Yoshimitsu Web Theater.

- Study your combos and learn to finish them.
- Learn to step. Don't rely on 4A+B. Much of what you're avoiding is steppable.
- 4B is linear to all hell and will be stepped. It's not abusable. Great for breaking gauge, but not something you want to abuse at all.

BIG TIP: : Go play off-line. Isn't there some comp. in your area?

- 6B is a shakable stun and anyone decent you play off-line will shake it. Don't based your game around it.
- 3AB on block is unsafe as hell. Definitely don't bother if your opponent starts punishing you.
 
Thanks for the strats Owari. I looked over what you told me about stepping and not relying on 4A+B. I ate everything I was used to getting by with 4A+B. I'll stick to 4A+B until proven wrong.

I already know that 6B is shakeable, I don't rely on it. That's why I showed that I was playing the computer on Edge Master. Cause they shake out of it EVERY time. I also know how PUNISHABLE 3AB is. I really have nobody here in the Houston area that plays. I asked everybody and nobody wants to play. Houston just had regionals and I didn't get a chance to go. 35bucks to play. No, thanks. The only 2 worth playing this game don't like it anymore cause there isn't anybody else around to play but me, but they are so tired of this game already.

I've got the combo's down, Just trying to master a:b+k. Only j/f worth using IMO.

Thanks for the help. I really fell in love with this game. I wish I had internet to play online for more comp. N e who. Next Tourney will be sat(25) and I will be competing. I'll post up vids there. Thanks for the help and to anybody else who would like to share tips/strats.

P.s. Work 4B in your game. It's got good properties. Just learn when to throw it. I mean come on. You have to learn when to throw out 3A,B right? Good luck. Peace.
 
B-boyTekken:

Edge Master difficulty is not a person. You can't play mind games with the computer. You can't outsmart the computer. You can't even finish DNK combos against the computer, because they just ukemi the majority of them. You'll eventually develop bad habits playing the computer. Even if you weren't going to play at regionals, you should've gone to see the competition, participate in post-tourney casuals, and meet other potential players in your area.

4A+B abuse only leads to you giving up life when you could have stepped and gotten the same results. Real people don't attack continuously and you may 4A+B when it's not necessary. In a tournament match, every bit of life count. You should learn each character's weak side and step accordingly. There are plenty of videos of people who step well and punish the hell out of whiffed attacks.

You did 66B, K. 66B combos into a:B+K, 1B_66B as well as DNK twice. That's why I said learn to finish your combos. Here's more help:
.

I never use 4B except in tech traps. Watch your vids again and watch how many times 4B gets stepped by the computer. Now imagine if that was a player stepping your 4B and punishing you properly for 50-70 damage every time they stepped it. Now imagine you're playing against Hilde and she steps you, then rings you out across the stage with the doom combo. Also, consider the fact that some characters have strong games from crouching (i.e. Cervy, Sets, etc.) and forcing them to crouch and putting yourself at a frame disadvantage actually helps them. 4B doesn't even break gauge until after the opponent has blocked it 10 times. There are plenty of other better things you could be doing instead of 4B spam.

As for 3AB, I hit confirm it. If the 3A doesn't CH, I don't finish it. Even then, I use 3AB sparingly. Even people who don't know unsafe it is can punish it with anything that's i21 or faster.

If you're serious about playing Yoshi, then you should consider practicing iMCF as well.
 
i'm gonna take the time to helpfully rag on ya but I'm gonna do it pretty in detail (cuz I'm trying to not study for a midterm..lol). anyway here goes...

