Ezio is way better than Dampierre.
I would have never thought to see a non-Leixia player suggesting a buff for her on 8WR...- Leixa needs to be upped : I put her in mid (D being mid) but I think is she should be in E... She deals no damage at all, her only redeeming feature is her correct frame trap game and auto-evade game. She needs either to have more damage or more guard breaking situations.
For me tiers come from actual fights, besides how will you analyze spacing, sidestepping, etc sounds a bunch of nonsense to me / too many variables.How is this accurate at all? Algol(maybe), Astaroth, Pyrrha, Ivy, NM, Yoshi, Pat, Voldo, Sieg, Leix, Natsu, Maxi, Xiba, Aeon, Tira, ZWEI, Raphael. How are ANY OF THESE BETTER THAN PYRRHA OMEGA OR VIOLA? Also, you cant have only 2 tiers with 1 character in 1 tier and 23 characters in the other? What you are saying is that aside from Cervy, the whole cast is even. Wow. First of all, learn that tiers are based on data(Frames, range, damage, spacing, meter use, meter gain, RO game, mixup, wakeup, techtraps, throws, evasion, guard crush properties, and combo length(The ability to choose how long the combo you are going to do is to waste time to get a times up(Viola and Astaroth can do this amazingly))) not the player or else that would mean Talim and Zas were Top tier in 4(Kura and Omega). Also, 'most accurate list so far' NOT A CHANCE. A MUCH more accurate tier list(In order to) would be,
Top: aPat, Cervy, Mitsurugi, Omega, Viola, Algol.
Upper mid: Patroklos or Pyrrha, Astaroth or Ivy, Nightmare, Voldo.
Mid: Natsu, Hilde, Tira.
Lower mid: Aeon, Xiba, Leixia, Siegfried or Maxi, Ezio.
Bottom: Z.W.E.I., Raphael, Dampierre.
Maxi, Xiba, Hilde, Yoshimitsu and Tira are certainly better than Leixia at this point. Way more tools, options and damage reward. I don't think you really need to space out the tiers as much as you did, either.My list (updated) :
S: Algol*, Alpha Pat, Cervantes, Mitsurugi
A: Viola*, Patroklos, Omega
C: Nightmare, Astaroth, Yoshimitsu, Voldo, Ivy, Natsu, Pyrrha
D: Ezio, Leixa*, Maxi, Aeon, Xiba, Hilde, Tira
E: Siegfried*, ZWEI*, Dampierre
* = need to be patched asap.
- Algol need a real nerf : way too much damage overall, his 66B is just way too safe (-10/-11/-12 should be good because of pushback), Qi K/B at wake up should have removed tracking (especially Qi K) in order to make the A useful, FC 8B BE should be nerfed in air combos.
- Viola need a real nerf too : waaaaay too much damage, her 44A BE need to be nerfed, her 3B AAB 6A+B 2B+K BE needs to be removed, her BT throw need to be nerfed in order not to have 44A BE connecting.
- Leixa needs to be upped : I put her in mid (D being mid) but I think is she should be in E... She deals no damage at all, her only redeeming feature is her correct frame trap game and auto-evade game. She needs either to have more damage or more guard breaking situations.
- Siegfried needs to be upped too : please give him back 55/50 damage throws, and he needs more NH damage without BE.
- Raph well... just make him pre-patch version, everyone will be happy.
I think this game is kinda balanced too, but some tweaks are needed to make this game even better.
PS : If you want to patch Alpha Patroklos, I would reduce damage overall (reduce 2A BE and JF twister damage would reduce all his damage), make FC 3B:B to 1.03's 1B:B timing (1JF window), make FC 3B:B less damaging too but buff 6AA (-14 instead of -16 block), buff 44A (more range, this move is completely useless atm).
PPS : Hilde may be C tier and Ezio may be E tier. Dampierre tier is completely random.
EDIT : Thank you ChaosK
Omega has other options you didn't cover :I'm still unsure about Pyrrha and Omega. I'm pretty sure that Omega's best options are NS B, 66B, 4AB, 6k and DNS B. And that's all she really has. Pyrrha has 66B, 44B, 236B, 44A, 4AB, 1K, 4K, 6BK, 6K, 4B, WS K, 11AA and 66A. She won't get that close to Omega's damage, but she has a lot more opportunities to make it count.
I dunno which change you feel is "insane" but every thing I talked about is balanced IMO.That seems like an insane change.
I agree. I also think, the only way to punish viola here is to JG the second hit, right? If you step Viola is still safe, if you GI you waste meter (unless you have 150% for GI into CE) and she can still re-GI.And talking about 44A BE, this is the best move in the whole game. i20 blockstun, antistep, can be hit confirmed and delayed for 1/2 life combo. Talk about being broken... (yes I am aware you can GI the ball, and that you can step too, still it is a broken move).
Best thing to do is to GI. Not a waster of meter because if she does GI back she has less metter. Less meter for Viola = less damage. This is a good thing.I agree. I also think, the only way to punish viola here is to JG the second hit, right? If you step Viola is still safe, if you GI you waste meter (unless you have 150% for GI into CE) and she can still re-GI.
How was this move changed in the patch by the way?