an i19 mid ? haha
Trying to boss around every SA, are you ? It's quite easy to try and act all mighty when you play a top4 character that was left barely touched by the patch, when some characters got butchered.
Test your stuff more, stop spreading bullshit here and focus on your own character. Thank you !
- Moderator
- #196
Belial
King of Hundred Swords
So salty...
Im playing Maxi since the beginning, I took him as early as I did Mitsu. And I play a lot against aPat with him. I also play vs Maxi on daily basis, so I figured I would know.
Well Im sorry I dont base my game around getting my moves blocked, maybe that's why. If its blocked I only try to minimize damage. And doing 1BA on block will ... The whole risk/reward pattern you know.
Now suddenly BL mixup is nice even after 1BA blocked, and RO B is shit on block. Wow.
Do I have to tell you that
a) after blocking RO A~BL mixup is interruptible (and easy to anicipate)
b) Both parts of BL mixup are punishable by most chars very badly.
Im not saying its bad, but imo forcing a mixup with RO B is way better RR than with RO AK.
Saitoh, friend, Im not trying to boss around. I play many characters, Im learning all characters and spend a lot of time in practice with them, that's why I post in many arenas.
Im playing Maxi since the beginning, I took him as early as I did Mitsu. And I play a lot against aPat with him. I also play vs Maxi on daily basis, so I figured I would know.
Well Im sorry I dont base my game around getting my moves blocked, maybe that's why. If its blocked I only try to minimize damage. And doing 1BA on block will ... The whole risk/reward pattern you know.
Now suddenly BL mixup is nice even after 1BA blocked, and RO B is shit on block. Wow.
Do I have to tell you that
a) after blocking RO A~BL mixup is interruptible (and easy to anicipate)
b) Both parts of BL mixup are punishable by most chars very badly.
Im not saying its bad, but imo forcing a mixup with RO B is way better RR than with RO AK.
Saitoh, friend, Im not trying to boss around. I play many characters, Im learning all characters and spend a lot of time in practice with them, that's why I post in many arenas.
Saitoh
[10] Knight
Of course BL mixups are easier to setup after a blocked RO A than through looping after 1B, due to the immediate threat of the K part. That's so obvious I cant believe you're trying to argue about this. And I dont see why you're telling me that BL mixups are very risky. I know that and you're the one that talked about those mixups in the first place like they're the solution to 1B issues.
And now you're telling me to play Maxi's game only on hit ?
How I see things :
You got caught and you're trying to argue your way out of this.
My advice :
Take the hit and be a better man. Stop acting like an ass toward people when you're wrong.
And now you're telling me to play Maxi's game only on hit ?
How I see things :
You got caught and you're trying to argue your way out of this.
My advice :
Take the hit and be a better man. Stop acting like an ass toward people when you're wrong.
Uber1337
[10] Knight
First of all, I don't know how you can possibly say that Maxi doesn't have a problem with spacing. Backstep is always a constant issue that you need to watch out for. Some characters, like your overpowered-ass Mitsu, can pretty much backdash away from 90% of Maxi's movelist after having his 2A blocked point-blank. In order to discourage constant backdash, Maxi has to throw out unsafe moves like 66B (which lost a lot of damage in the patch).
RO B definitely is pretty bad on block. It is launcher punishable. You have a few guesses that can get you out of heavier punishment, but with the WL nerf, the reward on that guess is not so great. I really don't see how you can seriously not use 1BA. Its a counter hit combo and it leads to mix-ups on block. It also checks off steppers, since both RO B and RO K are steppable. Seriously, if you use 1B and don't use RO A at all, your Maxi is probably horrible.
Overall, i don't think the nerf totally killed Maxi. A lot of the other good characters got noticeably nerfed as well, so he's still probably on the upper end of mid-tier. Its just those few top tier characters that screw his game up....... especially overpowered-ass Mitsurugi. I seriously think this game is less balanced now than it was before. The difference between the top5 and the rest is greater than ever. Outside of the top 5 though, the game seems pretty balanced.
JAGTHEGEMINI
[12] Conqueror
Wow, interesting discussion here.
First i have to agree with KrayzieCD. LIA BE is just not really worth it anymore. In fact, i am having trouble to gain meter-energy when i play a stile revolviong around 6A+B/6A+B BE. It seems to me that Maxi is just getting less meter-energie than other characters...!? It must be because of the poke damage he often does that won´t give you shit until the enemy just won´t block Maxi´s strings.
And spacing is imo still a problem for Maxi in this game. 22/88A is too slow, 6A(while being really good now after the patch) is still a high, 66A is a high, 66K is a high( still -2 :/), 66B is unbelievable unsafe(i never use that move until i guard burst the opponent) and 44B and 66B+K are a little slow too...
Maxi is mid-tier atm for me. His damage still "safes" him.
First i have to agree with KrayzieCD. LIA BE is just not really worth it anymore. In fact, i am having trouble to gain meter-energy when i play a stile revolviong around 6A+B/6A+B BE. It seems to me that Maxi is just getting less meter-energie than other characters...!? It must be because of the poke damage he often does that won´t give you shit until the enemy just won´t block Maxi´s strings.
And spacing is imo still a problem for Maxi in this game. 22/88A is too slow, 6A(while being really good now after the patch) is still a high, 66A is a high, 66K is a high( still -2 :/), 66B is unbelievable unsafe(i never use that move until i guard burst the opponent) and 44B and 66B+K are a little slow too...
Maxi is mid-tier atm for me. His damage still "safes" him.
Saitoh
[10] Knight
That's more or less my point. Maxi is not trash by any mean, but the gap between him (or the others "balanced characters") and the Tops in this game is just way too much at the moment. That's the reason I think in the long run (let's say 1 year, that's approximatively how much we had to wait to see the Ivy reign in SC4) Maxi won't really be able to compete and be a real tournament-winner character.
And damn, we're not Tira or Raphael players. I suppose we should be grateful haha