Ivy Video:
@20 seconds it showed you were playing against the machine... in and of itself negating some of the usefulness of playing offline versus online. As hajime said you WILL get bad habits from doing this too often. AS already said there are certain moves that work against the machine that against someone that thinks...jsut SUCK. and there are others that the machine blocks EVERYTIME but are actually good for mind games. Now thats not to say it doesn't stop bad online habits at the same time at least. You can't mash out a billion lows and beat the machine.. but at the same time the machine doesn't punish correctly with a character. HELL. machine yoshi hits with imcf a lot of the time it will just back off o.O. If you can't get offline (which i recommend highly..much less frustrating than online as well...lol) then mix it up between on and offline as long as you can find 4-5 bars with ppl. That way you'll learn to play out of lag and learn what moves are "stupid" against a human opponent as well. Of course really it all depends on you definition of getting better. IF you jsut want to do better against the machine than that is one thing or do better online thats another. Doing better against humans offline is..yet again..another explanation entirely.

@32-41: 2k while at AMAZINGLY long range is just akward. maybe you were trying for ifc 3k or something and if u weren't...then I say try for ifc 3K. Then you use 6B to make up some distance between you and the machine. worse options, bet there are better ones as well. I won't knock it too much as its only been used once at this point. But after getting blocked you throw out 3A,B? Probably a bad choice. You are going to be punished with an AA or a BB if you do that too often. Or something even harder because if the opponent realizes you don't do ANYTHING after hitting with 3A,B then they won't fear it...at all. You had a ringout if you had done 44bB, a:B+K. But at the very least you should of had 6k...at the VERY least. icing on the mess-up cake? You used 66. While a decent move, it is only so if you DON'T hold the B and go into stance. ANYONE worth a cent would have had the time after sidestepping it as ivy did to make a collect call and order a pizza for after the match cuz that round whould have been DONE. RIGHT next to the edge. Opponent ringout for the win. Point is 1: don't EVER hold the B unless its guaranteed in a combo...its not worth it. You get better ringout and almost as much damage by just doing a:B+K afterwards. Point 2: is learn to watch where you are are the ring and be more cautious when near the edge. The last thing you want to do is be killing a round just to get rung out because you did a punishable move by the edge.

@44 or so Went into his REF stance when there was a rather large distance between you and the machine...and again...near the edge. Tricks are cute but just so you know, the REF stance is the equivalent to a laggy 1A to the machine. The machine is a TARD and has a tendancy to let you hitt it for free damage. USing it is a bad tendancy as anyone that knows even a little about playing against yoshi will know to block low because thats the only decent option with speed out of the stance. Go ahead and use it sometimes I guess, but def. not in that given situation with the distance between you and the machine and the edge.

@46 you are punished..ever so slightly..for your 3AB spamming. Half the cast would have rung you out RIGHT there. AT least you delayed it (trying to hit confirm??). If you do use this..DO try and hit confirm. And mix up finishing it/not finishing it when the first hit is blocked. THAT way you'll make ppl think if tehy should try and punish you after the first hit of it is blocked. Only then is the move even VIABLE really to just throw out there without just not caring about your own health bar.

@50ish good thing not holding 66B... but now like Hajime said..finsih your combos. But then comes a RANDOM 4A+B. RANDOM. Not completely useless, but in that situation it just wasn't necessary. Randomly throwing it out just means free damage (although tiny) for your opponent.

although you lost, the second round in a way was better than the first. Which is another issue with the machine. Winning tends o give ppl a positive re-enforcement to bad habits. Such as winning while using 4A+B. And then when you lose you just say BAAH..BAD ROUND. When in reality... You would have had enough health to win the round if you had NOT used 4A+B to ATTEMPT to dodge things (sometimes that NEVER came...). You need to work on learning the distance of yoshi's moves as well. You seem to throw things out that whiff a LOT.

@1:40ish again with the use of 4A+B. She was using a SLOOOOOOOOOWWWWW unblockable. Given her location you had about 1000000 options that included just interrupting her and ringing her out. Sidestepping ALLLL the way around for a back grab. Sidestepping and ringing her out...etc etc. But because you are so reliant on 4A+B you took damage for no reason. At least you finished with the ringout though (but again...it gives you positive feedback by winning which isn't a good thing always...).

