Whiff Punishing with Siegfried

PyroZamfir

PyroZamfir

[09] Warrior
While I will state off the bat he is no sister or cervy or hilde oreven asta, what do you guys do to punish whiffs? Most characters have something around 70 dmg give or take (or with some of the aforementioned characters over 100). What can solidly punish a whiff and is fast enough. The feasible options seem to include 3, SCH K or agA. Nothing else seems fast enough to effectively punish whiffs with high damage they more so seem to put you in advantageous positions, but neither of those lead to really awesome damage.

This is just Siegfried brain food for the morning!
 
um most of those 70-100 health combos are CH and in that case sieg has those as well,

depending on the whiff I will either do B6 to poke the hell out of them or 3B if the whiff is that bad.
 
Sidestep whiff punisher is 3 (very nice), and WS if you end your step in FC

Distance whiff punish he kinda sucks. 22B is a very slow move so whiff punishing with it on reaction is rather impractical unless they are whiffing some pretty horrible recovery moves




The claim that most characters can get 70 damage for a whiff punish makes me laugh.
 
Guys, I like where this is going. My question is can asta get near 100 damage off of 22B4? Yes he can. Can cass whiff punish with 236: for good damage? Yes she can. Can hilde doom combo whiff punish? I thought that was the whole point of her game. And those don't require a counter hit just a launcher.

The aforementioned characters can deal good damage off of whiffs.

So you guys can give me flak for what I say, or you guys can just answer a legitimate quesiton and prove your knowledge. It's really simple.
 
Asta 22B4 is too slow to use as good whiff punisher because it is quite slow. You can only really use it on anticipation because of the speed problem. Reliable whiff punishers are ones you can use on reflex to punish most whiffs. Not only is Asta 22B4 too slow to use on reaction with any consistency, but it is also unsafe on guard. Since you can usually only use it on anticipation, the block safety suddenly becomes a factor.
 
PyroZamfir said:
Can cass whiff punish with 236: for good damage? Yes she can. Can hilde doom combo whiff punish? I thought that was the whole point of her game. And those don't require a counter hit just a launcher.
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Cass 236: combo barely is close to 70 (the scaling slaughters). Hilde's whiff punishment is scary with the doom combo, not only for damage but RO. Cervy's iGDR is still scary whiff punishment. Maxi has it nice with B+K jf for about 67 dmg. Those are the strongest i recall offhand. Can't give numbers though. But less than 5 characters get more than 70 so, that's hardly half of the cast ;)
Not that it really matters though, focus on Sieg heh heh
 
hotnikkelz said:
Cass 236: combo barely is close to 70 (the scaling slaughters). Hilde's whiff punishment is scary with the doom combo, not only for damage but RO. Cervy's iGDR is still scary whiff punishment. Maxi has it nice with B+K jf for about 67 dmg. Those are the strongest i recall offhand. Can't give numbers though. But less than 5 characters get more than 70 so, that's hardly half of the cast ;)
Not that it really matters though, focus on Sieg heh heh
Click to expand...


Not only is Cassandra's whiff-punishing 236:B combo kinda damaging, it can also RO like a MOFO. Can't she get four before having to end it? On some stages, this can be devastating. In other words, damage isn't too much of a factor here...

Asta's 22_88B4 is okay for whiff punishment, but like Tiamat said, it's slow. However, he can easily whiff punish with 66K, and if that 66K results in a wall-hit, then he can easily get 70 damage from it. Heck, even 2A_B+G can whiff punish with decent results, providing that the opponent is in a crouched position.

And some people are looking too far into Pyro's posts. I'm pretty sure he was just trying to say that other characters have better whiff-punishing options than Siegfried, which, in fact is true from what I've seen.

Anyway, I know nothing about Siegfried. I'd say 3B or JagA are the best bets though.
 
I really dont use sieg too much for making the opponent whiff and punish so I mainly just poke the hell out of them until I feel safe going into a crazy offensive, then once they find an opening, I go into defensive....space alittle, poke rinse and repeat.
 
I think Sieg is better than Astaroth for whiff punishing, just to put that out there. Only reliable whiff punish asta has is 66K and that doesn't even do 30 damage. I'll take Sieg 3 over that any day.

There are certainly better characters for whiff punishing, but sieg is still better than most I'd wager.
 
Maybe we could miss understanding the whiff concept form Pyro... by example on evade+whiff Asta can punish with 22_88B4... Mitsurugi on any whiff can hit with 66BB or 66B for long range... Hilda can do the insane combo... and many more characters can punish very hard any kind of whiff but Siegfried have to do 3B only for a silly damage... Talking about whiff, damage and more I came with a question: Why Mitsurugi lifts from mid range with 3B but Siegfried have to be close always to lift with 3B? I mean its totally illogical for Siegfried to lift from mid range, but also for Mitsurugi!

As answer to the main question, 3B its just fine, but if you are in safe poke mode try with B6.

-Stryker-
 
I figured I'd reuse this thread. Are there any good damage options for whiff punishment with Seig from crouch? Most of what I can get to work are little nibbles of health (relative to Seigfried's status quo), or require further mistakes from the opponent for the damage to rack up. The most damaging options I see are:

WS ~ B on NH
WS ~ kB ~ etc on CHit
FC A+G, 3
FC B+G, WT B,B
FC B+G, B+K, B
FC B+G, B+K, 4B+K, A+B
FC B+G, 11B (turn around 33B)

As far as I know, only 2 of those are guaranteed (the first and third) unless you land the CHit on WS B; others are techable or blockable. Are there any better options? Other than those, I feel like I'm wasting a whiff by throwing out NH FC A_K or NH WS A_K, but I also feel like I'm wasting a mix up opportunity. Would FC A+B, 6B+K, B_K_A+B be better overall, or would the first followed by a RSH mixup work better (chance of eating a WS there)?
 
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