@1:52ish never doorknocker out of the gate. NEVER. He doesn't have the distance on it to hit anyone from that far away and a human (not the machine) will just duck the last hits and punish you hard since you didn't even get them into any sort of block stun by connecting the first or second hit. They can even just take a tiny sidestep and punish or backstep and punish so you are screwing yourself by doing this to start a round. Its better to move back or do nothing than to start with a easily punishable move when whiffed. Then comes 4A+B spam ...which if you keep noticing... you aren't landing ANYTHING afterward... just getting a unsafe moved blocked. So not only are you taking 4A+B damage...you are taking blocked 3B damage. Which from the machine is about 40 damage.. but against a human would be more around 80/ringout chance. When you use 4A+B the best option is almost always a simple AA or BB unless the move they used was something REALLY slow (which then should have been sidestepped anyway....).

Then you get interrupted 3 times? while attempting 4B. The move is NOT very good. I don't care what your response to Hajime is...lol. Try it against actual ppl and then say if the move is worth using. If the machine is making it look like a bad option imagine what a human that doesn't punish mistakes with 2k would make it look... (although to be fair a human probably wouldn't have interrupted it that many times.... they would have sidestepped or just blocked..most likely blocked. The move isn't trash...it has its uses... but in no way is it abuseable. From what I'm seeing anytime you used 4B you could have been using imcf or BB or AA...and you should have been using one of those three instead)

@ the use of 6A. This move isn't that great unless you have a trick or a trap with it. That is...LEARN IMCF. imcf makes ppl fear the 6A as you can use imcf as a trap for their attempt to punish you. From IMCF you get a huge combo...AND its much faster than your 4B spam afterwards (again..horrible option to use right there...especially near the edge). Also..when Ivy does her move where she puts her whip on the ground... STEP. I think you are just being lazy with 4A+B honestly as a way to say you don't have to learn to step moves. Yes...stepping is harder to do...which is honestly the reason why in your seemingly sarcastic response to Hajime was that you were getting hit.... it takes time to get good at stepping. When ppl change what they are used to there is ALWAYS A downward drop for a little. Look at Tiger Woods. Greatest golfer in the world...decide to CHANGE his swing. What happens? He doesn't place first at EVERYTHING for a little while. But after a little while he ends up being a better golfer for having taken the time to change his swing. Did he NEED to change his swing? NO. Was it worth it? YES. Same goes for stepping versus 4A+B. Your gonna get frustrated fora little while. But over time you'll learn to not use 4A+B and to step instead and you'll be better for it.

@2:17
A human would TEND to go low to finish somebody off. With a machine you just DON'T KNOW. But playing a human and you have only that SMALLEST of life left. FEEL FREE to attempt to use 8B+K K to TJ their 2K or other low attempt and get a free ringout/60+ damage. If you are hit out of DGF then of well...you would have been blocking low anyway right? But if you DO hit... it can COMPLETELY change the round. I don't know how many times I've used DGF (or FLEA for that matter) to TJ someone for free damage. Try it. You'll like it.

Correct me if I'm wrong HAjime, but isn't 4B safe on block? So wouldn't that mean the 4A+B after a blocked 4B just seems like a huge waste? Otherwise I'm not even going to comment on the final round. You are obviously just attempting to get a CF against the machine so the whole round was worthless (except for Ivy punishing you decently with a command grab...THAT was fun..lol). Sadly it didn't teach you anything as the steppable spam continued. A human..btw...though I assume you realized this and hopefully wouldn't attempt this type of spam on a human regardless of there being a flashing red bar...would sidestep and then ring your shit OUT. But yes...waste of time round.

I'll be very brief on the next vid. for you. a lot of it is repeated from last vid anyway....

stupid use of 4A+B...don't hold 66B...stupid use of 4B... RANDOM doorknockers while not even in range to hit... taunt instead of a:B+K... need work on finishing combos...decent use of going into pogo after a bad 66B (bad meaning it didn't land)... then completely ruined by using 4A+B ...AGAIN..lol. And then a critical finish which ruins the whole point of playing yoshi and getting help on what to do because you WON'T be getting CF against humans with yoshi very often. In part cuz your 4B spam WILL be stepped and WILL be punished by a decent player after the second or third time you use it randomly.


Overall bro you have a LOT to work on. Like Hajime said maybe on of the first things you should do is take the time to learn imcf. It takes a learning curve to get it...but once you ahve it down you can't really UN-learn it. I hadn't played in 4 weeks and it took me about 10 minutes to get it back to a relatively consistent rate...and I play on the xbox analog stick of all things...bane of fighting games that piece of trash is..lol. The next thing you should do is pay your brother sister mother gf homeless guy or SOMEONE to kick you in the shin everytime you use 4A+B. Its better to NEVER use this move than to use it the way you've been using it. Its better to just BLOCK than to use it the way you've been using it. Go back to blocking and then slowing incorporate stepping into your game. Learn what moves you can step and learn how to play AGAINST other characters. Fighting games are 10% luck 30% skill and 60% knowing your opponent/opponent's character. You could be the best yoshi in the world and if you didn't know you could duck one of ivy's unblockables...you would be destroyed jsut by the person spamming that move. While good players don't "spam" moves... if they see something works on you because you fuck up and don't block it...they can will and should stick that move in your grill again and again until you give them a reason to stop.

Then I'd say go and read up the Tekken move section of this forum and learn to add tekken moves into your game. While not "necessary" the difference between a player that DOESN'T use tekken moves..one that uses them poorly and one that uses them WELL is HUGE. Next on the list of places to visit would be the combo section. Look up tech-traps and look up combos. Because you are not finishing combos. You are using a:b+k... and thats good. But he has so much more to offer than just that. And now that at this point you'll sorta know imcf you'll want to know good options off of it.

With all these things in tow you'll have a much better yoshi and you'll realize you have MUCH better options than 4B and using 4A+B to damage yourself. At which point you get to start learning anti-characer strats, learnign when to duck and punish, learning to use 33B in your moveset. Using 44bB in juggles and on the ground to combo into imcf combos.


Honestly... you are a world away from being "good" with yoshi... but I know you never claimed to be. That being said, take him back into the shop and get him tuned up. The way you play him is ...like putting the wrong battery into something. It might work for a while. But when you really need it to work its going to have short circuited. That is your yoshi. Its working and you are winning against the machine. But when you are going to need to win, like in a tourney, you currently don't have a yoshi that can win. Look through the forums a bunch and play ppl off (or online if its your only option) to learn how humans play against yoshi or with a given character. IF you are asking to get better than listen to these and Hajime's comment and take em to heart. Just because you don't have instant gratification from a new technique doesn't mean its a waste of time. It just means you need to stick with it and practice more.
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mmm...that was a long post... sorry Hajime for taking up space ...eek
 
Thank you Owari and Gator. I appreciate all of your insights. I will take the Yoshimobile to the shop and twurk that bad boy up. I will post up a vid later with the new mind set. In my defense, if I may, I use 4B and 4A+B as set ups. Just like when I launch them to a:BK, I follow up with 44A+B, if it lands, then I follow up with 9A+B, G. That set up takes alot of life. If the 44A+B whiffs, then Both players are safe to block. That's my mind set right now. I will take all of the advice and make it all work. I take all of your comments(rag) (lol) with respect. Thank you.
 
good to see someone embrace the criticism. But don't worry... there isn't anything to defend..lol. We are just telling you where to improve and what not. 4B CAN be used as a tech trap (a tech trap is when the opponent hits the ground and ukemi...gets up...the moment they touch the ground) but outside of a tech trap or as a tool while the opponent is being MAJORLY pressured you probably shouldn't throw it out. 4A+B CAN have a use. But instead of using the 4A+B... try to learn to use tekken moves. One of the tekken moves pretty much IS a 4A+B anyway except you take no damage from it. The thing is that 4A+B should really only be used as a last resort dodge of kinds or if you are REALLY REALLY scared of being back against the edge for some reason (and even then there are better options usually). 99% of the time the opponent is going to be able to block after 4A+B makes them whiff... so for the move to really "work" you both have to rely on it being sly and used to dodge correctly. If you throw it out 5 times a match it loses all of its potency.

You should be following up a a:B+K having landed in mid-air with one of 6 things really. First, win 66B. This is actually GUARANTEED against a large group of characters. But look to see if your opponent is teching it left. If they tech left once against it..chances are they wil tech left the next time too. Second, 1B (not charged into unblockable..justa quick tap of 1B), this catches even if they tech left or right...but can BE teched forward or backwards..so know which of these first two options to do to a certain character/person. Third is using 236B to tech trap. Its HUUUUUGE HUGE damage if they don't tech at all. And it catches rollers sometimes too. DON'T abuse this as its easy enough to get around. But if they aren't teching its free HUUUUUGE damage. Fourth option is to use 9A+B 4. This will catch them as a tech trap if they tech and don't know what to do after teching to avoid this..so it actually works a LOT. But again..don't abuse it especially if they avoid it once or twice...cuz it CAN get you hurt bad (as with 236B) if you miss. Fifth option is variations of 66(44)(33)A+B, but this is not guaranteed and only works if they tech late or don't tech at all. Still a useful option but its not guaranteed so...yea. Sixth option... is to just run up to them so you are RIGHT next to them for a throw or other chance to mix them up from close range. MAybe run up and throw out imcf. Doesn't matter.. point is you closed the gap.

One FINAL option..and this is the one you NEED and SHOULD do if they are near a ledge or a wall.. is DNK. If you hit with A:B+K in mid-air and they land right up against a wall or edge then DNK is guaranteed and it will get you a ringout. So just remember to ALWAYS use this if they land near the edge/wall.

Also...after landing a 9A+B G (2), you have At the very LEAST a guaranteed 2k and more depending on certain circumstances.
 
GATOR said:
Also...after landing a 9A+B G (2), you have At the very LEAST a guaranteed 2k and more depending on certain circumstances.
Click to expand...

One comment here.

9A+B2, 66A+B is a tech trap.
9A+B2, 66B is a combo.
9A+B2, DNK, DNK is guaranteed on Raphael, Taki, Zasalamel, Tira, Lizardman, Algol, and Astaroth. Sometimes the second DNK will not pick up Lizardman.
 
Real quick and cause i'm still a noob. DNK=???
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GATOR said:
good to see someone embrace the criticism. But don't worry... there isn't anything to defend..lol. We are just telling you where to improve and what not.
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Anything to make my friends look stupid! Since this is there game and Tekken is mine.

PS. I have my internet up and will be playing tonight maybe or something, please send me a pm with a name so that I can mirror match some of the best yoshi's for hands on experience. Peace.
 
DNK = Doorknocker.

Hajime hasn't played SC online in LONG while and I haven't played in about a month..lol...but uhh... zombiebear666 is someone you could try and play. He's a nice guy and a pretty good yoshi ta-boot. And he seems to be on ALL the time too..lol. So you could always try him. Otherwise I'm not current on who still even plays this game so yea..lol. But if u have a miracle and see me on SC4 and not SF4 then feel free to PM me also I guess. I don't know how many ppl I've taught yoshi or cervy or some other character to (although yoshi/cervy are my only REAL main...)

that being if you play xbox. I've NO idea who to play on PSN..lol.
 
We finally got our lazy selves to record our casual matches and in good quality too!
I hope this gets regular (bet you hope as well ^_^)
We concentrated to create more "fun" than practical vids like the ones HK community does, but anyway feedback and questions are welcome and appreciated.

Here are few I like the most, the rest (a lot) of the matches recorded that day can be found on our youtube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/markikktnx

 
Belial said:
We finally got our lazy selves to record our casual matches and in good quality too!
I hope this gets regular (bet you hope as well ^_^)
We concentrated to create more "fun" than practical vids like the ones HK community does, but anyway feedback and questions are welcome and appreciated.

Here are few I like the most, the rest (a lot) of the matches recorded that day can be found on our youtube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/markikktnx

Click to expand...

Im not sure how much to critique your play since these are casual matches but here goes;

I have never been a fan of 4B as a poke. Post GI it is okay but there are better options: 4KB, 1K, 33B, etc.

You used way, way too much 214A. That Mitsu spammed 6B so maybe it was anticipation?

No IFP moves at all. There were so many times you could have thrown a 4 series or his Unblockable spinning punch. Im looking at the end of the first match in particular. Would have been a dope way to end it.

Other than that look for setups on your iMCF. You can do it very well but it lacked placement. I bait with 2A+B on block, BB, 6A, 22_88K, 3K on hit etc.

I see much promise in your game :D Keep it up!
 
Thank you for your feedback SCfreak.
4B is probably a matter of player style. OnYourMark uses it very effectively and its very hard to deal with, while he uses plenty of 33B and 4KB too.

Mitsu 6B is a super bad move, I dont use it at all. you probably meant something else?
OnYourMark uses all basic set ups for iMCF including the ones you mentioned, but it's called "basic" for reason - its easy to anticipate and punish for mitsu - 66K jumps over and 6B+K(MST) goes right through to punish for 71 see the end of vid 1 (2A block - MCF countered by MST) or start of vid 2 (4B iMCF countered by MST). 214A is used to counter MST and 66K evades, it can be dealt in turn but its my mistake I didnt. Another place where he loves to use 214A is post 2KB Just Ukemi, it evades most basic followups like 66K or 3B if mitsu player fails to react to JU.

by IFP you refer to tekken moves? yes he uses it but for some reason didnt in this particular set of games.
 
i think he meant "to do damage having anticipated the move" ... he didn't REALLY mean punish.. just didn't know what to call it..lol
 
yes, thank you GATOR. If I anticipate manji I can punish it with MST everytime, Yoshi cant block MST 6B if 6B+K goes under MCF, which happens if Mitsu go into mst at an advantage or slight disadvantage. Thats a very big advantage mitsu has in this matchup.
 
OnYourMark could make his iMCF game stronger by RCCing it off crouching moves. 2A, RCC iMCF, 2K rCC iMCF, etc. Doing that forces the opponent to react to turtle or react to avoid iMCF. Then it becomes an okay mind game. =)

He means Iron First Possession (4A+K). There were certain times when OnYourMark could' have gotten out Kazuya's UB or disrupted your offense with electric fists.
 
ah i see, i was confused cuz you said it's EASY to do that and i was like wha. iMCF hit more times than you anticipated it :/
I think that adv though, is not that big IF, the Yoshi didn't WHORE iMCF like he did. His poking game left much to be desired honestly.
Hardly any 2K, 3K, 6A, AA, 2A, 6B. All very useful attacks for Yoshi, and all almost as fast as Mitsu's AA (except 6B). I think he stretched trying to fish for iMCF CH too far, neglecting his basics and adding a level of predictability in his game. Hardly any throw attempts too (yoshi struggles to do damage outside of throws and CH), and failed too much at thwarting RLC B. That owned him a bit. Still enjoyable vids. Need much more vids to see what other advice i can give to the Yoshi though.
 
lol.. i was gonna say the same thing though hotnikkelz. Its kinda like people saying they'll tj imcf or impact it... sure they do it sometimes.. but they get hit by it a LOT more often. as a yoshi player.. I'll take that advantage in numbers especially in a small ringout happy stage like the one being played.

he was probably poking a bit too much with imcf...which really isn't a poke...at all. Too many people have the impression it seems that imcf is the end all be all move of yoshi and that you can LITERALLY spam it. lol.

good matches... the yoshi seemed to be missing earslicer a lot at times :-/ .
 
thanks a lot for your feedback, I agree with most of what you wrote. I will relay your suggestions to OyM. Hopefully we will record another vids next week and will try invite other players in the future.

edit: Hotnikkelz:
Need much more vids to see what other advice i can give to the Yoshi though.
Click to expand...
There are ALOT of Mitsu/Yoshi vids on our youtube channel!
 
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